Peter,
Stefano organised a GB for those capacitors, in the values for this phono stage.
Safe to assume that at least 10 to 20 Paradise builders participated in the group buy, and given the cost level of the parts, it's unlikely that their boards will end up in a drawer.
As this is the Paradise builders thread, and Stefano is not the only one with non-stick caps, he's entitled to post about them.
Think of it as anger management therapy, works for me (once I stop hitting the wall with my keyboard
).
Stefano organised a GB for those capacitors, in the values for this phono stage.
Safe to assume that at least 10 to 20 Paradise builders participated in the group buy, and given the cost level of the parts, it's unlikely that their boards will end up in a drawer.
As this is the Paradise builders thread, and Stefano is not the only one with non-stick caps, he's entitled to post about them.
Think of it as anger management therapy, works for me (once I stop hitting the wall with my keyboard
).
still the Wima caps, unfortunately. Still, it sounds very nice. Vcaps will be the next upgrade, they are sitting there and waiting for me to find the time. Plus, a few more modifications- some exotic input trannies, a new servo, cooling for the input stage, .......
on my way to the Paradise Platinum Extreme......
Wooo that sounds pretty awesome!! Keep me posted!!
Dude chill out!! I have no economical interest with vcaps so I am not advertising anything!
Like Jacco said I have organized the GB and I would be curious to know how they liked it!!
If you don't like my post you have no rights to attack me!!
So one more time chill out!!!
This issue could be easily resolved.
Build two Paradise phono stages.
One with the V-Caps and one with Wima FKP-2.
Measure them both and show me the one equipped with the V-caps measures better.
If no difference shows up, even with the best measurement equipment around, i would say it is a matter of taste.
Build two Paradise phono stages.
One with the V-Caps and one with Wima FKP-2.
Measure them both and show me the one equipped with the V-caps measures better.
If no difference shows up, even with the best measurement equipment around, i would say it is a matter of taste.
Sorry...I fully disagree with you!! You are basically saying that two circuits that measure the same also sound the same...which is well known to not be true!
I stead I invited you to build one listen, simply swap..listen again...and then get to your conclusion!!!
I will do that and when i like the V-Caps better i will tell.
One thing is : circuits that sound different usually measure different.
When two circuits measure the same and sound different we measure the wrong thing.
When we measure the right thing and measurable differences are not existing the resolution of the measurement system is not good enough.
I did NOT say that circuits that measure the same sound the same.
Quite the opposite. I said show me that the V-caps measure better IN THE SAME CIRCUIT:
The problem is simple : as long as there is no objective measurement that shows the difference the audible difference is subjective.
We have played that game before : I could easily say that i like Jaccos NOS Siemens better then the V-Caps. It is only hearsay, no prove.
Anyway, there are things between heaven and earth that we do not know so when the V-Caps give me a better sound so i accept it. I will then of cause try to find a measurement that explains it. That is the way i work.
One thing is : circuits that sound different usually measure different.
When two circuits measure the same and sound different we measure the wrong thing.
When we measure the right thing and measurable differences are not existing the resolution of the measurement system is not good enough.
I did NOT say that circuits that measure the same sound the same.
Quite the opposite. I said show me that the V-caps measure better IN THE SAME CIRCUIT:
The problem is simple : as long as there is no objective measurement that shows the difference the audible difference is subjective.
We have played that game before : I could easily say that i like Jaccos NOS Siemens better then the V-Caps. It is only hearsay, no prove.
Anyway, there are things between heaven and earth that we do not know so when the V-Caps give me a better sound so i accept it. I will then of cause try to find a measurement that explains it. That is the way i work.
Well then based on your same line of reasoning you can use instead of wima a different type or a much cheaper one and nothing will change.
Of course to answer to your question vcaps measure superior but in terms of ESR and dissipation factor.
These parameters itself don't influence the overall measurements of your circuit.
Look online as there are some very regarded people who have done a shoot out of capacitors and it is undeniable that every cap sounds different but yet you have to acknowledge that circuit won't measure any different...so what?
The choice of a capacitor is of course subjective but so is the choice of an entire circuit vs another one.
I will further say that several times a circuit with lower measured performance has been chosen over the one full if feedback self's style which had 4 zeros in for t if the distortion figure.
What that tells you?
It tells me at least that in designing a circuit your ears must play an important role that if you disregard you won't really succeed in designing true madretpieces.
Also I use my measurement to perfect a circuit that my ears have already selected not viceversa.
