remp,
Don't lose sight of the fact that I <i>am</i> a South Carolinian. It's not as though I'm speaking of some other, completely separate class of people. Who better to call for improvement than someone on the inside? My point, stated above, is not to be average. Don't contribute to the problem. Try as best you can to <i>fix</i> the problem. I acknowledge that it's an uphill battle, as people get emotional over what should be an intellectual issue. That clouds the matter.
I have never editted a thread, even when I was the Moderator.
Doesn't mean I wasn't tempted sometimes...
However (speaking as a author now), I chose freedom of speech, even when I disagreed.
'Protecting Grey's good name.' Hmmm. I dunno about that. As I said once backstage, I'm quite adept at creating enough havoc on my own. If I've got a guardian angel, it's news to me. Given the circumstances, perhaps they should protect me from myself, rather than protecting me from others.
1/137,
One of my degrees is in Psych. I found it fascinating, but ultimately decided that it was only useful in certain narrowly defined situations. By all means, if you think you can get a grade out of this, have at it.
I'll give you a very powerful rule of human behavior (I didn't get it in class): A person will always do what feels best or hurts least. Always.
If, then, they do something that surprises you, you don't understand their point of view on pain and happiness.
I find myself in a bind, ethically speaking (not unlike, say, Asimov's robots). I have caused suffering, which is bad. I caused the suffering with intention of causing eventual greater good, which is good (hopefully).
But which is greater?
Grey
P.S.: I would be remiss if I did not note that remp is quite correct in his point about his asking for safety notices. As long as we don't tie our hands to the point that we can no longer work, I am in complete agreement with him on this. I'm just taking it a step further, that's all.
Don't lose sight of the fact that I <i>am</i> a South Carolinian. It's not as though I'm speaking of some other, completely separate class of people. Who better to call for improvement than someone on the inside? My point, stated above, is not to be average. Don't contribute to the problem. Try as best you can to <i>fix</i> the problem. I acknowledge that it's an uphill battle, as people get emotional over what should be an intellectual issue. That clouds the matter.
I have never editted a thread, even when I was the Moderator.
Doesn't mean I wasn't tempted sometimes...
However (speaking as a author now), I chose freedom of speech, even when I disagreed.
'Protecting Grey's good name.' Hmmm. I dunno about that. As I said once backstage, I'm quite adept at creating enough havoc on my own. If I've got a guardian angel, it's news to me. Given the circumstances, perhaps they should protect me from myself, rather than protecting me from others.
1/137,
One of my degrees is in Psych. I found it fascinating, but ultimately decided that it was only useful in certain narrowly defined situations. By all means, if you think you can get a grade out of this, have at it.
I'll give you a very powerful rule of human behavior (I didn't get it in class): A person will always do what feels best or hurts least. Always.
If, then, they do something that surprises you, you don't understand their point of view on pain and happiness.
I find myself in a bind, ethically speaking (not unlike, say, Asimov's robots). I have caused suffering, which is bad. I caused the suffering with intention of causing eventual greater good, which is good (hopefully).
But which is greater?
Grey
P.S.: I would be remiss if I did not note that remp is quite correct in his point about his asking for safety notices. As long as we don't tie our hands to the point that we can no longer work, I am in complete agreement with him on this. I'm just taking it a step further, that's all.
remp,
no idea what happened. I go and dig your post, it should still exist. I merge it into this thread if i find it, does that suit you?
Of course it is not our intention to suppress things we dont like, as stated elsewhere, no censorship content-wise.
We have a stack of post stucked away as we thought removing it from public sight prevents struggle, flame war or in the case of porn links, lawsuits the site cannot afford. It has been discussed to make these posts visble again in a forum board probably called trash bin or purgatory or however and to lock this board for posting but enabling anyone to look up evidence if he wants to wade thru the mess. We are working on it. Ok?
Then,
i am afraid i have to second your point.
I read Grey's post 1st and thought ouch!! but then Greys second post made his point understandable and i see clearly why he is so emotionally engaged in his point.
