Material for ESL

[chinsettawong]

If I were to do it again, I would choose around 3-4 mm hole size.

Wachara C.

 

[geraldfryjr]

it's a tough call,but would probaly have to agree with you charlie on that one.and also(depending on lowest frequency exepcted)i would probaly go with a .080" to.090" (or 3/32') spacing for a panlel that width, to stay close too 100:1 width vs spacing.this will give you a little more headroom for the lows.even my little ones bottomed out ocasionaly (4.5" wide )at .0625"(1/16")spacing and the bigger ones at 9" wide defintely did at .0625" spacing so i used .090" on all of them for that reason.i also didn't have a crossover either as they were running fullrange then.the difference in efficantcy i made up in using a higher bais voltage.charlie i assume your using a crossover if so at what frequency did you choose and what is the d/s spacing you chose?.jer

 

[geraldfryjr]

thank you,much wachara C. i think we're starting to get somewhere.jer

 

[mavric]

placed the order for panels, copper tape, 1/16' foam tape, and a big smile on my face!!!
on the down side, i still have to build the step up transformers as well as a free standing esl. i also need to purchase a nice active cross over.
Charlie, sorrry for calling so late, and thanks for the info. people write books for a reason, Sander's to me is a pioneer in audio, my son, father, and thank GOD my wife are interested, its taking more time than i thought though.
but when parts come in, i will find a way to have the days to make something and more than happy to share results. thanks guys, girls, whomever is reading as i go, support is 110% here! If i had some more money, iwould make another donation.

 

[geraldfryjr]

that is awesomm .jer

 

[CharlieM]

it's a tough call,but would probaly have to agree with you charlie on that one.and also(depending on lowest frequency exepcted)i would probaly go with a .080" to.090" (or 3/32') spacing for a panlel that width, to stay close too 100:1 width vs spacing.this will give you a little more headroom for the lows.even my little ones bottomed out ocasionaly (4.5" wide )at .0625"(1/16")spacing and the bigger ones at 9" wide defintely did at .0625" spacing so i used .090" on all of them for that reason.i also didn't have a crossover either as they were running fullrange then.the difference in efficantcy i made up in using a higher bais voltage.charlie i assume your using a crossover if so at what frequency did you choose and what is the d/s spacing you chose?.jer

I'm using 1/16" d/s spacing and 51% open stators with .141" diameter holes. This is good for hybrids and it provides for very high output. Also using a DBX Model 223 active crossover (24db/octave), which I picked up on Ebay for $75. I started off with a 380hz crossover point per the Cookbook guidelines but I've recently reduced it to around 280 hz and it sounds great there too; although the lower I set the crossover, the more EQ and amp power it takes to balance the low end dipole phase cancellation. I got plenty of amp power so that's not a problem for me.

 

[geraldfryjr]

excelent,that would have been my recommendation also,charlie,like i said, i had prefered to use .090" spacing over .0625" spacing because i was pushing them full range and i had two sets of frames,so all i had to do was unbolt the thing and swap them out.if mavric gets a 20mil coating thickness on the stator with a .0625 d/s then running a slightly higer bias voltage should be more than enough to make up for any defficiency's.every time i see a good deal on ebay its always when don't have the cash.just recently i saw some dbx 266 compressor's i that need badly because the one i had some how disappeared a few years ago.jer

 

[mavric]

will this work?
Behringer CX2310 Active
Behringer CX2310 Active Crossover
See Full Description

Behringer CX2310 Active is brand new and in stock



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Description:
The CX2310 like the CX3400, offers absolute precision, state-of-the-art circuitry, professional components, ultra low-noise op amps, fully balanced in and outputs and intuitive operation. In addition to full-fledged 2-way stereo/3-way mono operation, the CX2310 features a separately adjustable subwoofer output, giving you an extra low-frequency band! More Behringer CX2310 Active Info & Specification
More Behringer CX2310 Active Info & Specifications:
Product includes the full US manufacturer's warranty
24 dB/octave, state-variable Linkwitz-Riley filters for precise frequency separation

Absolutely flat summed amplitude response, zero phase difference

Individual output level and mute per band

Phase reverse switch per output

Switchable 25 Hz subsonic filter on each input for low-frequency driver protection

