I know it's off-topic...
It's better to use 2.83V as a reference input to the voltage sensitive loudspeaker driver to keep differing impedances on an even keel. At 2.83V, 4 ohms is 2W and 8 ohms is 1W. You can see why voltage is a better indicator. Agreed impedance is not flat unless it's a planar element. It's very unlikely that you can get any 6.5" driver to play to 10k without beaming terribly, regardless of Z, and in a car you're off-axis anyway which further degrades the treble of any midbass. Of the HiVi 6.5" drivers, the F6 can play to about 4k, and the M6 is only good to about 2k.
I don't understand this. Flat FR can be a marvelously well performing speaker.
The mark of a high end driver is good FR, low HD, and high dynamic capability.
You are referring to IMD, which is intermodulation distortion, where a lower freq will modulate a higher one and distort it.
Okay...Don't know why I said all that. Hopefully it doesn't sound too stupid lol
Nah.
The reason I went with 3/8" Beadboard is because I had it, and it is basically a thin plywood and is stiffer than MDF. On the sides/top/bottom, you want a stiffer panel when it gets thinner. If not, it will flex and cause boxy colorations or issues. I even added a rubber-mat to the inner side panels to mass-load them and make the flexing or resonating almost nil. If you've never built a box with 1/4" material all the way around, you don't understand why the baffle and back are thicker. You have to have enough surface area to glue the thinner walled material to, or it will be a very complex jigsaw puzzle trying to construct the cabinets.
Now- one more thing- I cut the woofer hole AFTER I assembled the box. This is because there is only 1/16" thickness at the widest through-hole on the baffle edges. If you cut the hole before assembly, and clamp the cabinet, you might end up not being able to fit the driver in the box, or having the baffle or cabinet malformed or crushed in the process.
I really encourage you to read my build thread over on PETT if you build these, because you might miss something that I thought of beforehand or see how I solved it if I missed it in the process. I just don't think I can link it here, but here goes:
I theorize: 'Synchaeta'....a Minimus 7 revamp...
Later,
Wolf
It's my topic, we can derail it
I know the ohm stuff and how it relates to wattage. I usually keep track of it in my head but you are right in saying voltage is a better way..I guess I shall do that from now on. So is there a set "X" volt increase per 3db or does it depend on the speaker?
About the mids playing to 10k..all these measurements were taken in the drivers seat. The results are far far worse than I remember..but as you can see they go to 10k and above. Please keep in mind this is no EQ on the minidsp. They were just thrown into a door and sound NOTHING like they did in even my trash boxes with holes. I can't figure out how the heck to tune it or even what the crossover points should be..I've asked for help on other sites and got no where so I gave up. Right now it just "works" kinda. Sub is fairly flat though, not to bad for a single Dayton 8" now is it
Also, I am not suggesting anyone actually speakers like that. I just thought it was hilarious hearing cymbals crash and snares through the door speakers because my Hivi ones couldn't do ANY of that in the same conditions with the same and and everything. I've just seen a correlation between the measured impedance curve and freq response of the driver time and time again.
Stereo - Album on Imgur
Intermodulation distortion..hmm...okay Wolf help me out because you are clearly better at this than myself. In one of the speakers I replaced drivers in I used a Tang Band 28-847SD. In my truck I used the ScanSpeak Illuminator D3004/6020-00. I can throw pretty much anything I want at the SS and it never complains. Every single instrument is clear. With the TB they clutter..you lose separation when you start turning it up loud and have lot's of instruments. They still sound really good but once you throw a lot at them they fall apart.
I know the ohm stuff and how it relates to wattage. I usually keep track of it in my head but you are right in saying voltage is a better way..I guess I shall do that from now on. So is there a set "X" volt increase per 3db or does it depend on the speaker?
About the mids playing to 10k..all these measurements were taken in the drivers seat. The results are far far worse than I remember..but as you can see they go to 10k and above. Please keep in mind this is no EQ on the minidsp. They were just thrown into a door and sound NOTHING like they did in even my trash boxes with holes. I can't figure out how the heck to tune it or even what the crossover points should be..I've asked for help on other sites and got no where so I gave up. Right now it just "works" kinda. Sub is fairly flat though, not to bad for a single Dayton 8" now is it
Also, I am not suggesting anyone actually speakers like that. I just thought it was hilarious hearing cymbals crash and snares through the door speakers because my Hivi ones couldn't do ANY of that in the same conditions with the same and and everything. I've just seen a correlation between the measured impedance curve and freq response of the driver time and time again.
Stereo - Album on Imgur
Intermodulation distortion..hmm...okay Wolf help me out because you are clearly better at this than myself. In one of the speakers I replaced drivers in I used a Tang Band 28-847SD. In my truck I used the ScanSpeak Illuminator D3004/6020-00. I can throw pretty much anything I want at the SS and it never complains. Every single instrument is clear. With the TB they clutter..you lose separation when you start turning it up loud and have lot's of instruments. They still sound really good but once you throw a lot at them they fall apart.