Nevertheless, having a point and being right with it does not justify presenting the point with such a redundant overfoaming lack of intuitive fine feeling.
Grey,
i agree with our point but i do think that such a message can be transported without handing out out insults or generalizations on average IQ related to lightbulb wattage.
Others members obvioulsy felt offended by it (and atleast two of them not being sockpuppets
). BTW everytime i read a generalization, my intellect feels insulted.
And, agreed, sometimes hurting can be unavoidable to be able to help. But i do not see this case here and if i can help without hurting, i always prefer that.
We all live by the same rules here, even if they are not perfect.
Comments?
no idea what happened. I go and dig your post, it should still exist. I merge it into this thread if i find it, does that suit you?
Of course it is not our intention to suppress things we dont like, as stated elsewhere, no censorship content-wise.
We have a stack of post stucked away as we thought removing it from public sight prevents struggle, flame war or in the case of porn links, lawsuits the site cannot afford. It has been discussed to make these posts visble again in a forum board probably called trash bin or purgatory or however and to lock this board for posting but enabling anyone to look up evidence if he wants to wade thru the mess. We are working on it. Ok?
Then,
i am afraid i have to second your point.
I read Grey's post 1st and thought ouch!! but then Greys second post made his point understandable and i see clearly why he is so emotionally engaged in his point.
Nevertheless, having a point and being right with it does not justify presenting the point with such a redundant overfoaming lack of intuitive fine feeling.
Grey,
i agree with our point but i do think that such a message can be transported without handing out out insults or generalizations on average IQ related to lightbulb wattage.
Others members obvioulsy felt offended by it (and atleast two of them not being sockpuppets
). BTW everytime i read a generalization, my intellect feels insulted. And, agreed, sometimes hurting can be unavoidable to be able to help. But i do not see this case here and if i can help without hurting, i always prefer that.
We all live by the same rules here, even if they are not perfect.
Comments?
I think Grey has some valid points regarding education. I think one could create a resource for newbies (did I smell wiki somewhere) with such links with high educational content. Tutorials such as the passivecrossovers.com one are very useful and would be the cherry on top. The links as provided on the main page are ok, but a wiki-page with resources for newbies would be really useful. Alternatively one could make another section for just this and link to it in the permanent thread on the Introductions page.
As to the “equality before the law” I think that all of us are fallible human beings and some people say things, which might not be interpreted with the original intent by others. I for one suffer from foot-in-mouth disease acutely in real life and can appreciate people like H.H who campaign (in bad taste at times in his case unfortunately, others too funny for words) against a certain attitude and put people like me back into line where needed, but that is just me and everybody has to accept that everybody else is different. I quite like my reality check every now and then and this whole episode has taught me a little more about people.
One should also not forget that Grey is a writer and that as such he might take some more liberties in his art than most.
Remember that it is but human to err and that you yourself might not appreciate it if I were to call for your public shaming if you were to make a mistake.
Only my 2c
Martin
As to the “equality before the law” I think that all of us are fallible human beings and some people say things, which might not be interpreted with the original intent by others. I for one suffer from foot-in-mouth disease acutely in real life and can appreciate people like H.H who campaign (in bad taste at times in his case unfortunately, others too funny for words) against a certain attitude and put people like me back into line where needed, but that is just me and everybody has to accept that everybody else is different. I quite like my reality check every now and then and this whole episode has taught me a little more about people.
One should also not forget that Grey is a writer and that as such he might take some more liberties in his art than most.
Remember that it is but human to err and that you yourself might not appreciate it if I were to call for your public shaming if you were to make a mistake.
Only my 2c
Martin
Okay, let's tilt at another windmill: generalization.
(We've got a rule against generalizing? Yikes! Maybe I should go reread the rules.)
What does it mean to generalize? Well, you're painting with a broad brush, running the risk of including people who shouldn't be included in your target group. They may, depending on their point of view, get insulted...or they may understand and agree with the broader point. It's hard to predict.
