Greetings from New Zealand.
I have been fortunate to have some PA equipment gifted to me.
So far I acquired (2) JBL 2245H 18 inch drivers, (4) JBL 2226H 15 inch drivers, and (5) JBL 2445H 2 inch compression drivers with big fibreglass baby cheeks horns.
I need to get 6 more 2245H 18s for my intended configuration of (2) quad reflex ported 18 boxes, (2) double 15 boxes and (4) horns.
I have (4) Markus Klug 1005B 10 cell wooden horns flying my way from Germany.
I am going for a vintage look like Axis, Sounds and Pressure and Dub Specialist Sound. All posters on this forum.
I want the double 15 box to be the same width as the quad 18 box with (2) wooden horns on top. That's the configuration each side. Recessed grills etc just like Axis and Dub Specialist Sound. I intend to personalise the style with an original routed grill design.
The 18s are 600W 8 Ohm. 15s are 600W 8 Ohm and the 2445H 2 inch compression drivers are 100W.
I'm thinking 3 way or if enough people recommend/argue for added tops, then a 4 way system.
As my title says, I am a total newbie except for a bit of reading on this site.
I have a music studio with analogue and digital recording and mixing. All reggae oriented instruments and gear. I am passionate about good sound.
I define good sound as pre 1995 mastering levels, preferably quality vinyl and not too loud. Warm dynamic music that is pleasurably loud and not louder than that. I think I may fantasise of a wooly bass sound that doesn't hurt your ears. Big and pillowy. Maybe that can be overdone. I'm thinking tape recordings bass whether synth or bass guitar. But that softer sound.
I am even considering being an unwise hipster and get tube/valve amps made. I have to research further if that is possible, sensible or worth the investment.
Maybe tube phono pre amps to get to line level and solid state amps.
My Dad has a full wood working shop and me choosing quad reflex ported cabs instead of rear loaded horns (he has made a couple of rear loaded horns for a friend before), will make the cabinet making easier He just needs to make (2) quad boxes and (2) double 15 boxes. The horns are done.
I only need the power to have a big friendly sound for 100-200 people in a small club to medium sized hall, I'm thinking.
In NZ we have a few reggae sound systems. Lion Rockers Hi Fi has 8 scoops, Jafa Mafia has Band Pass Horns etc.
I wish I could compare to a reflex cab sound system. I like the look of reflex cabs and people say that although they need double the amplification of scoops, they go lower and have a more even frequency response. This sounds good to me. Taking into account I don't like painful SPL levels.
I need to figure out a bunch of stuff. Maybe some factors I am currently unaware of.
How much amplification do I need for my sound system configuration?
Is valve amplification feasible and worth the extra weight and expense ands fragility. I like how Paul Huxtable and others are doing it all valve. Anyone care to describe the sound experience of Valv A Tron or S&P etc?
I need speaker box designs and knowhow for the recessed grill vintage look quads and matching width double 15 boxes.
Can I stay all analogue with amps, crossovers, limiters etc? Is it worth staying all analogue. I would like to keep digital conversions to a minimum IOW none.
I don't think I need a custom reggae pre amp. I'm thinking an Allen and Heath Mix Wizard 16 channel rack mount mixer taking all the inputs. Correct me if I am wrong:
Tube phono pre amp output, crossover outputs to a channel each, CD/Laptop outputs, mic, FX etc.
An experienced friend claims limiters are essential in case somebody drops a needle on a record or something. I'm not so sure it is essential. But I have no experience.
Because I am producing rhythms and recording people. I could take an Alesis HD24XR multitrack digital recorder like Mad Professor and do live dubs of original tunes on the Mix Wizard. Probably 8 tracks format for dubbing.
So considering that I am pursuing sound excellence in a warm pleasurable dynamic sound style what do you more knowledgable blokes recommend for the ultimate reggae sound system?
Thanks,
Roman.
I have been fortunate to have some PA equipment gifted to me.
So far I acquired (2) JBL 2245H 18 inch drivers, (4) JBL 2226H 15 inch drivers, and (5) JBL 2445H 2 inch compression drivers with big fibreglass baby cheeks horns.
I need to get 6 more 2245H 18s for my intended configuration of (2) quad reflex ported 18 boxes, (2) double 15 boxes and (4) horns.
I have (4) Markus Klug 1005B 10 cell wooden horns flying my way from Germany.
I am going for a vintage look like Axis, Sounds and Pressure and Dub Specialist Sound. All posters on this forum.
I want the double 15 box to be the same width as the quad 18 box with (2) wooden horns on top. That's the configuration each side. Recessed grills etc just like Axis and Dub Specialist Sound. I intend to personalise the style with an original routed grill design.
The 18s are 600W 8 Ohm. 15s are 600W 8 Ohm and the 2445H 2 inch compression drivers are 100W.
