With pleasure, Thorsten, with pleasure. And anyway, what's one beer, we need at least three to just get going ... not to mention how fine that stuff ripples down my throat.
True, but - aha!!! - I compensated for that by assuming a criminally hard load to drive. If such a load actually existed in form of a real life loudspaker, I think it would soon achieve the dubious glory of being an amp killer. That's actually worse than either the notorious Apogee, or that Infinity Refence from the early 80-ies, which could only be driven by Levinson and Krell amps.
You're right in saying it's a rule of thumb generally, a quick'n'dirty way to work out your apporximate needs on the fly.
Looks like your Economics degree gave you good insight into Ergonomics: rhythmic rows look nice!
Yes, you are right about passing school subjects. If you have no passion to what you learn you will never be an Artist.
Observe the wiring RIPPLE melodically.
My late dad said that, and he was right. Those who just study to pass exams never go beyond being technically educated clerks, effectively.
Passion is what drives us all on towards perfection, a theoretical ideal we know we will never reach, but are drawn to it like moths towards a light.
DVV, if you calculate by ripple voltages you may allow, you can forget about Rules of Dumb and Joules. Joules are needed when you want significant bursts from weak transformer. What is "significant" and "weak" is beyond Rules of Dumb, it needs to be calculated according to limitations of particular design.
Would 200,000uf/ch in the jc-1 hurt ...?
They make 2 types industrial or the audio, i cannot find the audio brand here in the US. who sells them in the EU..?
Wave is an dedicated toob guy in the forums only, SS @ home and inside ..
TL is the tooob only guy , unlike Wave he hasn't had time to appreciate SS stuff , as yet ... Interesting , my current field .....
So, my outward appearing standard Yugo ripples from 0 to 62 mph (0-100 km/h) in 6.8 seconds, causing a massive headache to neighboring owners of Audi, BMW, MB and so forth owners. The look on their (дурак) faces in my rear view mirror is priceless!
Yes ...a frighting thought in an Yugo ...
Porsche brakes i hope.... 
my headphone amps, both as wholly bipolar, or with FETs in the input stages and MOSFETs for outputs. Both fully are fully complemetary. Shown is the MOSFET version, those are custom 50 VA transformers, and the power supply is a shunt type reguated power supply. The caps are Fisher & Tausche 4,700 uF/40V types, alternatives are Panasonic types of same specs.
Wayne would love it, headphone amps using 50W complementary power devices for the bipolar (MJE 15030/15031), or 75W for the MOSFET version (IRF 510/9510).
The audio type ..... ? i would modify and put larger transformers , 100va min /ch ....
Is 240,000 uf/ch too much for an constant voltage load tolerant amplifier .....
Hi,
So, we can illustrate that "audiophile capacitors" that sell at a premium have much lower microphonics than generica and lower distortion (has been measured repeatedly including by D.Self) yet the automatic reaction by a certain kind of believer is to label "audiophile capacitors" automatically, without thinking as "Snakeoil".
That is patently untrue.
All mains powered equipment is subject to leakage from the mains into chassis and signal ground. Interconnect several pieces of mains powered gear and you will find that chassis potentials differ, after the interconnection currents will flow to equalise the chassis potentials.
The currents will flow though mains cable (earth) and interconnects (ground). Any currents flowing in the interconnects will produce a noise voltage that appears in series with the signal. A very low impedance earth connection on the mains cable can lower this noise voltage by 20dB or more...
The bench test will not reveal these noises because it eliminates their sources quite carefully and only tests a single device, testing a system is possible, but I am unaware of any publication on the subject and even worse, I have not even hear this mentioned.
It helps to have spend ages sitting on a crummy chair in "Testing & Measuring" classes hearing your professor intone "Wer Misst Misst Mist" (who measures measures garbage - literally in german manure) instead of drinking and chasing girls.
Just because a particular measurement does not show a significant result does not mean that the suspected effect does not exist, often it simply means the conditions under which it exists where not re-created.
The opposite is also often observed.
To come back to mains cables, yes, on a system level different mains cables may produce very different levels of noisefloor and these differences may indeed result in audible effects, long before someone notices hum or buzz.
To insist that they cannot do that reveals either a brutal ignorance of even basic electrics (as only Lentz, Coulomb, Kirchhoff and Ohm are needed to illustrate what is really going on) or equally brutal mental blinders that prevent the perception of a really obvious issue coupled with a religious fervour to impose the same blinders on all others, or at least die fighting.
In fact, I have serious problems to allow that anyone who takes the "Mains cables cannot make difference" position ever attended and successfully passed a first year EE course (as everything involved is SO basic). However I had exactly that demonstrated to me so many times, I have generally given up to try to make such people understand and constantly wonder what they teach in universities these days...
Ciao T
So, we can illustrate that "audiophile capacitors" that sell at a premium have much lower microphonics than generica and lower distortion (has been measured repeatedly including by D.Self) yet the automatic reaction by a certain kind of believer is to label "audiophile capacitors" automatically, without thinking as "Snakeoil".
That is patently untrue.
