yeah - he's no html expert!
If you want the original 1950's article I have it - let me know.
Shoog (posts here) designed another variation on this theme - check Shoog's posts here from around 7 months ago (from memory). Ping Shoog if you like - best way....
THe EL84 doesn't need lots of drive in either current or voltage so a nice linear triode up front in the ultracompact / oddwatt design is all thats required. Bruce's love affair with the srpp front end is endearing, but not a design necessity imo.
Thanks for the hints. The Leibowitz article is at Compact Hi-Fi Power Amplifier by Melvin Leibowitz
I'll look for the Shoog posts.
I noticed in the Leibowitz article that the 6C4 would have too much gain for typical CD/line input these days, I think.
Anyway, a bit off-topic here. Back to the regular programming....
Is this the Shoog circuit you were thinking of? (Seems to fit the bill....)
The thread is at http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/149674-my-version-simple-el84-rise-anti-triode.html
Looks interesting...too many projects......too many projects!
BTW, the EL86=6CW5 which is one of the tubes that can be used in the SimplePP.
The thread is at http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/tubes-valves/149674-my-version-simple-el84-rise-anti-triode.html
Looks interesting...too many projects......too many projects!
BTW, the EL86=6CW5 which is one of the tubes that can be used in the SimplePP.
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Sorry for being a bit of these last days, I have not had any time to check the thread. I have read all the posts and it looks like all of you agree about that the Shoog schematic is good way to start. I have looked at the schematic and it does not look to complicated to build. Is it going to be sufficient enough to power my two speakers?
@VictoriaGuy: Is it okay it I msg you with more specific questions about the schematic?
@VictoriaGuy: Is it okay it I msg you with more specific questions about the schematic?
I wouldn't say that all of us recommend the Shoog as a first project for you, but I'm pretty confident that it is a good amp, after looking at the schematic and the other amps in that 'family'. I think you actually got a few suggestions for the Tubelab SimplePP?
Complicated? Well, it is complex enough -remember the schematic is showing only one channel, and you have to design/add a power supply. But certainly not impossible, at all.
re:speakers. First, unless your speakers are particularly expensive, I don't think you should focus on them too much. If you get output transformers with 4 ohm taps you will be able to drive your speakers well.
Feel free to msg me, but I really know nothing about that amp by Shoog. Just saw it a couple of days ago, and put it on my 'build some day' list. You should contact Shoog directly, or ask Aardvarkish here, for advice from somebody who knows what they are talking about when it comes to amp theory.
My current projects are (another) RH84 and the tubelab SimplePP (once George ships the board to me); I'm happy to chat about them or any of the amps in the list I posted in an earlier reply.
John
O i forgot to write about that one. I Googled it and got a hit Simple P-P
It s a bit messy webpage but after some googleing and random clicking i finally found how to order the board. Well in this case I can go either way. Might even be a good idé to start with a board from George to start with. If you recommend me to start with the SimplePP i will do so. In my novice perspective I just think it looks cool with big bulbs and the SimplePP got one huge one (according to the picture)
for a first approach, I'd go with the Simple pp from Tubelab. There is plenty of support available on this site (Tubelab has its own forum) and George is affable and helpful to a fault. He is in a pretty busy life period at present - don't expect immediate answers in person from him...
No disrespect to shoog, but the design is (as far as I know) a one-off and doesn't have the range of attempt and success that provides support for a new builder.
The basic oddwatt / ultracompact does have track record and is the simplest in terms of parts count.
Eli will no doubt come in with a bid for the "el-cheapo" and others will promote the "baby huey". SY's "Red Light District" is also well documented and has a number of builds around the world. Any are well proven and competent designs with a strong build history. Complexity is varied, but all are worth considering in the mix.
Too many choices huh!
No disrespect to shoog, but the design is (as far as I know) a one-off and doesn't have the range of attempt and success that provides support for a new builder.
The basic oddwatt / ultracompact does have track record and is the simplest in terms of parts count.
Eli will no doubt come in with a bid for the "el-cheapo" and others will promote the "baby huey". SY's "Red Light District" is also well documented and has a number of builds around the world. Any are well proven and competent designs with a strong build history. Complexity is varied, but all are worth considering in the mix.