The cover of <i>Playboy</i> magazine has a small subtitle which says "Entertainment for men." Once upon a time, someone took them to task for their choice of words. A woman, as I recall. Her point was that some women read and enjoy the magazine too; some straight, some lesbians, each for their own reasons. That would tend to invalidate the 'men' generalization, yes? <i>Playboy's</i> reply was quite humorous, and I wish I could recall it verbatim, but the general idea was that by the time they said,"Entertainment for heterosexual men who are not offended by nudes, or happen to like interviews with famous people, or fiction, or for homosexual men who just want to read the print, or for women who are homosexual and might like the pictures, or might happen to enjoy interviews...and for raccoons who might be interested in humans," or some such. They concluded that by the time they got so specific as to include only those who wanted to be included, and exclude only those who wanted to be excluded, and left the gate open for those who wanted to read only on occasion, the entire cover would be filled with fine print and there would be no room left for the name of the magazine, let alone pictures or the teasers for the print features within.
Sometimes it's more efficient to generalize and let people sort out their own reactions. As often as possible you have to trust them to do so with a modicum of intelligence.
There's also the 'throwing the rock at the car' aspect. If I outrage a few folks from around these parts and they go to look at the facts in an attempt to prove me wrong, they'll get a shock. Perhaps they'll sit back and think about it. Then maybe get involved, even if only with their own kids.
Not a bad thing, eh?
But it's easier to react viscerally than to think. I do it myself. The trick is to catch yourself and see if this is actually a fight or flight crisis. Or maybe, just maybe, it's a chance to employ your mind instead.
www.collegeboard.com
(I should have included this earlier. They're the people who administer the SAT tests. I'll leave it as an exercise for the reader to track down economic data, etc. I could make another observation that relates directly to the education/economics issue, but I've already upset enough people for one day and this truly would start a ruckus. None of us need it. Let's talk about the situation as it stands now.)
Grey
(We've got a rule against generalizing? Yikes! Maybe I should go reread the rules.)
What does it mean to generalize? Well, you're painting with a broad brush, running the risk of including people who shouldn't be included in your target group. They may, depending on their point of view, get insulted...or they may understand and agree with the broader point. It's hard to predict.
The cover of <i>Playboy</i> magazine has a small subtitle which says "Entertainment for men." Once upon a time, someone took them to task for their choice of words. A woman, as I recall. Her point was that some women read and enjoy the magazine too; some straight, some lesbians, each for their own reasons. That would tend to invalidate the 'men' generalization, yes? <i>Playboy's</i> reply was quite humorous, and I wish I could recall it verbatim, but the general idea was that by the time they said,"Entertainment for heterosexual men who are not offended by nudes, or happen to like interviews with famous people, or fiction, or for homosexual men who just want to read the print, or for women who are homosexual and might like the pictures, or might happen to enjoy interviews...and for raccoons who might be interested in humans," or some such. They concluded that by the time they got so specific as to include only those who wanted to be included, and exclude only those who wanted to be excluded, and left the gate open for those who wanted to read only on occasion, the entire cover would be filled with fine print and there would be no room left for the name of the magazine, let alone pictures or the teasers for the print features within.
Sometimes it's more efficient to generalize and let people sort out their own reactions. As often as possible you have to trust them to do so with a modicum of intelligence.
There's also the 'throwing the rock at the car' aspect. If I outrage a few folks from around these parts and they go to look at the facts in an attempt to prove me wrong, they'll get a shock. Perhaps they'll sit back and think about it. Then maybe get involved, even if only with their own kids.
Not a bad thing, eh?
But it's easier to react viscerally than to think. I do it myself. The trick is to catch yourself and see if this is actually a fight or flight crisis. Or maybe, just maybe, it's a chance to employ your mind instead.
www.collegeboard.com
(I should have included this earlier. They're the people who administer the SAT tests. I'll leave it as an exercise for the reader to track down economic data, etc. I could make another observation that relates directly to the education/economics issue, but I've already upset enough people for one day and this truly would start a ruckus. None of us need it. Let's talk about the situation as it stands now.)
