Hahaha thanks - but really I'm bowing towards Mooly, Jaycee and yourself - actually all this adventure is YOUR fault - it was your thread over at Audio Karma that made me want to own one of these amps haha!
Hahaha thanks - but really I'm bowing towards Mooly, Jaycee and yourself - actually all this adventure is YOUR fault - it was your thread over at Audio Karma that made me want to own one of these amps haha!
Oops!
I blame it on Axel at The Vintage Knob for his amazing spread on this amp!I'm happy knowing that there's one more working unit out there now!
That's great news John... what a result eh ! And it's not just another DIY success story, you should be pretty proud too Well done.
I would just advise to keep a watch (or feel!) to make sure nothings running too hot during the first few hours and just.... well enjoy.
(The 99 volts won't change as the mains goes up and down by the way)
Well done. I would just advise to keep a watch (or feel!) to make sure nothings running too hot during the first few hours and just.... well enjoy.
(The 99 volts won't change as the mains goes up and down by the way)
That's great news John... what a result eh ! And it's not just another DIY success story, you should be pretty proud too
I would just advise to keep a watch (or feel!) to make sure nothings running too hot during the first few hours and just.... well enjoy.
(The 99 volts won't change as the mains goes up and down by the way)
Thanks Mooly I'm chuffed to bits here! Put the SMPS into it's housing, put that into the amp. Connected it all up and it's making music at long last
Sounds pretty darn good considering all other caps within the amp are 30+ years old (that's my next adventure to recap the rest of the amp when I can afford it
). I just wanted to get that SMPS working again first, and most importantly get ALL the PSU caps replaced and that section working safely.That left VU meter is still pretty much dead so next job is to sort that out. Probably just the caps. Putting the multimeter on the terminals makes it move alright so I think it's basically OK.
Thanks ever so much for all your help Mooly this would have been a 'dead in the water' project if it wasn't for all your tireless help, along with Jaycee. Indepted to the both of you!
Right off to listen to some more music at moderate levels (going to see how it runs for the next day or so before cranking it up!).
Ahhhh I love it when a plan comes together!
Cheers fellas! Will update with more pics later/tomorrow.- John
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Oops!
I'm happy knowing that there's one more working unit out there now!
Hahaha yes that page also wetted my appetite for owning one too! still can't believe it's working at last!!!
Have you recapped yours completely now?
I've left the front end original--there's just no time what with school and all! I use a Sony TA-E1000ESD for the pre and pipe it to the amp section of the TA-F6B--this setup lets me use digital sources easier, and it has a remote control!
That Sony pre was another piece that I searched a long time for, until I found a mis-typed auction title and stole it, plus on top of that an ex split the cost with me (shipping was pricey on that piece) as a birthday present.
I've been listening to my restored Scott 222C lately (thread of just photos here and full restoration thread here), though. Rolling tubes is getting addictive...
I've been listening to my restored Scott 222C lately (thread of just photos here and full restoration thread here), though. Rolling tubes is getting addictive...
Wow thats a VERY impressive restoration - bet you're extremely happy with that! How's it sound? I still have a pair of Quad IIs and a Quad 22 to restore sometime this year. Other than that as far as tubes are concerned I scratch-built a Dynaco ST-70 which I really enjoyed and it sounded amazing with the VTA driver board. In the end though I have to say I prefer the conveniance of solid-state these days, though I do sometimes miss the valve sound! I love the feeling of taking something in rough condition and/or not working and bringing it back from the dead!
How hot does your SMPS housing on the Sony get? Mine's fairly hot to the touch now after running for over an hour. I assume this is normal behavoir?
- John
The amp does get toasty. I'm not running it right now because the Scott is on top of it, blocking the vents. Another think I like about my pre is that there are two 'main' outputs, so I have one going to the Sony amp and the other into the Scott
I just got a new stand for my gear this past summer... time for another upgrade?
I just got a new stand for my gear this past summer... time for another upgrade?
The amp does get toasty. I'm not running it right now because the Scott is on top of it, blocking the vents. Another think I like about my pre is that there are two 'main' outputs, so I have one going to the Sony amp and the other into the Scott
I just got a new stand for my gear this past summer... time for another upgrade?
Haha can an audiophile EVER have enough gear??!?
Well the amp is still thankfully working this morning. Gave it quite a work out last night and was playing music through headphones until gone 2am. My phones (Grado SR-80 and also a pair of Audio-Technica ATH-AD700) are 32-ohms sensitivity so go loud way too quickly with this amp. Fortunately the mute control on the Sony cuts volume by 20db, so that allows me to listen with a bit more range on the volume control.
Very impressed with the sound indeed. Extremely even-handed with whatever genre you throw at it, but not boring or clinical sounding at all. Tremendous detail/insight into the recording. Extremely good with vocals - very valve-like and no solid-state 'grain' that I can hear. The only negative is there's not much in the way of bass (at the moment). From other vintage amps I have recapped in the past that's usually been down to tired caps that need replacing. Always seems to affect the bass the most. So far I have only replaced caps in the SMPS and the PSU board, so the caps in the rest of the amp will be my next stage of this project, starting with the power-amp section/PCB. The existing caps are 30+ years old now, plus the unit hasn't been working since 2005!
