Considering your yawn, then need to defend your point of view seems to have woken you up...
"Completely delusional" are your words.
Even more sufficient in practice.
No, the mastering is just as easy to screw up. Nothing is guaranteeing the "hi-res" is any better mastered, and the only way the hi-res format could make a bad mastering better is if the mastering was way too quiet - with loudness wars, what is the likelihood of that?
I have heard far too much vinyl - if you get pleasure out of a limited dynamic range, reduced stereo separation, horrible noise and distortion levels and wow& flutter, then good for you!
Of course. I have a pretty decent system in my car, and usually the audible differences disappear somewhere between 128 and 192 K.
No, we will just have to wait and see.
In hi-res, I assume?
Ah, an old rock star shedding his ideals and selling out, making money on a scam, is inspiring other musicians to do the same? Quite possible.
Perhaps the fact that you can have the same experience using a $25 player, and music that is half the price of the so-called "hi-res"?
Oh well, I am sure you are happy to pay $5 for a bottle of bottled tibetan mountain water too.
I think the Jobs thing is a popular myth. I don't think it was ever confirmed - but then again, Jobs knew the power of marketing, so who knows.
Well, funny enough, they already have, while pono isn't shipping yet.
But if pono turns out to be the same upsampled CD material and re-recordings of 30 year old analog tapes as what HDTracks et al are already offering, there might be a bad backlash - and it is preventing us from addressing stuff that really matters (basically bad recordings).
Indeed.
Considering your yawn, then need to defend your point of view seems to have woken you up...
"Completely delusional" are your words.
Even more sufficient in practice.
No, the mastering is just as easy to screw up. Nothing is guaranteeing the "hi-res" is any better mastered, and the only way the hi-res format could make a bad mastering better is if the mastering was way too quiet - with loudness wars, what is the likelihood of that?
I have heard far too much vinyl - if you get pleasure out of a limited dynamic range, reduced stereo separation, horrible noise and distortion levels and wow& flutter, then good for you!
Of course. I have a pretty decent system in my car, and usually the audible differences disappear somewhere between 128 and 192 K.
No, we will just have to wait and see.
In hi-res, I assume?
Ah, an old rock star shedding his ideals and selling out, making money on a scam, is inspiring other musicians to do the same? Quite possible.
Perhaps the fact that you can have the same experience using a $25 player, and music that is half the price of the so-called "hi-res"?
Oh well, I am sure you are happy to pay $5 for a bottle of bottled tibetan mountain water too.
Julf,
It's interesting that you don't actually respond to my points, but simply repeat a worn-out talking point. Perhaps that's your idea of a good time.
Here's my summary of what you are saying; please tell me if I got anything wrong:
Anything better than MP3 or CD quality is a scam since it offers no audible improvement. In fact, we don't even need CD quality.
Vinyl has nothing to offer musically, since it is just added noise and distortion.
Neil young is a scammer for trying to advocate for hi-rez digital distribution and doesn't really believe it sounds better.
Nobody in the music business has any interest in better sound.
Anyone who spends $300 on a Pono player is a sucker.
The analogue stage designed by Charles Hansen at Ayre won't make a difference either.
Maximum available sound quality can be achieved with a $25 player and lossy downloaded music.
Did I miss anything?
Peter
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Wow, that was an interesting reading of what I wrote!
I don't need better than MP3 *in a car*. At home there is no reason not to use lossless, but "hi-res" doesn't offer any benefit over CD quality (and in fact many recordings sold as "hi-res" have turned out to be conversions from 44.1/16.
Where did I mention "lossy downloaded music"?
I don't need better than MP3 *in a car*. At home there is no reason not to use lossless, but "hi-res" doesn't offer any benefit over CD quality (and in fact many recordings sold as "hi-res" have turned out to be conversions from 44.1/16.
The noise and distortion (as well as compression and other processing added at the mastering stage to accommodate the limitations of vinyl) might well enhance the music. That depends on the preferences of the listener.
It is quite possible that he himself believes it sounds better, but it is clear that some of the artists quoted in the advertising videos are not talking about hi-res, but comparing the studio sound to mp3's on a mobile device.
Lots of people in the music business have an interest in better sound. Unfortunately the people making the business decisions for the major labels don't.
Not a sucker, just a me-too hipster. But that is a valid lifestyle choice...
We don't know that before we hear the end result. The name of a designer doesn't guarantee a good result.
The music quality achieved by a good $25 player is hard to improve on using headsets in mobile conditions.
Where did I mention "lossy downloaded music"?
Hi,
Julf, it seems we are not far apart, but hey come on ..... do You really think that the technical side is a problem??
Its certainly no prob to design a well enough sounding portable device.
As I said before the real problem lies in the handling of the device.
If I need to go through complicated and multiple press button-actions, if I can´t find my music within say 5 seconds -or in extreme not at all(!), than the handling becomes annoying and it spoils all the fun one could have with such a device, regardless of its sound qualities.
Interestingly no words are lost by Pono about this most important parameter.
jauu
Calvin
ps: In the linked video the device pops up just once(!) around 4:40 -rather looking like a mockup than a functioning device:
So, what sound quality are the people in the video talking about????
Certainly not that of the Pono-device.
For me the Pono just prooves the old saying that ´a fool and his money will soon be departed´
Julf, it seems we are not far apart, but hey come on ..... do You really think that the technical side is a problem??
Its certainly no prob to design a well enough sounding portable device.
As I said before the real problem lies in the handling of the device.
If I need to go through complicated and multiple press button-actions, if I can´t find my music within say 5 seconds -or in extreme not at all(!), than the handling becomes annoying and it spoils all the fun one could have with such a device, regardless of its sound qualities.
Interestingly no words are lost by Pono about this most important parameter.
jauu
Calvin
ps: In the linked video the device pops up just once(!) around 4:40 -rather looking like a mockup than a functioning device:
So, what sound quality are the people in the video talking about????
Certainly not that of the Pono-device.
For me the Pono just prooves the old saying that ´a fool and his money will soon be departed´
https://secure.aes.org/forum/pubs/journal/?ID=2
If you want to read the whole thing you'd have to pay $20 unless you are an AES member.
If you want to read the whole thing you'd have to pay $20 unless you are an AES member.
For anyone interested here is more info...BAS Experiment Explanation page - Oct 2007
I have met E. Brad Meyer a few times and IMHO he has some pre-biases, he is also the guy I ticked off by pointing out learning the ABX switch clicks made for 100% correct.
I could, once again, but this time I actually won't. I actually think it is the ones that make claims that go against well-proven, accepted scientific and engineering knowledge and practice that should be required to prove the point, instead of the engineers constantly being asked to prove, over and over again, that the earth is not flat.
The fact that the useless 70% of extra bandwidth and storage space is not needed once you have normalized the level so that you don't need (and can't use) the extra headroom (that was handy when recording)?
Why sell wine in 0.75 l bottles, when you could sell it in 2.5 l bottles with 1.75 l of air in them?
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