Kensai said:
Ah ha! I thought so. That's a good price, too. I"ve done some work with bamboo cutting boards and bamboo plywood. Nice stuff.
Keep up the good work, let us know how the Dayton Neo tweeters work out for you. I like mine.
FYI, sometimes it's a good idea to put a small inductor across these neo tweeters. Like ~0.1mH Keeps the bass signal from hitting the resonant peak of the tweeter. Alas, the coil is often bigger than the driver!
I wasn't too interested in the Phase plugs at first, but as Kensai says, once you get the speakers built up and like them it's nice to have a way to improve them . The Pioneers are so agreeable and pleasant to listen to that you just appreciate them more as time goes on- but MORE of that appreciation- that's appealing!
So, it's a low risk to first build without the plugs, and then if you think that they are "keepers, a little more money makes sense. One of us still needs to try the "phase plug with the PE tweeter on the end coaxial" though... It seems that Dave would be tempted! I guess that it would have to be a longer plug, obviously with the end chopped off!!
a hollow structure would work better of course, as you could insert the tweeter into it. I'm looking at model rocket nosecones!!
Mark
So, it's a low risk to first build without the plugs, and then if you think that they are "keepers, a little more money makes sense. One of us still needs to try the "phase plug with the PE tweeter on the end coaxial" though... It seems that Dave would be tempted! I guess that it would have to be a longer plug, obviously with the end chopped off!!
a hollow structure would work better of course, as you could insert the tweeter into it. I'm looking at model rocket nosecones!!
Mark
Kensai said:
Ok, ok, you win. I give up.
If you are interested in bass and low on budget, perhaps you may wish to try this.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
It's less than $20, which includes the case(which is quite nice) and an 8" subwoofer. Adding a brace or two will even improve things for cabinet stiffness.
All that is missing is the plate amp. You can replace it with P E 70 watt plate amp, which was on sale until last week. I'm awaiting my amp to arrive, along with some other items, and I will be up and running with my new computer sub.
You'll have to pardon my ignorance, but I have been away from the speaker building scene for some years. First, what is "P10", and how do I go about getting a pair of phase plugs for my Pioneers? Perhaps you could give me a link? I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
P10 refers to Dave Dlugos, one of the DIYaudio forum moderators & all round great bloke, who goes under the moniker 'planet10' and runs www.planet10-hifi.com (as well as the frugalhorn & t-line speakers sites) where you can buy the aforementioned plugs for your drivers.
Kensai said:
Here is something else to consider as well. I know you are stuck on your baby here as she is, but I am considering your thinking of getting the entire XBox at one time. The cubes are also on closeout, but to me they are ugly as sin itself. I wouldn't have one of them on my desktop for just about anything.
However, there is a substitute, which you can find right here. I bought four of them and have a set of .25cf cabinets made. I forgot to order the terminal sections for the rear, so I'm awaiting them along with the plate amp. When they arrive, I will complete the sub and the buyout cabinets and then veneer the later with reconstituted oak veneer.
I wasn't able to examine the 2nd order crossover closely because both inductor and cap were covered in black pitch of some kind. But I hear that they are a real steal for the price of less than $5 each, as you can see from the link. That's just something else to consider.
Yeah, the Spherix are ugly, but the only reason I would want them would be for the Mirage omnipole alignment. They're not very big and I could easily hide them as surround channels.
Those weird little 5x7s seem pretty neat, and if we had some specs for them, I'd be interested. I've got lots of folks who need an upgrade from TV speakers, but I would need to be able to design some enclosures for them to be worth anything outside of a car.
Kensai
Those weird little 5x7s seem pretty neat, and if we had some specs for them, I'd be interested. I've got lots of folks who need an upgrade from TV speakers, but I would need to be able to design some enclosures for them to be worth anything outside of a car.
Kensai
GM,
That's kinda what I was thinking. Without some decent way to rear load these things, I'm doubtful of any practical use in home. A really huge box kinda defeats the purpose of a small, cheap driver, especially if you're only going to get down to 110Hz. I'll stick with Pio A11s for friends and family just now, and the B20s for myself.
Thanks,
Kensai
That's kinda what I was thinking. Without some decent way to rear load these things, I'm doubtful of any practical use in home. A really huge box kinda defeats the purpose of a small, cheap driver, especially if you're only going to get down to 110Hz. I'll stick with Pio A11s for friends and family just now, and the B20s for myself.
Thanks,
Kensai
Looking at PartsExpress it seems that most of the car sub-woofers also have fairly high Qts - mostly above .5 - does that make them better candidates for an open baffle subwoofer?GM said:
...I need to go read some more about how the Thiele-Small parameters correlate to different system implementations.
tim
Greets!
Yes they do IMO, though Linkwitz disagrees. Consider that a transient perfect (critically damped) alignment has a 0.5 Qtc and a maximally flat one (also referred to as critically damped by some) has a 0.707 Qtc, it seems reasonable that having a sub or woofer driver with a Qts in this range for OB or IB is a 'no-brainer', or more accurately an effective Qts since series resistance and VC heating will increase it.
OTOH, to keep the baffle size semi-reasonable, a higher Qts driver can be used if it's fairly BW limited since it can't 'audibly 'ring' due to the XO rolling it off. This is what MJK has done. Carver took it to the extreme with his 'Amazing' line arrays: http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/290carver/ What it doesn't reveal is that those very special woofers had a ~3.0 Qts, so little wonder manufacturers of high SQ drivers didn't want their name associated with it.
GM
Yes they do IMO, though Linkwitz disagrees. Consider that a transient perfect (critically damped) alignment has a 0.5 Qtc and a maximally flat one (also referred to as critically damped by some) has a 0.707 Qtc, it seems reasonable that having a sub or woofer driver with a Qts in this range for OB or IB is a 'no-brainer', or more accurately an effective Qts since series resistance and VC heating will increase it.
OTOH, to keep the baffle size semi-reasonable, a higher Qts driver can be used if it's fairly BW limited since it can't 'audibly 'ring' due to the XO rolling it off. This is what MJK has done. Carver took it to the extreme with his 'Amazing' line arrays: http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/290carver/ What it doesn't reveal is that those very special woofers had a ~3.0 Qts, so little wonder manufacturers of high SQ drivers didn't want their name associated with it.
GM
any suggestions on the tweeter from PE?, you mentioned cheapish tweeter with 1u cap. gychang
I look forward to trying nelson's TL.
I wonder if it would be better for the path to go straight back behind the driver, going back and forth from top down to bottom ?
To me the midrange pressure (reflection. etc?) would be dissipated beter than having a back wall more than a foot away.
Like the transmission loaded woofer in the b&w nautilus snail thing.
If I remember, the frugal horn people also have commented on an improvement when the back wall is not so close to the driver.
Norman
I wonder if it would be better for the path to go straight back behind the driver, going back and forth from top down to bottom ?
To me the midrange pressure (reflection. etc?) would be dissipated beter than having a back wall more than a foot away.
Like the transmission loaded woofer in the b&w nautilus snail thing.
If I remember, the frugal horn people also have commented on an improvement when the back wall is not so close to the driver.
Norman
What about the lowly Voigt pipe for the Pioneer?
I think I asked this ages ago in another life cycle,
but that Voigt always comes back as a design I want
to build: one driver, tapered enclosure, port
at the bottom,.... done.
I have B20 and tried Voigt pipe several years ago but the figures were all wrong (too large vent), I want to try again, if someone has exact dimensions figured out. May mate it with a piezo on the back (ala gozilla). Any audio engineers out there?
How would one make phase plugs for B20?, dowel-lot of sanding?, should it be certain length and diameter?
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