All mains powered equipment is subject to leakage from the mains into chassis and signal ground. Interconnect several pieces of mains powered gear and you will find that chassis potentials differ, after the interconnection currents will flow to equalise the chassis potentials.
The currents will flow though mains cable (earth) and interconnects (ground). Any currents flowing in the interconnects will produce a noise voltage that appears in series with the signal. A very low impedance earth connection on the mains cable can lower this noise voltage by 20dB or more...
The bench test will not reveal these noises because it eliminates their sources quite carefully and only tests a single device, testing a system is possible, but I am unaware of any publication on the subject and even worse, I have not even hear this mentioned.
It helps to have spend ages sitting on a crummy chair in "Testing & Measuring" classes hearing your professor intone "Wer Misst Misst Mist" (who measures measures garbage - literally in german manure) instead of drinking and chasing girls.
Just because a particular measurement does not show a significant result does not mean that the suspected effect does not exist, often it simply means the conditions under which it exists where not re-created.
The opposite is also often observed.
To come back to mains cables, yes, on a system level different mains cables may produce very different levels of noisefloor and these differences may indeed result in audible effects, long before someone notices hum or buzz.
To insist that they cannot do that reveals either a brutal ignorance of even basic electrics (as only Lentz, Coulomb, Kirchhoff and Ohm are needed to illustrate what is really going on) or equally brutal mental blinders that prevent the perception of a really obvious issue coupled with a religious fervour to impose the same blinders on all others, or at least die fighting.
In fact, I have serious problems to allow that anyone who takes the "Mains cables cannot make difference" position ever attended and successfully passed a first year EE course (as everything involved is SO basic). However I had exactly that demonstrated to me so many times, I have generally given up to try to make such people understand and constantly wonder what they teach in universities these days...
Ciao T
Hi,
Funny enough, I designed (and build) probably at least as many Solid State Amp's, Pre's, mixing desks and related miscellanea (arguably mostly studio/pro stuff and mostly 80's and into the early 90's) as I did tube stuff.
Even now I get plenty of Solid State stuff and have currently more solid state amp's in the house than tube Amp's. I had a phase in the early 90's where I was running all solid state, using SLC Batteries to power everything including the poweramp (it was running on a stack of 12pcs 6V/12AH ones)...
But the Amp in my system right now uses tubes. And I prefer to listen to music using it, compared to all the Solid State Gear, which generally makes poor doorstops and catches dust.
To say that I don't appreciate SS stuff is like saying I don't appreciate Lucie Liu or Drew Barrymore and only notice Cameron Diaz.
But if I could only take one of Charlies Angels home it would be Cameron Diaz... If I had all three at home all the time, who knows, who I'd like to spend the most time with. But likely again I'd appreciate one of the ladies by far more than the others.
If solid state stuff floats your boat, go for it. If tubes float your boat, go for it.
As Slartibartfast used to say:
"Perhaps I'm old and tired, but I think that the chances of finding out what's actually going on are so absurdly remote that the only thing to do is to say, 'Hang the sense of it' and keep yourself busy. I'd much rather be happy than right any day."
Ciao T
Wave is an dedicated toob guy in the forums only, SS @ home and inside ..
Funny enough, I designed (and build) probably at least as many Solid State Amp's, Pre's, mixing desks and related miscellanea (arguably mostly studio/pro stuff and mostly 80's and into the early 90's) as I did tube stuff.
Even now I get plenty of Solid State stuff and have currently more solid state amp's in the house than tube Amp's. I had a phase in the early 90's where I was running all solid state, using SLC Batteries to power everything including the poweramp (it was running on a stack of 12pcs 6V/12AH ones)...
But the Amp in my system right now uses tubes. And I prefer to listen to music using it, compared to all the Solid State Gear, which generally makes poor doorstops and catches dust.
To say that I don't appreciate SS stuff is like saying I don't appreciate Lucie Liu or Drew Barrymore and only notice Cameron Diaz.
But if I could only take one of Charlies Angels home it would be Cameron Diaz... If I had all three at home all the time, who knows, who I'd like to spend the most time with. But likely again I'd appreciate one of the ladies by far more than the others.
If solid state stuff floats your boat, go for it. If tubes float your boat, go for it.
As Slartibartfast used to say:
"Perhaps I'm old and tired, but I think that the chances of finding out what's actually going on are so absurdly remote that the only thing to do is to say, 'Hang the sense of it' and keep yourself busy. I'd much rather be happy than right any day."
Ciao T
Wave is an dedicated toob guy in the forums only, SS @ home and inside ..
Stop spreading disinformation, please. I am dediacted to optimal design, and don't care what it uses: tubes, transistors, etc... If combination of tubes and transistors allow me to get desired result optimally, I go for it. If I use Denon for home thearet, that means I can't afford to have own amp at home. Time to time I myself and my family enjoy to use prototypes of amps I design, until they gone to somebody who need them and is ready to pay money. I need money for R/D, and have to work for other company as Systems/Network engineer. However, I would be more than happy to design for manufacturing, but it is not a good time for such business to be profitable.
