PLASTICS ETC.
Guys,
Some designers take the influence of plastics on the sound of the audio system very seriously.
As Edouard pointed,out Japanese audiophiles experimented with static charges of plastics 25 years ago already.
Jean Hirga of L'Audiophile" fame being half French half Japanese acted as a go-between for these and many other experiments in French speaking Europe.
Controlling and damping vibrations in materials is another topic entirely.
What is important here is the influence of a statically charged component interacting with the magnetic field and charge it is transmitting.
Remember thirty years ago nobody believed in the sonic differences of so called "passive" components.
A resistor is a resistor is a resistor ad infinitum.
Well that turned out to be not the case (measurably even).
I recall Bernhard talking about the WBT plugs he once had that came at first with a slightly magnetic collet chuck.He heard a difference in sound quality,and so did many others.
The same can be applied to plastics.
Try for example the difference in a cable with enamelled or kapton lacquer insulation and one with a plastic based insulation,you will be surpised.
Then there's also the issue of multistrand versus solid core.
Diodic effects,Peltier effects and so on.
Try for a start to simply replace all those of the shelf power cords in your system with solid core you made up yourself.
You can thank me later.
Some of these topics are bordering on quantum physics,it's not because it is harder to understand that it ain't there.
I urge you all non-believers to check out the work done by folk at e.g. Jena Labs,Pearl and some others.
Cryogenics for instance is nothing more than an extension of the thinking that went into the creation of long crystal OFC cables.
And if you really want to see the work of a true believer check this site out:
www.audio-consulting.ch/tweak.htm
All I'm saying is try it out for yourselves.
The more revealing your system is the more you'll notice the differences.
Rgds,
Guys,
Some designers take the influence of plastics on the sound of the audio system very seriously.
As Edouard pointed,out Japanese audiophiles experimented with static charges of plastics 25 years ago already.
Jean Hirga of L'Audiophile" fame being half French half Japanese acted as a go-between for these and many other experiments in French speaking Europe.
Controlling and damping vibrations in materials is another topic entirely.
What is important here is the influence of a statically charged component interacting with the magnetic field and charge it is transmitting.
Remember thirty years ago nobody believed in the sonic differences of so called "passive" components.
A resistor is a resistor is a resistor ad infinitum.
Well that turned out to be not the case (measurably even).
I recall Bernhard talking about the WBT plugs he once had that came at first with a slightly magnetic collet chuck.He heard a difference in sound quality,and so did many others.
The same can be applied to plastics.
Try for example the difference in a cable with enamelled or kapton lacquer insulation and one with a plastic based insulation,you will be surpised.
Then there's also the issue of multistrand versus solid core.
Diodic effects,Peltier effects and so on.
Try for a start to simply replace all those of the shelf power cords in your system with solid core you made up yourself.
You can thank me later.
Some of these topics are bordering on quantum physics,it's not because it is harder to understand that it ain't there.
I urge you all non-believers to check out the work done by folk at e.g. Jena Labs,Pearl and some others.
Cryogenics for instance is nothing more than an extension of the thinking that went into the creation of long crystal OFC cables.
And if you really want to see the work of a true believer check this site out:
www.audio-consulting.ch/tweak.htm
All I'm saying is try it out for yourselves.
The more revealing your system is the more you'll notice the differences.
Rgds,
Back to electrolytics again.
As far as removing the plastic sleeve is concerned, I expect the can would have some sort of electrical connection to the guts, so beware. I wonder if there is some optimum temperature for electro's for best performance. For long life you have to keep them cool, but this may not be the optimum for low esr etc.
I could well imagine the improvement gained in heat dissipation with the plastic sleeve removed. For damping, with the plastic removed, how about wrapping it up in several layers of lead? That will still conduct the heat out sort of but should damp any vibrations quite well.
GP.
As far as removing the plastic sleeve is concerned, I expect the can would have some sort of electrical connection to the guts, so beware. I wonder if there is some optimum temperature for electro's for best performance. For long life you have to keep them cool, but this may not be the optimum for low esr etc.