Grey
Grey
If I used the word Moron in the same context as a group of people and then also said take any average 5 Southern Caraliner's and their IQ would be less than a light bulb I am certain the moderators would put me in the sin bin immediatly and rightly so.
Dice45.
You asked for comments
Thanks for the explaination. It does not satisfy me at all. I need to know that the moderators treat all persons in the same way otherwise we are having a class system where one can get away with certain comments and others cannot. Especially if one is considered a "good" and "valuable" poster. No offence intended.
My suggestion for a two weeks sin bin of course was just arbitrary. Could be two days. Or you could say two weeks sin bin and then suspend it so the person concerned only does 2 days or so. Or a suspended sentance. Depends how valuable the person concerned is.
Should be the same for everyone.
If I used the word Moron in the same context as a group of people and then also said take any average 5 Southern Caraliner's and their IQ would be less than a light bulb I am certain the moderators would put me in the sin bin immediatly and rightly so.
Dice45.
You asked for comments
Thanks for the explaination. It does not satisfy me at all. I need to know that the moderators treat all persons in the same way otherwise we are having a class system where one can get away with certain comments and others cannot. Especially if one is considered a "good" and "valuable" poster. No offence intended.
My suggestion for a two weeks sin bin of course was just arbitrary. Could be two days. Or you could say two weeks sin bin and then suspend it so the person concerned only does 2 days or so. Or a suspended sentance. Depends how valuable the person concerned is.
Should be the same for everyone.
remp,
i have changed my opinion quite dramatically the last few hours, and i am probably about to make a kingsize fool out of me. But on the day i am going to nod to Ken L's post and to give Fred, our kingsize sinner, a chance to come back into the community, i am not handing out an unconditional 2weeks sin bin for Grey.
I may have started to spin loose but i kept a rest of sense for proportion.
But, remp, you do lot leave me a hole to escape, you are right with demanding equal treatment. Even if it is a formal necessity, not keeping it would be the wrong sign.
Fellow moderators have hinted repeatedly we could split such a sentence into a small unconditional portionand a big suspended/parole portion. So, let's try that out (helps me keep a sense of proportion ): 2weeks sin bin for Grey, to keep the message, to maintain equality.
1 day unconditional, the rest suspended.
Grey,
could you please rephrase the statement that caused the ruckus after the 1 day of unconditional sin bin is over?
I personally did not like the generalization but generalizing is just my personal thing. we would not find an end if we would persecute that. I am certain you read my post made backstage, i used an example quite drastic, would i post it here in public, i as German would have to turn myself in immediately and resign from any further office here.
The issue is that you used "moron" and "IQ" and "light bulb wattage" in a context sensed as insult by several members including me. It would certainly not hurt if you apologize for it. Heck, is that so difficult?
One thing,
we moderators have it made a practise to avoid retrospective sentencing but none of us is protected from remembering the member's history and spirit when we "hold out thumb into the wind" to determine how much sentence is appropriate. In that respect, let's not fool ourselves, in that respect there is no equal treatment.
Ken L,
Fred,
you've got your chance, don't mess it up, make the best of it.
Oops, i forgot to ask you if you want it that way. **** happens.
###edit dice45###
i wrote "Sheet" happens....
I apologize for breaking formal rules
. Just trying to catch possible peanut counting.
i have changed my opinion quite dramatically the last few hours, and i am probably about to make a kingsize fool out of me. But on the day i am going to nod to Ken L's post and to give Fred, our kingsize sinner, a chance to come back into the community, i am not handing out an unconditional 2weeks sin bin for Grey.
I may have started to spin loose but i kept a rest of sense for proportion.
But, remp, you do lot leave me a hole to escape, you are right with demanding equal treatment. Even if it is a formal necessity, not keeping it would be the wrong sign.
Fellow moderators have hinted repeatedly we could split such a sentence into a small unconditional portionand a big suspended/parole portion. So, let's try that out (helps me keep a sense of proportion
): 2weeks sin bin for Grey, to keep the message, to maintain equality.1 day unconditional, the rest suspended.
Grey,
could you please rephrase the statement that caused the ruckus after the 1 day of unconditional sin bin is over?