Still incredibly happy that it's working at last
- John
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Yeah undoubtedly there are caps in the signal and feedback paths that have had it and are blocking frequencies as a result. Also a good opportunity to get some polyester coupling caps in there - the Wima MKS2 series work quite well, aren't too pricey, and have a 5mm lead pitch, and Farnell have em
I'd be interested to know if you hear any difference between the amp when it was running on the linear suppply, and now as it's running on the SMPS. Generally SMPS's are frowned on in hifi audio because of all the rubbish they put out - yet Sony did it, and it seems to sound good... and SMPS tech has moved on a LOT since then!
I'd be interested to know if you hear any difference between the amp when it was running on the linear suppply, and now as it's running on the SMPS. Generally SMPS's are frowned on in hifi audio because of all the rubbish they put out - yet Sony did it, and it seems to sound good... and SMPS tech has moved on a LOT since then!
Yeah undoubtedly there are caps in the signal and feedback paths that have had it and are blocking frequencies as a result. Also a good opportunity to get some polyester coupling caps in there - the Wima MKS2 series work quite well, aren't too pricey, and have a 5mm lead pitch, and Farnell have em
I'd be interested to know if you hear any difference between the amp when it was running on the linear suppply, and now as it's running on the SMPS. Generally SMPS's are frowned on in hifi audio because of all the rubbish they put out - yet Sony did it, and it seems to sound good... and SMPS tech has moved on a LOT since then!
You must have read my mind - it's exactly the MKS2 which I'm going to use to replace the 'back to back' electrolytics which are in the signal path (which only occurs in the pre-section, at least from what I can see!). I have someone on the Pink Fish Media forum who may have some I can buy, otherwise I'll use Farnell. Ideally I'd like to use a decent film cap for those, but there just isn't the space on the PCBs, and I don't want to end up with a flying-lead bodge-job special
EDIT: if anyone can see any electroytics in the signal path of the power-amp section I'd be grateful if you could let me know. I think it's just the pre-amp/control/EQ sections that have any electrolytics in the signal path from looking at the service manual.
From my memory of using the linear PSU with this amp, I'd say the sound perhaps was a little more 'punchy' (even though it was putting out less volts than ideal for this amp). However with the SMPS it sounds more 'panoramic' and even-handed with music. Imaging is superb! Hard to describe haha! Seems in this instance, the SMPS was well designed as I cannot hear any sonic nasties... unless they reveal themselves after that recap (eeek!).
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CPC also have them - they are after all the small order division of Farnell effectively! Although I imagine if you do a full recap, youll meet Farnell's minimum order charge.
I think linear supplies do have the edge on instantaneous current delivery, one of the advantages of being simple and using large capacitors for energy storage... but it's interesting there's no sound of any nastiness even from a 70s SMPS. I'd imagine modern SMPS tech could do a lot more.
I think linear supplies do have the edge on instantaneous current delivery, one of the advantages of being simple and using large capacitors for energy storage... but it's interesting there's no sound of any nastiness even from a 70s SMPS. I'd imagine modern SMPS tech could do a lot more.
I guess it proves that not all technology is inherently bad if implemented correctly. As I understand it the TA-F6B was the second-to-the-top of the flagship integrated-amp range back in 1978, with the TA-F7B at the top of the heap with it's Sony V-fets. I think it was also the first to have the 'Pulse Linear Power Supply' so Sony had something to prove...
I'm happy with it's base performance however. Looking forward to hearing it fully cap'd up and bias/DC conditions then reset.
It will always be a product of its time, and I wouldn't want to change that. The only slight 'mod' I'll be making is to replace those back-to-back signal path electros with film caps. I can live with that one
Yep it's described as a DC amp on the Vintage Knob page:
Sony TA-F6B on TVK
The 'back-to-back' (creating a non-polar unit. Guess Sony were aware of getting the best out of electrolytics for signal path use even in 1978!) signal-path electrolytics are in the control/EQ sections only.
I might look into that at some point Mooly, but I'd prefer to keep it as designed (at least for this model) to be honest. Most important next stage is for me to replace all the remaining electrolytic caps (about 58 to go!!!). Then get those VU meters recalibrated and the left needle freed up (it seems to stick in the same position even after trying the 'multimeter' diode 'trick' on it).
Still it really doesn't sound at all bad as it is now
It's got the same kind of even-handed sound as my GB150D amp (which I sadly had to sell recently for fundage!) which is still the best amp I've yet heard.
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You'll have better luck getting an answer to this by posting your own thread on this subject - this thread is purely for the Sony TA-F6B amplifier. I think those transistors you mention are obsolete, but I'm sure somebody on here can help you find necessary substitutes
- John
Regarding the slight bass lightness... it suddenly occured to muggins here that I was listening through my old test speakers still, which were plonked atop my Mission M72s (themselves still a modest speaker by many people's standards here, but I like 'em).
Doh!
Wired up my M72s and - bass!
Whew - it'll still benefit from a total recap of course, but it sounds FAR better balanced now. Amazing the difference that made haha! Bass is just two notches above 'flat' on the EQ control now and it has plenty of full-bodied 'kick'. Very nice! Prior to that I had to have it up to the top setting!
Doh!
Wired up my M72s and - bass!
Whew - it'll still benefit from a total recap of course, but it sounds FAR better balanced now. Amazing the difference that made haha! Bass is just two notches above 'flat' on the EQ control now and it has plenty of full-bodied 'kick'. Very nice! Prior to that I had to have it up to the top setting!
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