I could well imagine the improvement gained in heat dissipation with the plastic sleeve removed. For damping, with the plastic removed, how about wrapping it up in several layers of lead? That will still conduct the heat out sort of but should damp any vibrations quite well.
GP.
Damping
If you're wearing a hat you're not really nude, are you......
http://www.marigoaudio.com/absolute2.htm
If you're wearing a hat you're not really nude, are you......
http://www.marigoaudio.com/absolute2.htm
Attachments
MORE CAPS
Hi GP,
Good to point out.Some have their can connected to the ground terminal.
Next thing you're going to have someone manufacture a "CapCooler" a la TubeCooler.
Tvi,
Guess the Carborundum is put on top to keep headbangers away?
Artnyos,
Let's go to Marigo and explain this problem?
All,
As I pointed out in my last post: it's not so much damping but the mere presence of a plastic material that is being accused of degrading the sound.Or put it in a better way it's the difference in electrical potential between the various materials they worry about.
No kidding!
Rgds,
Hi GP,
Good to point out.Some have their can connected to the ground terminal.
Next thing you're going to have someone manufacture a "CapCooler" a la TubeCooler.
Tvi,
Guess the Carborundum is put on top to keep headbangers away?
Artnyos,
Let's go to Marigo and explain this problem?
All,
As I pointed out in my last post: it's not so much damping but the mere presence of a plastic material that is being accused of degrading the sound.Or put it in a better way it's the difference in electrical potential between the various materials they worry about.
No kidding!
Rgds,
Or put it in a better way it's the difference in electrical potential between the var
I don't believe that was stated in the suggestion to remove the plastic covering. It seems like a pretty dubius reason to me where damping seems a reasonable explination.
http://www.referenceaudiomods.com/parts.html#BG
Art
I don't believe that was stated in the suggestion to remove the plastic covering. It seems like a pretty dubius reason to me where damping seems a reasonable explination.
http://www.referenceaudiomods.com/parts.html#BG
Art
caps+plastic
Hi Artnyos,
You may not have noticed but the url you point at carries products form a swiss manufacturer namely :
http://www.audio-consulting.ch/
I invite you to have a look at it.You'll understand he avoids anything plastic like the plague.
I have no idea if the original thread went the same way,guess we need to ask him that ?
Cheers,
Hi Artnyos,
You may not have noticed but the url you point at carries products form a swiss manufacturer namely :
http://www.audio-consulting.ch/
I invite you to have a look at it.You'll understand he avoids anything plastic like the plague.
I have no idea if the original thread went the same way,guess we need to ask him that ?
Cheers,
CAPS
Hi,
With respect, but I don't think I'm the only one.
If you go through the entire thread you will find a post by Edouard on page two refering to the same phenomon.
I can point you to some published documents on this topic but they are all in French.
Let me know if you care to read it.
Did you browse through the Audio Consulting site?
I found it esoteric to say the least.
Rgds,
Hi,
With respect, but I don't think I'm the only one.
If you go through the entire thread you will find a post by Edouard on page two refering to the same phenomon.
I can point you to some published documents on this topic but they are all in French.
Let me know if you care to read it.
Did you browse through the Audio Consulting site?
I found it esoteric to say the least.
Rgds,
CAPS+ESD
Hi again Artnyos,
Here is one link to start with :
http://perso.club-internet.fr/ndaviden/revues.html
Unfortunately I do not hold my copies here.
Still what was dicussed is the influence of ESD by insulating materials on the underlying conductors.
I realise that buying the proposed books may seem an enormous outlay to get some info on a seemingly small topic.
Still, IMO these articles have a wide scope and were the basis of succes for many audiophiles,not to mention the publishers themselves.
The treatment of this effect was to put a brush of graphite charged paint to the components..I forgot the name of the product but it was sourced from Japan.
I used a similar product used in the electronics business containing graphite.
My turntable platter was the first to proof it's effectiveness,never had a static LP since.
Applications I think would benefit are DAC's were you will find a plethora of devices that are susceptible to static.