I personally did not like the generalization but generalizing is just my personal thing. we would not find an end if we would persecute that. I am certain you read my post made backstage, i used an example quite drastic, would i post it here in public, i as German would have to turn myself in immediately and resign from any further office here.
The issue is that you used "moron" and "IQ" and "light bulb wattage" in a context sensed as insult by several members including me. It would certainly not hurt if you apologize for it. Heck, is that so difficult?
One thing,
we moderators have it made a practise to avoid retrospective sentencing but none of us is protected from remembering the member's history and spirit when we "hold out thumb into the wind" to determine how much sentence is appropriate. In that respect, let's not fool ourselves, in that respect there is no equal treatment.
Ken L,
fully agreed and that you as member, as non-moderator, post this makes me wear a big silly grin. Remember, i am starting to spin loose, so i give your suggestion a try.
Fred,
you've got your chance, don't mess it up, make the best of it.
Oops, i forgot to ask you if you want it that way. **** happens.
###edit dice45###
i wrote "Sheet" happens.
... I apologize for breaking formal rules
. Just trying to catch possible peanut counting.
Bernhard,
I'm not so sure this is fair. Whilst nothing Grey said offended me personally (I'm very thick skinned), other people have been slapped for similar infractions. Yet Grey gets a 1 day binning, and you bin Frank for two weeks, because he pointed out, in a fairly blunt way I admit, some of the follies in your pet diy TT project. LMAO. FTR, I read the posts before you deleted them.
Secondly, grey said something in a previous post about being a moderator, although his tag just says 'enlightened' (misnomer!). If this is the case, then the slap should be even harder than a normal member would get, as those who are there to enforce the rules, when they break them, deserve a tougher punishment.
I'm not out to get Grey, but there is an inconsistency in moderation here, and it's at the cost of your credibility and respect.
That's my say for the moment.
I'm not so sure this is fair. Whilst nothing Grey said offended me personally (I'm very thick skinned), other people have been slapped for similar infractions. Yet Grey gets a 1 day binning, and you bin Frank for two weeks, because he pointed out, in a fairly blunt way I admit, some of the follies in your pet diy TT project. LMAO. FTR, I read the posts before you deleted them.
Secondly, grey said something in a previous post about being a moderator, although his tag just says 'enlightened' (misnomer!). If this is the case, then the slap should be even harder than a normal member would get, as those who are there to enforce the rules, when they break them, deserve a tougher punishment.
I'm not out to get Grey, but there is an inconsistency in moderation here, and it's at the cost of your credibility and respect.
That's my say for the moment.
Fred,Grey and all to follow.
Brett,
Thank you for defending me.
It should not have happened in the first place.
My mistake,so I paid for it.
To all concerned:
Grey,you made your point eloquently and I strongly adhere to the principle of free speach.
Surely you are very frustrated with the situation in your state which is very understandable.
It is however IMO rather tactless to blame the nation and you could have expected the reaction of your fellow countrymen.
The problem of education is a global one and since you live in a democratic country there is some hope left if power is enstowed on those who deserve it.
Politicians are no more or less human then the rest of us so you're bound to have a fair percentage of good ones and bad ones.
Playing Don Quichote in life is noble yet very frustating in the end.
Forcefeeding the young with knowledge will only drive them away from you.
Concentrating on those that are eager to learn can be very gratifying and would generate the energy to continue the teaching process.
Never expect anyone to thank you for it and you will avoid disappointment and frustration.
Also,if someone expresses the feeling you should be sinbinned for sharing your experiences with all of us you should not jump to conclusions and run away.
I am convinced that there was no such thing as a common consensus at that point and I don't think there is any now.
So I ask you kindly to share your knowledge with the others once again.
Rather than a sentence I think an apology to all that felt offended
by your statements would be welcome.
Not doing so would be insulting your own intelligence,the great men on this planet are those who learn from their mistakes.
Bygones.
To all moderators in general,
Are you letting Fred in again?
I wonder if anyone learned anything from the past.