Also, I went out and bought a circle jig for the jigsaw today and failed horribly. I was going to make boxes for my Hivi B4N just to get the hang of it.
I think I am just going to get a router jig. I have a router but need the bit and the jig. Also a table saw because it's IMPOSSIBLEEEEE to but a straight line with a jigsaw lol. This project is starting to cost more money than I wanted...I knew I should have just bought the bose and dealt with missing frequencies.
I think I am just going to get a router jig. I have a router but need the bit and the jig. Also a table saw because it's IMPOSSIBLEEEEE to but a straight line with a jigsaw lol. This project is starting to cost more money than I wanted...I knew I should have just bought the bose and dealt with missing frequencies.
I think that is a tweeter issue. I don't much care for the 28-847. It's a very murky sounding tweeter. However- TB does make good units! Some of their offerings are some of the best, just not THAT one.
Wolf
You may not need a jig. On my router's base there are some holes ... I just fit a dowel of the hole's size in the middle of the wanted circle, put this dowel in the good hole of the base. Then you just have to adjust the diametre with the size of your bits.
final circle diametre = 2 * (center dowel to center routeur) - bit's diametre.
in my case : 2*45 - 18 = 72mm : perfect for a fountek fe85 with a 70mm magnet.
You don't really need a table saw, you need a flush mount router bit and
a piece of a flat board or something as a guide for it. I have made my first
box only with a drill, a hand saw and sand paper.
Sometimes is best to leave the job for the pros, in order not to injure yourself.
Attachments
Might be a bit late to the party, but a while back I brute-force EQ'd my FE126 drivers (which were sat in tiny stuffed sealed boxes as part of an active FAST system) flat from about 60Hz upwards. The result was actually rather good. Cone excursion got a bit sily on kick drum hits, but that was quite loud at 2m away in a small room.
For nearfield use, I'd seriously suggest something of the order of a 3-4" driver in a small sealed box, and EQ the low end to taste. It'll be a balancing act, of course, between LF-induced distortion, maximum SPL, and LF cutoff, but a pair of 4"s has half the cone area of an 8" driver, and those really don't need much excursion to do desktop levels.
FWIW, a pair of 4" drivers moving 2mm one-way will do just short of 80dB at 40Hz, before room gain and boundry effects. You could go 1.5-way with a pair of 3"s a side for more LF SPL capability.
You might need +15dB of EQ in the low end, but even then, you're only going to be putting a few watts through.
Chris
For nearfield use, I'd seriously suggest something of the order of a 3-4" driver in a small sealed box, and EQ the low end to taste. It'll be a balancing act, of course, between LF-induced distortion, maximum SPL, and LF cutoff, but a pair of 4"s has half the cone area of an 8" driver, and those really don't need much excursion to do desktop levels.
FWIW, a pair of 4" drivers moving 2mm one-way will do just short of 80dB at 40Hz, before room gain and boundry effects. You could go 1.5-way with a pair of 3"s a side for more LF SPL capability.
You might need +15dB of EQ in the low end, but even then, you're only going to be putting a few watts through.
Chris
Alright guys I am going to try try again. I mean I have taken apart entire trucks and rebuilt them..surely I can cut straight lines to form a literal box.
Thanks for all the advice given so far. I am going to find a way to get the router to do a circle without the jig as it won't arrive for a few days even with Prime shipping.
I will let you all know how it turns out. This is something I've been wanting to do for many years. Always had people stopping me and that.
Thanks for all the advice given so far. I am going to find a way to get the router to do a circle without the jig as it won't arrive for a few days even with Prime shipping.
I will let you all know how it turns out. This is something I've been wanting to do for many years. Always had people stopping me and that.
A small close monitor
I did a simple weekend project using a pair of Hosa Cue-5 surplus from Ebay. It may not be for everyone. But it is a very good investment from my view. I was able to verify the frequency response using ARTA measurement.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mult...cue-5-monitor-speaker-driver-information.html
I did a simple weekend project using a pair of Hosa Cue-5 surplus from Ebay. It may not be for everyone. But it is a very good investment from my view. I was able to verify the frequency response using ARTA measurement.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/mult...cue-5-monitor-speaker-driver-information.html
Alright guys I got a circle jig for my router. I have a miter saw. I am looking into a table saw but all the under $200 ones I've seen so far are absolute rubbish.
I have a question on material. I see lots of different material being used. I've always used MDF...can I use other types of wood? I'd love to do a hard wood...
I have a question on material. I see lots of different material being used. I've always used MDF...can I use other types of wood? I'd love to do a hard wood...
Hard wood can have issues with stability due to environmental changes. Ply is good.
Don't buy a cheap table saw. Dangerous and the fence will drive you crazy. Do you have a circular saw. Make a saw guide. It's super easy and its almost as good as a table saw. In some cases better. Take a piece of ply wider than your circular saw base and a little longer than the cut you need. Trim off one of the edges and glue it to the top of the board to make a guide that the saw plate can be held against as you cut. Cut the bottom piece with the saw against the guide. Now you only have to clamp the board down with the freshly cut edge over the spot you want to cut and you will get perfect edges assuming you are careful to keep the saw against the guide.
