Almost forgot:
Yes, for electrical calculations the proper parameter is wire section/area in mm² because we are interested in principle in current density (current carrying capacity) and as a secondary parameter wire resistance, but I wind transformers and voice coils, and there, when I order enamelled wire rolls at my supplier, I must ask for specific diameter in mm, that's how it's labelled.
Transformer winding data also is given in mm (diameter), not mm²
As in:
"primary 784 turns, 0.40mm ; secondary 100+100 turns 0.80mm" and so on.
There they are talking diameter.
Yes, for electrical calculations the proper parameter is wire section/area in mm² because we are interested in principle in current density (current carrying capacity) and as a secondary parameter wire resistance, but I wind transformers and voice coils, and there, when I order enamelled wire rolls at my supplier, I must ask for specific diameter in mm, that's how it's labelled.
Transformer winding data also is given in mm (diameter), not mm²
As in:
"primary 784 turns, 0.40mm ; secondary 100+100 turns 0.80mm" and so on.
There they are talking diameter.
That is a very general statement.
On ones own speakers do whatever one feels like
on what system, voltage and country?
If you'd do that as a electrical installation in Europe, with standard PVC insulation, you will have opened yourself up to litigation due to malpractice in most countries.
Depends on your choice of wire and insulation tbh.
There is a huge difference in how flexible the insulation and different wire types are.
Solid core, multiple strands (1-7) and multistrand makes a huge difference by default.
There are impressively flexible multistrand, silicone insulated wires that are made for the purpose of being flexible with a high load capacity (partly coming from the 150-180 celsius insulation ratings).
Hi,
A piece of wire has resistance, inductance & maybe some capacitance as far as influence to electrical circuits go. It can also pick up some magnetic/RF noise.
So it should be selected based upon requirements for equipment so that properties mentioned above have no significant influence.
A 1mm^2 wire length of 0.5 meter has maybe 1 uH of inductance, 10 mOhm resistance, which is close to 1/1000 th of the speaker.
Judging from these numbers it can be argued that audible difference between 1 mm^2 and 1000 mm^2 will be none - if latter can be built in practice and beliefs do not interfere.
Regards
A piece of wire has resistance, inductance & maybe some capacitance as far as influence to electrical circuits go. It can also pick up some magnetic/RF noise.
So it should be selected based upon requirements for equipment so that properties mentioned above have no significant influence.
A 1mm^2 wire length of 0.5 meter has maybe 1 uH of inductance, 10 mOhm resistance, which is close to 1/1000 th of the speaker.
Judging from these numbers it can be argued that audible difference between 1 mm^2 and 1000 mm^2 will be none - if latter can be built in practice and beliefs do not interfere.
Regards
I remember a Speakerbuilder magazine article where speaker wires of all types were tested. What shocked everyone was that the very expensive solid silver wires wrapped in saran wrap measured the worst, worse than lamp chord. But, the difference was a couple hundredths of a percent at 20,000hz a frequency most of us can’t hear.
Fill your boots!
This is yet another cable thread that has well and truly run its course.
Not needed, 18AWG is perfectly fine anywhere inside a speaker cabinet
Besides, those numbers quoted such as 11.5 , 18.5 , etc. are nonsense.
All AWG numbers are "full" numbers or a couple fractions for the thicker ones, NO DECIMALS
That alone proves Cardas is not a serious Company.
For reference and since you are worried about your woofer:
I commercially build speakers, from scrap; meaning the actual speaker itself, not just the cabinet, crossover, etc.
Of course, must design it first, including its voice coil.
One of my 8 ohm woofer voice coils is 38mm (1.5") diameter, winding length is 14 mm, for a 6mm top plate thickness.
It has 126 turns (2 layers of 63 turns each) of 0.20mm diameter copper wire, equivalent to AWG 32 😱, total wire length is FIFTEEN METERS.
So electrons travelling through that wire and doing all the work of pushing/pulling a heavy woofer cone are travelling through 15 METERS OF VERY FINE WIRE.
Twice as thick as a printing paper sheet for reference.
Can anybody think they will be bothered by 50 or 60 cm (tops) of AWG18 wire?
Even if it were even thinner AWG22!
That's why concepts should be expressed as numbers (if applicable) whenever possible, they clear much brain fog.
I commercially build speakers, from scrap; meaning the actual speaker itself, not just the cabinet, crossover, etc.
Of course, must design it first, including its voice coil.
One of my 8 ohm woofer voice coils is 38mm (1.5") diameter, winding length is 14 mm, for a 6mm top plate thickness.
It has 126 turns (2 layers of 63 turns each) of 0.20mm diameter copper wire, equivalent to AWG 32 😱, total wire length is FIFTEEN METERS.