“Sum” function provides low-level mono output for subwoofer operation

Shielded toroidal mains transformer for minimal noise interference

Operating Modes Stereo 2-way, switchable to mono 3-way

Frequencies: Low/High: 44Hz to 930Hz (440 Hz to 9.3 kHz using x10 switch)

Mono Mode Frequencies: Low/Low-Mid: 44Hz to 930Hz (440 Hz to 9.3 kHz using x10 switch), Low/High: 44Hz to 930Hz (440 Hz to 9.3 kHz using x10 switch)

High-Mid/High: 440Hz to 9.3kHz

Gain Range +/-6dB

Front Panel Switches: Mute (individual per band, Phase (individual per band, Low cut (per side)

Inputs: 2 x XLR

Outputs: 5 x XLR

Maximum Input Level +22dBu typical, balanced or unbalanced

Maximum Output Level +20dBm, balanced or unbalanced

Frequency Response 5Hz to 60kHz, +/-3dB

Noise SNR: Between >91dBu and >95dBu, depending on configuration

Dimensions (WxDxH) 19" x 8 1/2" x 1 3/4"

Specialties 25Hz sub-sonic filter on each input for low-frequency driver protection

Includes AC power cable

One year warranty

Behringer CX2310 Active also known as: CX2310

Compuplus.com Pictures are for illustration purposes only.

Comp-U-Plus Return Policy: 30 days exchange or money back

i my self like the Linkwitz-Riley cross over as i like them in our high end car audio amps. So what do you guys think? not a bad price, but is the manufacture worth it, I will not a "Pyle" of crap, something other.
the last part of the description as follow....
Compuplus.com Pictures are for illustration purposes only
gonna look it up online somewere else, curious as ebay can be shady. If someone finds good news about, let me know and that will one last thing i need.

 

[geraldfryjr]

i have used lots of equipment from behringer you can not beat the price for the quality in fact i almost bought their biggest mixer before it was pulled from the market for being a half priced mackie 32-8 clone.their reverb unit was awsome so was there compressors not to mention their little mixer which is basicly a half priced clone also,( sorry bob)no you can,t go wrong there.it would cost you that much to build one. i'll look it up and take a closer look tonight.the linkwitz-riley filters are what you want to use anyway.jer

 

[mavric]

thanks for the history on this, i allready read the pdf file on it, 79 bucks? its on the way as well. Charlie, if your watching, do you need anything from parts express? 100. and shipping is free. please let me know.
Thanks Jer for your experience, this was something i just happened to find, butter worth is what got my attention as all i have seen have a 24db slope.

 

[geraldfryjr]

nope,but thanks anyway i just recently got 10 200watt toriod transformers from them for $20 each!for some chip amps i'm planning to build for my esl's.thanks again. jer

 

[mavric]

I will have to order it tomorrow, just trying to help anyone.

 

[geraldfryjr]

i'm sorry as i read your post wrong as you were refering to charlie,but i'm always willing to help and share my experience and knowledge with anyone who can use it. jer

 

[mavric]

no applogies please, everyone here is so helpful! Thats why i am trying to stay on just this one.
ordered the beringer( b/o till the 14th of 15th) no big deal, grill cloth, magnets for the grill covers and Charlie got my order from McMaster will panels, tape, and copper cunducting today, its coming together. Is soon as I get a chance, dive to Charlie's and go over the build as well as other stuff im gonna need.
I honestly cannot to spray those panels, im more pshyced about than anything. Later, and Jer, please feel free to share panels advice and info, interested in that to, just dont know kind of application i can use something loike for, still intersest though.

 

[geraldfryjr]

well,the next step is to figure out what the transformer ratio should be,the main determinating factor is the diagphram/stator spacing.jer p.s. i can feel your execitement all the way up here in michigan happy happy happy joy joy joy eheeeeee!

 

[mavric]

thanks man, joy joy joy, its not Christmas yet, howver still eccited.

 

[geraldfryjr]

no not yet, but i bet it sure feels like it!

 

[mavric]

i meant to say "i cannot wait to spray those panels". my mind works faster than my fingers.

 

[geraldfryjr]

do have the mylar yet? if so what thickness? and have you decide on which coating to use?as i have been doing alot of disscusions about coatings. jer

 

[CharlieM]

I happen to have some 12-micron Mylar and a proprietary coating solution that I will donate to Mavric's project. I purchased the coating solution online from Just Real Music--- I don't know what's in it (probably a graphite suspension) but I've verified that it works.