Back when I didn't even have a circular saw I would use shelving that was already a suitable width.
Don't buy a cheap table saw. Dangerous and the fence will drive you crazy. Do you have a circular saw. Make a saw guide. It's super easy and its almost as good as a table saw. In some cases better. Take a piece of ply wider than your circular saw base and a little longer than the cut you need. Trim off one of the edges and glue it to the top of the board to make a guide that the saw plate can be held against as you cut. Cut the bottom piece with the saw against the guide. Now you only have to clamp the board down with the freshly cut edge over the spot you want to cut and you will get perfect edges assuming you are careful to keep the saw against the guide.
Back when I didn't even have a circular saw I would use shelving that was already a suitable width.
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Already got a table saw. It took forever to find one under $200 with a good fence. I am not kidding I spent the entire day looking.
I got my circle jig. Miter. Router and a few bits along with a nice random orbital sander. I have 1/2 and 3/4 MDF.
I actually made some cabinets already. I used the super amazing Hivi B4N driver so that was a total waste of time lol. I mean they sound okay for what they are but..yea.
Next I am going to build a set of full rangers. I think I am going to use the 3.5" Dayton drivers.
After that I am going to reevaluate the suggestions thus far and pick out the best kit I can find.
I got my circle jig. Miter. Router and a few bits along with a nice random orbital sander. I have 1/2 and 3/4 MDF.
I actually made some cabinets already. I used the super amazing Hivi B4N driver so that was a total waste of time lol. I mean they sound okay for what they are but..yea.
Next I am going to build a set of full rangers. I think I am going to use the 3.5" Dayton drivers.
After that I am going to reevaluate the suggestions thus far and pick out the best kit I can find.
Great but be careful with that table saw cause they are scarier than most people realize. Those things will have you fingers off or send a board into you in a flash. Make sure you google "tablesaw kickback".
I thought the b4n was supposed to be decent.
Haven't read the thread in detail but you might want to look at the sopranos at meniscus. The are tiny, not too expensive, and use good drivers. The designer is highly respected and feels its one of his better speakers. I'm hoping to build a pair soonish. Have to get my guitar amp project done first (and the cost out of my wife's memory).
Did anyone suggest the overnight sensations? You already have one part of it.
I thought the b4n was supposed to be decent.
Haven't read the thread in detail but you might want to look at the sopranos at meniscus. The are tiny, not too expensive, and use good drivers. The designer is highly respected and feels its one of his better speakers. I'm hoping to build a pair soonish. Have to get my guitar amp project done first (and the cost out of my wife's memory).
Did anyone suggest the overnight sensations? You already have one part of it.
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I have actually used quite a few tables saws for only being 22. My dad used to own one but got rid of it. I took woodshop in school. I've been around this stuff my life.
Don't get me wrong, the B4N is great for 10 bucks. It isn't meant to be used in full range which is what I am making it do.
I am more than likely getting the sopranos. I have seen them suggested time and time again. I am going to do the full range project before those. I just wanna be sure I iron out any issues with building boxes first.
Don't get me wrong, the B4N is great for 10 bucks. It isn't meant to be used in full range which is what I am making it do.
I am more than likely getting the sopranos. I have seen them suggested time and time again. I am going to do the full range project before those. I just wanna be sure I iron out any issues with building boxes first.
Ah. Sounds like you know about safety then. Like I said I didn't read the whole thread.
I built a 3" full range for one of my first projects with the same reasoning. It was great and I still have them. In fact with a sub they were doing some memorable things. Did you see the zaph full range using the b3n? Mine was the predecessor with a tang and driver. Boxes aren't that hard really with the right tools. Flush mounting the drivers is the only part I find tricky and that's just a matter of taking care.
I built a 3" full range for one of my first projects with the same reasoning. It was great and I still have them. In fact with a sub they were doing some memorable things. Did you see the zaph full range using the b3n? Mine was the predecessor with a tang and driver. Boxes aren't that hard really with the right tools. Flush mounting the drivers is the only part I find tricky and that's just a matter of taking care.
Flush mount is super easy if you have that jig tool. You drill your center hole and instead of setting your radius for the cutout you set it for the overall OUTSIDE diameter of the speaker. Set the router bit depth and start cutting the hole out. Slowly come into the center and when you reach the point of the cutout measurement reset the depth and cut all the way through.
It looks perfect like a CNC cabinet. It's amazing how easy this is...I do wanna learn how to veneer and use the router for edges. Right now everything is 90 degrees and kinda plain.
No I haven't been to many sites. Despite joining here like 2 years ago I have yet to do much in this world. I need to get some books and learn.
It looks perfect like a CNC cabinet. It's amazing how easy this is...I do wanna learn how to veneer and use the router for edges. Right now everything is 90 degrees and kinda plain.
No I haven't been to many sites. Despite joining here like 2 years ago I have yet to do much in this world. I need to get some books and learn.
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