I'm thinking 3 way or if enough people recommend/argue for added tops, then a 4 way system.
As my title says, I am a total newbie except for a bit of reading on this site.
I have a music studio with analogue and digital recording and mixing. All reggae oriented instruments and gear. I am passionate about good sound.
I define good sound as pre 1995 mastering levels, preferably quality vinyl and not too loud. Warm dynamic music that is pleasurably loud and not louder than that. I think I may fantasise of a wooly bass sound that doesn't hurt your ears. Big and pillowy. Maybe that can be overdone. I'm thinking tape recordings bass whether synth or bass guitar. But that softer sound.
I am even considering being an unwise hipster and get tube/valve amps made. I have to research further if that is possible, sensible or worth the investment.
Maybe tube phono pre amps to get to line level and solid state amps.
My Dad has a full wood working shop and me choosing quad reflex ported cabs instead of rear loaded horns (he has made a couple of rear loaded horns for a friend before), will make the cabinet making easier He just needs to make (2) quad boxes and (2) double 15 boxes. The horns are done.
I only need the power to have a big friendly sound for 100-200 people in a small club to medium sized hall, I'm thinking.
In NZ we have a few reggae sound systems. Lion Rockers Hi Fi has 8 scoops, Jafa Mafia has Band Pass Horns etc.
I wish I could compare to a reflex cab sound system. I like the look of reflex cabs and people say that although they need double the amplification of scoops, they go lower and have a more even frequency response. This sounds good to me. Taking into account I don't like painful SPL levels.
I need to figure out a bunch of stuff. Maybe some factors I am currently unaware of.
How much amplification do I need for my sound system configuration?
Is valve amplification feasible and worth the extra weight and expense ands fragility. I like how Paul Huxtable and others are doing it all valve. Anyone care to describe the sound experience of Valv A Tron or S&P etc?
I need speaker box designs and knowhow for the recessed grill vintage look quads and matching width double 15 boxes.
Can I stay all analogue with amps, crossovers, limiters etc? Is it worth staying all analogue. I would like to keep digital conversions to a minimum IOW none.
I don't think I need a custom reggae pre amp. I'm thinking an Allen and Heath Mix Wizard 16 channel rack mount mixer taking all the inputs. Correct me if I am wrong:
Tube phono pre amp output, crossover outputs to a channel each, CD/Laptop outputs, mic, FX etc.
An experienced friend claims limiters are essential in case somebody drops a needle on a record or something. I'm not so sure it is essential. But I have no experience.
Because I am producing rhythms and recording people. I could take an Alesis HD24XR multitrack digital recorder like Mad Professor and do live dubs of original tunes on the Mix Wizard. Probably 8 tracks format for dubbing.
So considering that I am pursuing sound excellence in a warm pleasurable dynamic sound style what do you more knowledgable blokes recommend for the ultimate reggae sound system?
Thanks,
Roman.
Get a couple or three of these:
QSC PLX3102 Professional Power Amplifier | Musician's Friend
You can make a cover for them that looks like an ancient tube amp...
QSC PLX3102 Professional Power Amplifier | Musician's Friend
You can make a cover for them that looks like an ancient tube amp...
Hi Roman,
Lots of ideas you have there
.1) Or you could get half as many drivers that move (displace) twice as much air.
2) They will no doubt look more like what you are after than the horns you presently have..
3) You don't mind that side by side 15" drivers will have a very peaky off-axis midrange due to comb filtering, do you?
4)The 2245H Pe (thermally limited maximum power) is only 300 watts, though since you like dynamics in your music, using amplification with 600 watts per driver should be no problem. With a VAS of 821 liters, and an Xmax of only 9.65mm, a quad will need to be huge compared to the amount of output available with modern high power & excursion, lower VAS drivers. There is a hi-fi market willing to pay for old JBL drivers, unless spending lots of money for relatively little output is high on your list, you may want to reconsider what is behind the grill.
5) OK, how many dB SPL at 30, 35, or 40Hz constitutes "a big friendly sound"?
6)The 15" JBL 2226H Pe is 600 watts, in the 600 to 1200 watt range would suffice. Anything much over 125 watts will make the 2445 drivers sound like a horror movie scream.
7)Valve amplification in the power amp section is not worth the weight and expense. Of course, launching a Tesla electric car into space using the Falcon Heavy is not worth the expense in my opinion either, so realize I do have certain biases.
8) Euphonic.
9) Yes, if you don't mind paying premium prices for sonic features.
10) See #9.
11) That leaves out a lot of digital recordings, but there's plenty of analog to go around ;^).
12) Last time I fired up an HD24XR, it had an A/D and a D/A converter on every track...
13) The ultimate herb, and cases of Red Stripe, after some home cooked Jerk Chicken...
Cheers,
Art
Is this going to be a portable system? Quad 18 boxes are not something one person could move around easily and even with enough help doorways and stairs are going to be difficult or impossible so you might want to reconsider that.