I don't know, ask John.
Try http://www.buerklin.de , that's where I usually get them.
Yes ...a frighting thought in an Yugo ...
Well, not quite, Porsche still beats me by about 1 m (app. 3.3 ft) in a 100-0 km/h full power brake. But, their ceramic brake system as an add-on option costs more than my entire car. My calipers and discs are made by TRW.
As a solace, I beat most production cars by at least that 1 m, and remember, I have a total mass of about one half of a production car, or less. The car itself weighs in at just 820 kg (app. 1,80g lbs) with a 3/4 full fuel tank. This low, low mass is what helps a lot in making it so nimble.
Although the racing type current (rather than voltage) controlled fuel injection helps a LOT ...
Don't see the point. Rest assured, it's been tried. For God's sake, Wayne, on those transformers it actually powered a pair of 82 dB/1W/1m loudspeakers in a room reasonably loudly, and was limited mostly by voltage rather than current ...
I'm all for healthy safety margins of at least 50%, but this is no competition who's going to overkill more.
Is 240,000 uf/ch too much for an constant voltage load tolerant amplifier .....
Your delayed turn-on device would be as big as the amp itself.
Oh boy, I seem to have seen THAT movie ...
There's always somebody who will nick what you made before you can blink.
Frankly, yes, I am. In 10 years, not one ever came loose.
It may not be obvious from the picture, but those are professional Schuko sockets, rated at 25A continuous, rather than your garden variety which is rated at 16 A continuous.
They also have spring loaded covers, just in case.
BTW, wiring is by van den Hul CS-7.
A couple of things the books don't exactly spell out, do I have the correct idea?
If the dominant pole rolls off such that you have dropped by more than the closed loop gain before you reach the next pole, the amplifier will be inherently stable. plus or minus other parastatic issues. If this is basically correct, I can see how some more modern parts (Cob 1/5 that of the originals) would potentially simplify the various problems. Again, if the secondary nodes are high enough, is there good reason to move the dominant pole as high as it can stand it? 30K? 40K?
I also am gathering that is is better to reduce each stage distortion by better design even if giving up more gain than to save the gain and beat it to submission with more global feedback. In other words, 3dB worth of degeneration will probably wind up better than 3dB more global feedback; within reason.
Don't have everything approximated yet. I have not found how to estimate the impedance if a current mirror. I am about half way through.
I was reviewing all my notes from this thread. One comment mentioned worry that some of the various protection diodes could see over their rated 100V PIV under high loads. I think not. The rails collapse like a wet noodle to the mid 40's, so under heavy load, the difference would be more like 90V, not 110. Not necessary a smart design, but it gets away with it.
I have seen more than one comment that Mr. Leach has stated constant current sources measure well but sound bad. I have not found his reference. ( But a lot of his lecture notes, sweet) Any views? Could this have been in the context of regulated rails? Out of contecx statements are always dangerous.
If the dominant pole rolls off such that you have dropped by more than the closed loop gain before you reach the next pole, the amplifier will be inherently stable. plus or minus other parastatic issues. If this is basically correct, I can see how some more modern parts (Cob 1/5 that of the originals) would potentially simplify the various problems. Again, if the secondary nodes are high enough, is there good reason to move the dominant pole as high as it can stand it? 30K? 40K?
I also am gathering that is is better to reduce each stage distortion by better design even if giving up more gain than to save the gain and beat it to submission with more global feedback. In other words, 3dB worth of degeneration will probably wind up better than 3dB more global feedback; within reason.
Don't have everything approximated yet. I have not found how to estimate the impedance if a current mirror. I am about half way through.
I was reviewing all my notes from this thread. One comment mentioned worry that some of the various protection diodes could see over their rated 100V PIV under high loads. I think not. The rails collapse like a wet noodle to the mid 40's, so under heavy load, the difference would be more like 90V, not 110. Not necessary a smart design, but it gets away with it.
I have seen more than one comment that Mr. Leach has stated constant current sources measure well but sound bad. I have not found his reference. ( But a lot of his lecture notes, sweet) Any views? Could this have been in the context of regulated rails? Out of contecx statements are always dangerous.
It can seriously hurt the rectifier bridge(s) as well as switching
off you main ...
For a phone amp a single 30VA toroid is already overkill....
You seem to oversize everything...
Funny that i myself downgraded my mosfet amp toroid
from a 560VA/ 2x 45V AC to a 120VA/ 2x16V AC toroid.
The old german hifi norm DIN 45500 was really spot on with
its 2 X 12 W RMS requirement...
Once NFB is applied poles will be splitted , that is , the dominant
pole should in principle move to a way higher frequency.
As for increasing degeneration , it s not always a good thing.
An input stage will to some extent gain linearity while what
is called the VAS stage will not always yield a better linearity,
and this can be quite the contrary in many cases when considering
the influence on the whole amplifier distorsions caracteristics.
Lighten up Wave .....
Where's the dis-information ... i said you use SS @ home ( you do ) .toobs in the forum ( you do ) and anyway, this
represent ..this. Your sense of humor needs more feedback..............
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