How many chances has he gotten already?
Anyway,since I feel that it is virtually impossible technically to deny someone access it may just as well be wise to invite them in.
Provided they live by the forum rules.
I can't say I know Fred's background here entirely but from what we all can see,Fred and Grey were always like cat and mouse.
Are they going to be able to share the same space and not argue?
I wonder.
In one of his later posts under the Elwood nym,I think,Fred opened up to all of us and I was moved by it.
I would even be more touched if he had the courage to register again on the forum under his real name with a valid e-mail address and location.
Fred,I challenge you.
All in all favouritism is human,but is also something a judge can not afford to display.
Doing so will inevetably distroy all his credibility.
I notice quite a lot of people actually caring about keeping the forum live and you can count me in on that too.
The caveat is that when you get too emotionally involved with your loved one you risk to loose perspective as you try to shape it into an image of yourself,at the end something will break.
So much for my share in this catharsis,
Brett,
Thank you for defending me.
It should not have happened in the first place.
My mistake,so I paid for it.
To all concerned:
Grey,you made your point eloquently and I strongly adhere to the principle of free speach.
Surely you are very frustrated with the situation in your state which is very understandable.
It is however IMO rather tactless to blame the nation and you could have expected the reaction of your fellow countrymen.
The problem of education is a global one and since you live in a democratic country there is some hope left if power is enstowed on those who deserve it.
Politicians are no more or less human then the rest of us so you're bound to have a fair percentage of good ones and bad ones.
Playing Don Quichote in life is noble yet very frustating in the end.
Forcefeeding the young with knowledge will only drive them away from you.
Concentrating on those that are eager to learn can be very gratifying and would generate the energy to continue the teaching process.
Never expect anyone to thank you for it and you will avoid disappointment and frustration.
Also,if someone expresses the feeling you should be sinbinned for sharing your experiences with all of us you should not jump to conclusions and run away.
I am convinced that there was no such thing as a common consensus at that point and I don't think there is any now.
So I ask you kindly to share your knowledge with the others once again.
Rather than a sentence I think an apology to all that felt offended
by your statements would be welcome.
Not doing so would be insulting your own intelligence,the great men on this planet are those who learn from their mistakes.
Bygones.
To all moderators in general,
Are you letting Fred in again?
I wonder if anyone learned anything from the past.
How many chances has he gotten already?
Anyway,since I feel that it is virtually impossible technically to deny someone access it may just as well be wise to invite them in.
Provided they live by the forum rules.
I can't say I know Fred's background here entirely but from what we all can see,Fred and Grey were always like cat and mouse.
Are they going to be able to share the same space and not argue?
I wonder.
In one of his later posts under the Elwood nym,I think,Fred opened up to all of us and I was moved by it.
I would even be more touched if he had the courage to register again on the forum under his real name with a valid e-mail address and location.
Fred,I challenge you.
All in all favouritism is human,but is also something a judge can not afford to display.
Doing so will inevetably distroy all his credibility.
I notice quite a lot of people actually caring about keeping the forum live and you can count me in on that too.
The caveat is that when you get too emotionally involved with your loved one you risk to loose perspective as you try to shape it into an image of yourself,at the end something will break.
So much for my share in this catharsis,
Brett,
i just knew i would get my beating.
I am sure Grey read your post and learned you are not his best fan. I know you are not my best fan. Ok, Grey's concept of the world and mine are similar, probably yours is very different.
However, what we two have in advance to Grey and Fred: You and me never had a serious row, so far we succeeded in keeping respectful distance, IMO we succeeded with ease, without effort. And i want to add, i learned a lot from your posts. Just was to busy, have to admit, ##OT## the LL1660/12B4 combination is wrong and you were right being puzzled about that ##/OT##
All,
At the moment i am just trying to do my moderator job. I am not taking care that spoiled lil' egos of strugglers are caressed, i have as final goal that (okok, i am dreaming ) that people who are sick about each other at the moment end up in atleast talking with each other, paying each other basic mutual respect acknowledging the other **highly subjective** POV as potentially justified.