I use balance on this and trying to keep in mind that I am making a musical instrument and NOT an industrial piece of equipment that have to pass ESD, temperature, vibration tests and so on.
At the end of the day I realize you are not going to change your opinion and I doubt that even if you hear something better your rational section will deny it because you can't find a measurement that explains it.
Also this is a very argumentative never ending subject therefore I think it would be smarter to end it here and if one day you try vcaps or other caps and you want to share your opinion...please do I will be very curious to know your thoughts on that!
Of course to answer to your question vcaps measure superior but in terms of ESR and dissipation factor.
These parameters itself don't influence the overall measurements of your circuit.
Look online as there are some very regarded people who have done a shoot out of capacitors and it is undeniable that every cap sounds different but yet you have to acknowledge that circuit won't measure any different...so what?
The choice of a capacitor is of course subjective but so is the choice of an entire circuit vs another one.
I will further say that several times a circuit with lower measured performance has been chosen over the one full if feedback self's style which had 4 zeros in for t if the distortion figure.
What that tells you?
It tells me at least that in designing a circuit your ears must play an important role that if you disregard you won't really succeed in designing true madretpieces.
Also I use my measurement to perfect a circuit that my ears have already selected not viceversa.
I use balance on this and trying to keep in mind that I am making a musical instrument and NOT an industrial piece of equipment that have to pass ESD, temperature, vibration tests and so on.
At the end of the day I realize you are not going to change your opinion and I doubt that even if you hear something better your rational section will deny it because you can't find a measurement that explains it.
Also this is a very argumentative never ending subject therefore I think it would be smarter to end it here and if one day you try vcaps or other caps and you want to share your opinion...please do I will be very curious to know your thoughts on that!
I do not have an opinion, that is the difference. Otherwise i could not design.
I would say that i designed more top High End products then many here.
I won listening contests, got title pages, interviews etc.
I certainly do not have a problem to judge a design by listening alone and i have a panel of famous and experienced people that i trust.
Take the Calvin Buffer for example. It measures better and it sounds better.
What you also have to consider is that in the Paradise and Masterpiece we use CONSTANT CURRENT to supply the RIAA. That way dielectric absorption and ESR really do not play a big role. The impedance of the mirrors is so high that impedance changes in the caps are swapped. I call that a big advantage. What i think is audible is the mechanical design of the cap and V-Caps may have an advantage there or not.
I also said before that a GOOD sounding amplifier that measures not optimum may simply hide flaws in the recording. You only know better when you have heard true transparency.
I would say that i designed more top High End products then many here.
I won listening contests, got title pages, interviews etc.
I certainly do not have a problem to judge a design by listening alone and i have a panel of famous and experienced people that i trust.
Take the Calvin Buffer for example. It measures better and it sounds better.
What you also have to consider is that in the Paradise and Masterpiece we use CONSTANT CURRENT to supply the RIAA. That way dielectric absorption and ESR really do not play a big role. The impedance of the mirrors is so high that impedance changes in the caps are swapped. I call that a big advantage. What i think is audible is the mechanical design of the cap and V-Caps may have an advantage there or not.
I also said before that a GOOD sounding amplifier that measures not optimum may simply hide flaws in the recording. You only know better when you have heard true transparency.
Don't want to continue this subject on this 3d as I don't want to spam it more with useless crap...maybe one day we can open up a dedicated 3d and do a shoot out of cap or wires or other foolish audiophiles fetish and maybe you can have fun finding a justification for the different sounds!
Hi Stefano,
you know i know everything you did to promote those caps.
I believe you have no financial interest in this case.
I did not attack you.
On the other hand,
until now the response of those who bought theese little creeps
are not as enthusiastic as expected.
The only thing i've asked for was;
allmost everybody on any paradise-thread had to read constantly
about theese thigies, boring.
I do not think they fit to everybodys taste in every circuit.
I know this is going to expose once more how little I understand but I need to ask anyways - whats the input impedance of the paradise without resistors in parallel?
Reason for my question is I am going to implement a rotary switch for input resisors and I'm trying to figure out how high values work. E.g. there are Grados that work best around 47k. At this point the input impedance of the circuit probably becomes a factor?
Thanks
Sven
- whats the input impedance of the paradise without resistors in parallel? Reason for my question is I am going to implement a rotary switch for input resisors and I'm trying to figure out how high values work. E.g. there are Grados that work best around 47k. At this point the input impedance of the circuit probably becomes a factor?
Thanks
Sven
What response have you seen that I didn't?
Please link them as the only feedback I got so far was only this one and seemed to be fairly positive.