Too many choices huh!
I Googled it and got a hit Simple P-P
It s a bit messy webpage but after some googleing and random clicking i finally found how to order the board. Well in this case I can go either way. Might even be a good idé to start with a board from George to start with. If you recommend me to start with the SimplePP i will do so. In my novice perspective I just think it looks cool with big bulbs and the SimplePP got one huge one (according to the picture)
I found that sending a message to George via the message system here at diyaudio worked a bit better than regular email. His user ID is Tubelab.com.
As Aardvaark mentioned, you should check out the tubelab forum here at diyaudio (in the Vendor Forums area.).
You'll get the story on George's limited time for selling boards by reading there.
The last I heard, George still had a couple of kits (parts for stuffing the board,not full kits) for the SimplePP. If you can contact him you could check on that option.
BTW- if you want 'one huge one'
aka the rectifier tube for the SimplePP, you should pick the EL84 version to build. The EL86 version doesn't use a rectifier tube.Too many choices is a understatement
Most of us are tempted to pick a great/powerful/ultimate/complex amp for our first project. Lots of 'bells and whistles', etc. My first guitar amp project had a faceplate full of controls and switches, and I never did get it to work properly. Next project was something simpler!
Something simpler/cheaper/less powerful can have more chance of success, and you can always build that more complex amp later.
I'm working up to the RedLightDistrict...but it is a lot of fun to build an amp in a couple of afternoons and have something that works- like the RH84 I just built from a console this weekend.
1. The room is about 13 square meters.
2. The music can differ from time to time but mostly i listen to metal and everything in between
3. Those I have right now is at 91 db and a frequency range at 50-32000 Hz.
4. They are two way
If I were to suggest an amp. I'd say a push-pull design with EL34 tubes. Those tubes are the same as in the Marshal amps the musicians are using. the EL84 is just plain not going to blow out the windows with a 91 dB speaker. Although they do sound a lot like EL84 and are suited for this kind of music.
The first thing to do is find a pair of output transformers you like. These are by far the largest and most expensive part of the amp. They cost at least 5X what the next lowest price part costs. You might expect them is weigh about 8 pounds each, or more or less.
If this is your first amp. I'd suggest starting smaller,way smaller say a 5 watt single ended amp. But if you MUST built your last amp first buy a kit. A kit will mean you are building a well knob design and there will be many other with you e exact same amp on forums and there is also the kit seller for support.
An amp that eaxtaly meets you specs and is also about the #1 must well known classic design is the Dyncco ST70 and these guys have a kit
Triode USA Dynaco ST-70 Tube DIY Amp Kit
You can also scratch built the same amp using your own parts and you will have almost as much support.
What makes the ST70 special is the quality of it's output transformers They are about as good as transformers got and the ones Triode sells are built by an old time company that still makes them like they used to.
That is one of the problems with starting a whole new branch of project. This is a setup I have never touched before and for a beginner it is kind of hard to separate the hard from the easy. I can just go with the price tag and/or after comments like "beginner project". Most of the time it is always the same thing, a lot of mumbo jumbo text about all the complex specifications that a "normal" person cant read. I have read some cookbooks with the history and background about the tube amps but even with that information is it a bit hard
There's a lot to learn, but that is what keeps it interesting after the first project you build.
If you 'just' want a tube amp, the simplest route is to buy one, next simplest is a full kit with good instructions (rare).
The cheapest way - which also requires more skill to execute is probably to build from scratch if you have a decent shop available. Then the variety of available projects really really widens! And you have to have a bit of knowledge to figure out which projects are easiest as well. It would be hard to find a scratch build less complex than the RH84. The Oddwatt/Poddwatt amps are a good bet for PP, though a bit complex-looking with the regulator and 'balancing pot'.
If you 'just' want a tube amp, the simplest route is to buy one, next simplest is a full kit with good instructions (rare).
The cheapest way - which also requires more skill to execute is probably to build from scratch if you have a decent shop available. Then the variety of available projects really really widens! And you have to have a bit of knowledge to figure out which projects are easiest as well. It would be hard to find a scratch build less complex than the RH84. The Oddwatt/Poddwatt amps are a good bet for PP, though a bit complex-looking with the regulator and 'balancing pot'.
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