If Grey and Fred finally see what they can learn from each other, repeat: learn from each other, benefit from eack other, realize how they both lost grasp on reality and are spinning loose as far as the other person is concerned, if they atleast talk with each other, then i have done a good job.
I have been called to lighten up, be several, Fred included. So
, i try a swing at it: Hey this is a forum, just a forum and we all are here to share ideas and methods and have fun together 
.
We are not here to tell the other how intergalactically stupid he is, we are here to mutually ignite further ideas.
Holy Grail talk: ideas are spiritual beings, they lead a life of their own. We humans are only the crystal cup the ideas choose to sit in for a while. Does it matter in which cup the ideas sit in? No. All that matters is: there is a bright idea and , provided the other cup permits sharing, you have access to it, too, use it and be happy with it or even have the idea who accidentally decided to sit in your cup copulate with the other idea and give birth to a new one.
No point in jumping at each other's throat.
Can we go back to discussing audio? Music?
### rant mode ###
For the record, i brained for years over a simple and easy-to-use vacuum system with recordv excentricity compensation for my platter and although usually i am quite a wiz in simple solutions, i failed in having a vision of a record clamp, centerpin, sealing, easy-to-apply excentricity marking. Then peterr (i hope in rememeber that right, to tired to dig it up now, have a look yourself in the monstrous DIY TT thread) comes up with that small vacuum sucking plug, an undersized centerpin and, for geometrically excentric records, a non-concentrically drawn pencil circle on the record label. And while it is not a complete solution, peterr's is exactly the jigsaw piece i was unable to come up with, it fell right into place; together with the simple marking microscop jig i hassled out, using cheapo surplus optic components.
There is this system complete now. And BTW, the expensive record clamp has become obsolete except for those rare cases the vacuum system in unable to cope with.
Peterr's ideas and mine had sex and gave birth to a new child.
I see you and me and quite a couple of others on this level of idea exchange. Easy. And, it does not matter if the idea sits in a newbie cup. Right?
Fred (and cannot help feeling, Grey too): To reach that plateau, still a couple of miles to walk.
### /rant mode ###
Justice is of enormous importance to me, and as moderator, i take a swing at it wherever possible, although i know, it is poor enough. I just want to remind the community that our legal apparatus is WAY to small to work properly as we know it (hopefully) from the governments we all are living under. Due to not having enough staff, we do not even have different persons for
and 
.
There are other ethical values to keep in mind, too. And if soothing poor injustified souls keeps them stuck in their status quo, keeps them stuck in feeling sore at each other, pecking at each other, i refuse to do it.
Getting people to bury their tomahawk of war and to share ideas is an ethical goal way higher to me then letting formal justice happen. This directed my decision.
In this case: putting Grey into 2 weeks sin bin for a minor and singulary goof (i hope he sees it is a goof
) and suspending Fred's ban synchronously is completely counterproductive if i want them both to arrive at finally talking with each other.
fdegrove,
please feel adressed too by what i wrote to Brett. And please read this post.
All,
Fred is already registered, i did it for him,
with his real name and a valid email adress. Making sure noone else snatches his own name away from him. All he has to do is using it, making good use from it.
So folks, sincerly,
can we go back to discussing audio and to soldering? And music?
i just knew i would get my beating.
I am sure Grey read your post and learned you are not his best fan. I know you are not my best fan. Ok, Grey's concept of the world and mine are similar, probably yours is very different.
However, what we two have in advance to Grey and Fred: You and me never had a serious row, so far we succeeded in keeping respectful distance, IMO we succeeded with ease, without effort. And i want to add, i learned a lot from your posts. Just was to busy, have to admit, ##OT## the LL1660/12B4 combination is wrong and you were right being puzzled about that ##/OT##
All,
At the moment i am just trying to do my moderator job. I am not taking care that spoiled lil' egos of strugglers are caressed, i have as final goal that (okok, i am dreaming
) that people who are sick about each other at the moment end up in atleast talking with each other, paying each other basic mutual respect acknowledging the other **highly subjective** POV as potentially justified.If Grey and Fred finally see what they can learn from each other, repeat: learn from each other, benefit from eack other, realize how they both lost grasp on reality and are spinning loose as far as the other person is concerned, if they atleast talk with each other, then i have done a good job.