So electrons travelling through that wire and doing all the work of pushing/pulling a heavy woofer cone are travelling through 15 METERS OF VERY FINE WIRE.
Twice as thick as a printing paper sheet for reference.
Can anybody think they will be bothered by 50 or 60 cm (tops) of AWG18 wire?
Even if it were even thinner AWG22!
That's why concepts should be expressed as numbers (if applicable) whenever possible, they clear much brain fog.
There is one difference though to keep in mind within reason.
And that is "adequate CSA for the current needed.
Most normal wire is PVC jacketed and starts releasing gasses above 70 degrees, high temperature in contact with wood and stuffing is not ideal and could be a fire hazard, neither is melted insulation good or healthy, can also blow your amp/s with a short. True enough the PVC jackets usually just get dark brown and porous and stiff from excessive heat.
Voicecoils are coated with higher temperature insulation materials, and most drivers have a healthy amount of cooling in the gap these days, so that is one difference.
And that is "adequate CSA for the current needed.
Most normal wire is PVC jacketed and starts releasing gasses above 70 degrees, high temperature in contact with wood and stuffing is not ideal and could be a fire hazard, neither is melted insulation good or healthy, can also blow your amp/s with a short. True enough the PVC jackets usually just get dark brown and porous and stiff from excessive heat.
Voicecoils are coated with higher temperature insulation materials, and most drivers have a healthy amount of cooling in the gap these days, so that is one difference.
Furthermore, wire is usually (always?) sold as even numbers such as 12, 14, 16, 18, etc. I don't recall ever seeing an odd AWG electrical wire.
If your cabinet is exceptionally large and the input connector is far (like five feet or more) from the woofer, tweeter or crossover, then it might be preferable to go with 16 gauge rather than 18 gauge. But I'm too lazy to determine if the difference would be around 0.1, 0.01, or 0.001 ohm.
I've always used "low voltage landscape wire" 12/2 (12AWG, 2 conductors) stranded, basically thick zip-cord for speaker wire (between amplifier and speakers, 10 to 25 feet for each speaker). I'm a little worried that landscape wiring won't need to be this big as everything goes to LED lighting, but it's still for sale, even at 10/2 and 8/2, and the 10/2 is less than a dollar a foot.
If your speaker cable is heating up to where it's even slightly warm to the touch, it's definitely too small, but that would be very unusual.
Yeah, time to wind it up.Fill your boots!
This is yet another cable thread that has well and truly run its course.
Further to Ben’s comment, if the speaker cable is warm to the touch, I’d be concerned about voice coils of tweeters and small full range drivers.
Perhaps you’re unaware that there’s a variation of Godwin’s Law as relates to any Internet forum discussion regarding cables, hence some of the terse replies.
My only additional note would be that as a long time fan of wrapped and soldered connections, there’s a risk that the weight of thicker internal wiring as well as sustained heat required for good flow could stress the smaller terminals on tweeters and fullrange drivers of which some of us are aficionados. Except for subwoofers, I tended to use nothing thicker than #20, and have yet to have a fire.
Hello All.
I tend to use 16 AWG THHN stranded conductors, one red and one black taped together on 4 inch intervals. Separate conductors are much more inductive.
The most important thing is to use Speak-On connectors they are much better than bananas.
The 16 AWG THHN stranded conductors are flexible enough and stiff enough to stay where you put them.
From hands on experience.
DT
I tend to use 16 AWG THHN stranded conductors, one red and one black taped together on 4 inch intervals. Separate conductors are much more inductive.
The most important thing is to use Speak-On connectors they are much better than bananas.
The 16 AWG THHN stranded conductors are flexible enough and stiff enough to stay where you put them.
From hands on experience.
DT
If you're building the speakers and have easy access to the internals, why not get some short lengths of budget wire, same type but a variety of gauges and try them out?
Inside the speaker i think smaller size wire is not a problem anyhow. (even if some manufacturers brag about it)
But with biger woofers and much power from amp, i have experienced a difference.
So I use 6mm from my Krell amplifiers for my 6 pieces of 12 inch woofers. (and find a "cheep" 150 usd Audioquest Midnight+ parof 2x3 m 20 years ago, and it fitted my needs)
But will never buy expensive one´s, it´s ridiculous & there is almost no limit to how high the price can be.
But with biger woofers and much power from amp, i have experienced a difference.
So I use 6mm from my Krell amplifiers for my 6 pieces of 12 inch woofers. (and find a "cheep" 150 usd Audioquest Midnight+ parof 2x3 m 20 years ago, and it fitted my needs)
But will never buy expensive one´s, it´s ridiculous & there is almost no limit to how high the price can be.