I haven't tried a Google on the subject as yet but if I stumble onto something meaningfull I'll sure let you all know.
Hi again Artnyos,
Here is one link to start with :
http://perso.club-internet.fr/ndaviden/revues.html
Unfortunately I do not hold my copies here.
Still what was dicussed is the influence of ESD by insulating materials on the underlying conductors.
I realise that buying the proposed books may seem an enormous outlay to get some info on a seemingly small topic.
Still, IMO these articles have a wide scope and were the basis of succes for many audiophiles,not to mention the publishers themselves.
The treatment of this effect was to put a brush of graphite charged paint to the components..I forgot the name of the product but it was sourced from Japan.
I used a similar product used in the electronics business containing graphite.
My turntable platter was the first to proof it's effectiveness,never had a static LP since.
Applications I think would benefit are DAC's were you will find a plethora of devices that are susceptible to static.
I haven't tried a Google on the subject as yet but if I stumble onto something meaningfull I'll sure let you all know.
removing plastic covers from capacitors
Hello,
The product containing graphite was produced by JVC and called Superblack. A graphite spray used to repair screening on television screens has the same effect. Maybe i can find the product info that was delivered with Superblack about 15 years ago when i did buy it. REMEMBER that Japan was the country that started the revival of single- ended , V.O.T. speakers,etc. Soon be brought into Europe by Hiraga long before those Americains redecovered their own stuff being shipped to Japan.
Try an aerosol of graphite, use a brush to apply it carefully because it is very conductive,Ed
Hello,
The product containing graphite was produced by JVC and called Superblack. A graphite spray used to repair screening on television screens has the same effect. Maybe i can find the product info that was delivered with Superblack about 15 years ago when i did buy it. REMEMBER that Japan was the country that started the revival of single- ended , V.O.T. speakers,etc. Soon be brought into Europe by Hiraga long before those Americains redecovered their own stuff being shipped to Japan.
Try an aerosol of graphite, use a brush to apply it carefully because it is very conductive,Ed
CAPS
Ed,
Thanks a million.
I think I used a spray from Kontakt Chemie for that.
Also I'm pretty sure the industry knows about this too.I'm positive I've seen it applied on some sensitive electronic components.
A small drop of it will do the trick nicely.
BTW,you would'nt happen to remember what issue of L'Audiophile that was?
Could you post a scan for those interested ?
You're absolutely correct,they where buying up all those DHT's as well.Not to mention the Neumann and AKG tube mics,the EMT TT's
etc.
Anyway thks again,
Ed,
Thanks a million.
I think I used a spray from Kontakt Chemie for that.
Also I'm pretty sure the industry knows about this too.I'm positive I've seen it applied on some sensitive electronic components.
A small drop of it will do the trick nicely.
BTW,you would'nt happen to remember what issue of L'Audiophile that was?
Could you post a scan for those interested ?
You're absolutely correct,they where buying up all those DHT's as well.Not to mention the Neumann and AKG tube mics,the EMT TT's
etc.
Anyway thks again,
Peter Daniel said:
How do you reach that conclusion?
When it comes to my own personal enjoyment of reproduced music, I don't care whether or not what I perceive is due to physics, psychology or some combination of the two.
However when someone attempts to assert their subjective experiences as universal objective reality, I do care. I care because I think the pool of universal knowledge is a valuable resource. And that its value is diminished when that which is added to it is less than circumspect.
Are you a believer in freezing photographs of yourself to influence sonics? Or are you a non-believer? If a non-believer, how can you possibly discount the positive effects reported by others?
You see, I'm truly neither believer nor non-believer on the above because I don't care, and that's why I'm not saying anything on that subject.
I'm simply questioning the assertion of subjective perception as objective reality.
As I said, I don't know or care whether my subjective perceptions are the result of physics or psychology. And to that end I don't attempt to assert my subjective perceptions as anything more than subjective perception.
My response was prompted by my curiousity as to how some people so easily become rigidly dogmatic on matters of faith and why they seem rather intolerant of those who don't share their dogma to the point that they feel the need to vigorously evangelize it.
se
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