I have been called to lighten up, be several, Fred included. So
, i try a swing at it: Hey this is a forum, just a forum and we all are here to share ideas and methods and have fun together . We are not here to tell the other how intergalactically stupid he is, we are here to mutually ignite further ideas.
Holy Grail talk: ideas are spiritual beings, they lead a life of their own. We humans are only the crystal cup the ideas choose to sit in for a while. Does it matter in which cup the ideas sit in? No. All that matters is: there is a bright idea and , provided the other cup permits sharing, you have access to it, too, use it and be happy with it or even have the idea who accidentally decided to sit in your cup copulate with the other idea and give birth to a new one.
No point in jumping at each other's throat.
Can we go back to discussing audio? Music?
### rant mode ###
For the record, i brained for years over a simple and easy-to-use vacuum system with recordv excentricity compensation for my platter and although usually i am quite a wiz in simple solutions, i failed in having a vision of a record clamp, centerpin, sealing, easy-to-apply excentricity marking. Then peterr (i hope in rememeber that right, to tired to dig it up now, have a look yourself in the monstrous DIY TT thread) comes up with that small vacuum sucking plug, an undersized centerpin and, for geometrically excentric records, a non-concentrically drawn pencil circle on the record label. And while it is not a complete solution, peterr's is exactly the jigsaw piece i was unable to come up with, it fell right into place; together with the simple marking microscop jig i hassled out, using cheapo surplus optic components.
There is this system complete now. And BTW, the expensive record clamp has become obsolete except for those rare cases the vacuum system in unable to cope with.
Peterr's ideas and mine had sex and gave birth to a new child.
I see you and me and quite a couple of others on this level of idea exchange. Easy. And, it does not matter if the idea sits in a newbie cup. Right?
Fred (and cannot help feeling, Grey too): To reach that plateau, still a couple of miles to walk.
### /rant mode ###
Justice is of enormous importance to me, and as moderator, i take a swing at it wherever possible, although i know, it is poor enough. I just want to remind the community that our legal apparatus is WAY to small to work properly as we know it (hopefully) from the governments we all are living under. Due to not having enough staff, we do not even have different persons for
and .There are other ethical values to keep in mind, too. And if soothing poor injustified souls keeps them stuck in their status quo, keeps them stuck in feeling sore at each other, pecking at each other, i refuse to do it.
Getting people to bury their tomahawk of war and to share ideas is an ethical goal way higher to me then letting formal justice happen. This directed my decision.
In this case: putting Grey into 2 weeks sin bin for a minor and singulary goof (i hope he sees it is a goof
) and suspending Fred's ban synchronously is completely counterproductive if i want them both to arrive at finally talking with each other.fdegrove,
please feel adressed too by what i wrote to Brett. And please read this post.
All,
Fred is already registered, i did it for him,
with his real name and a valid email adress. Making sure noone else snatches his own name away from him. All he has to do is using it, making good use from it.
So folks, sincerly,
can we go back to discussing audio and to soldering? And music?
Brett said:
Brett said:
If it starts with Grey, it's just a coincidence (or a good opportunity
), but you were the one saying that we were too tight. If we decided to ease things up and lighten up, you shouldn't be the first one to complain. It's just like a song says: "The Times They Are A-Changin'." Let's enjoy 'em while we can.
Frank,
there are no stupid QQ, only stupid answers
Go down to thread page, there is a link "subscribe to this thread". Select it, done.
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I hope this featrue has not changed, long ago i used it.
there are no stupid QQ, only stupid answers
Go down to thread page, there is a link "subscribe to this thread". Select it, done.
To unsubscribe, go to your member profile, unsubscribe there.
It may be necessary that you edit your option profile so that you receive emails whan someone has posted in a subscibe thead.
I hope this featrue has not changed, long ago i used it.
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