Mids and highs should be stacked vertically, nothing wrong with a double 15+2" cab either.
I'm over the all analog thing, if care is taken with the production of digital recordings from analog sources you can have all the warmth in a very portable package without any of the hassle.
And DSP processing just makes getting the best out of a speaker system so much easier, processors these days are very transparent so IMO there is no good reason to lug a complete analog system around.
Mids and highs should be stacked vertically, nothing wrong with a double 15+2" cab either.
I'm over the all analog thing, if care is taken with the production of digital recordings from analog sources you can have all the warmth in a very portable package without any of the hassle.
And DSP processing just makes getting the best out of a speaker system so much easier, processors these days are very transparent so IMO there is no good reason to lug a complete analog system around.
This ^^^^.
Given those drivers, I'd try something different, like a TH or 6th order BP with an 18, stack a "kick" bass horn on top of that made from one of the 15s, then go with a top design to cover everything above 200~300 Hz.
I probably misread this somehow. Why are you planning to use 4 horns with 2 LF and mid boxes?
If you find you have more horns than you need, I'd gladly take a couple off your hands
They look very pretty.Where in NZ will this be? I visit semi-regularly, and would go out of my way to hear such a system.
I believe scoops are still the de facto old skool reggae sound. https://www.freespeakerplans.com/plans/14-plans/basscab/31-hog-scoop
I like the idea of a NICE tube pre driving digital amps with signal processing.
I like the idea of a NICE tube pre driving digital amps with signal processing.
That plan claims 35~200 Hz. If true, that would be an interesting RLH design because the suggestion is that there's no mid-bass notch/dip that characterizes those designs.
Is there a Hornresp sim of this design available anywhere? If not, I might have a look at putting one together to see of the sim supports the claimed response.
Exactly. It's a signature sound. Just like the sound of a Marshall stack for hard rock. It just works even though it is technically inferior. Cool part about DIY is the journey... Even cooler to bond with the old man at the same time... Build a few designs and shoot em out. Then, build a wall of pretty ones of what you like.
Can it be emulated via DSP? e.g. a sharp notch around 150 Hz. That way it can be "turned off" if the cabinets are put to some other use.
I saw that too but thought that was a little marketing... I think all scoop designs suffer from the cancellation but like I am saying, it might not be a bad thing. I've long contemplated they would work well with modern EDM despite the issue. Gives me an excuse to build mid bass horns.
A quick search yields this: Database simulation - Speakerplans.com Forums - Page 4
That link is missing some HR info L45. Another take on it and surprisingly not near as much cancellation... Scoop HR reference guide - Speakerplans.com Forums - Page 2
That depends on how you look at it - I'm seeing a 6+dB cancellation around 110 Hz and another 4+dB cancellation around 140-ish Hz
I kind of wonder what's the fascination behind building these non-flat designs. Ok, THs tend to be non-flat too, but at least that non-flatness is usually above the intended passband...
I kind of wonder what's the fascination behind building these non-flat designs. Ok, THs tend to be non-flat too, but at least that non-flatness is usually above the intended passband...
I guess it depends on whether you're trying to 'make sound', or 'reproduce sound'.
On the 'make sound' side, I'd say do whatever on earth sounds pleasing to you.
On the 'reproduce side', I have a hard time seeing how anything other than flat is practical....unless all you want to do is reproduce a particular made sound
The thing that makes Axis Valv-A-Tron so special is he goes all the way vintage. His drivers are vintage high efficient fane drivers, the amps, crossover and preamp are all full analog tube and except his preamp, wich is full analog discrete solid state. If you want that sound, you also need to go that route.
That is not easy, and Paul from Axis can do it as he is a tube amp specialist, who also build a lot of great amps and preamps for other people. Idem with speaker boxes he build. Valv-A-Tron is his third or fourth sound system (he sold of the others), and is build on the experience he has on his previous stacks and on stacks he build for other people.
I would also go that rout if i could build a soundsystem, but even if i know a lot, i'm far of capable to do what Paul Axis does...
That is not easy, and Paul from Axis can do it as he is a tube amp specialist, who also build a lot of great amps and preamps for other people. Idem with speaker boxes he build. Valv-A-Tron is his third or fourth sound system (he sold of the others), and is build on the experience he has on his previous stacks and on stacks he build for other people.
I would also go that rout if i could build a soundsystem, but even if i know a lot, i'm far of capable to do what Paul Axis does...
Scoops are late 70's till now oldskool. Axis Valv-A-Tron more is 60's and early 70's oldskool from before the scoop horns when sounds like Downbeat the ruler, Tippatone, Black Harmony and King Tubby's Home Hifi ruled the soundsystem scene. Tubby's was one of the first who used (Jensen) scoops, before, the quad 18's were the standaard.
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