I don't believe cables make a difference, any input?

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What I'm saying is that those who are frequently referred to as "subjectivists" aren't truly subjectivists in my opinion.

A true subjectivist simply accepts their subjective experience for what it is and doesn't attempt to pass it off as anything more.

This in contrast to those often referred to as "subjectivists" who routinely assert their subjective experience as an unerring reflection of some physical reality. In other words, if they subjectively perceive some difference, they insist that it's due to an actual audible difference.

At that point, one is no longer a subjectivist in my opinion. I'm not sure what you'd call them. Perhaps "pseudo objectivists" would be a good term, after the phrase "pseudo science" which also tends to be part and parcel of their belief system.
se
And here I was sensing some sort of Steve Eddy humour. :eek:
You make a very good point. It is almost like denying one's own power to insist that there must be a hardware cause for everything. Are they machines?
 
Sy, is that really what you plan to do to TG1954? Will his inability to float be DBT, with many insertions into the tank? I think I understand your beard better now.

Bud

Well, if you are to believe the believers, Tom is to be brutally tortured (not tested) into revealing the "truth" about cables, by an adversary.
And we know torture (so far) ends in nulls.
So on and on it goes, the excuse-o-meter spinning wildly.:)
 
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Mmmm, I don't think name-calling really elevates the argument, to be honest.

That said, I've been pretty vocal that the "objective-subjective" false dichotomy is the sort of fallacy that leads to fuzzy and inaccurate thinking. A properly controlled test leads to objective results, determined by subjective choices.

real scientific experiences have no subjective choice in the
choosen protocols, otherwise they wouildn t be scientific...
choices are dictated by the effects that are supposed to be
observed, and all is done to eliminate the human subjective
choices, as they are incompatible with a scientific approach,
where the result is independant from any human will...
 
Sounds similar to my little system.

And no patch bays for the last 10 years rdf? :rolleyes: So is all this gear hardwired and that patchbay just a useless organ? http://www.quadnyc.com/Studio_A_files/IMG_4997_2.JPG

Nice. When was it built?
But yep. Including post op for television, voice talent production suites, obviously television and radio stations. I recall one big room in the production house in the same building I worked for 10 years in Toronto on Ontario Street that had a room that looked like that. Built around a SSL Scenaria. When I asked what they do in it the reply was 'entertain clients'. A showpiece in every sense of the word. The bulk of audio work was done elsewhere.

SY, architecturally and topological regarding ABX box vs. cable. Inserting an ABX box has no effect makes perfect sense if a cable has no effect either. Not a conclusion to be made before auditory tesing for me but it all depends on your belief system
 
real scientific experiences have no subjective choice in the
choosen protocols, otherwise they wouildn t be scientific...
choices are dictated by the effects that are supposed to be
observed, and all is done to eliminate the human subjective
choices, as they are incompatible with a scientific approach,
where the result is independant from any human will...

If I understand you correctly, then you're asserting that all sensory research is not science. But I think you're under a misapprehension that the subjective choice is a choice of the protocols- that is very much incorrect. The subjective choices are made by the test subjects under the conditions of a predetermined experimental protocol.

You may want to read a bit on how sensory testing works.
 
Inserting an ABX box has no effect makes perfect sense if a cable has no effect either. Not a conclusion to be made before auditory tesing for me but it all depends on your belief system

It also makes perfect sense if a cable does have an effect unless it is SO pathological as to render any testing moot (unless you still maintain that 100 different wires versus 101 different wires is Night and Day, also pure speculation with zero supporting evidence).
 
If I understand you correctly, then you're asserting that all sensory research is not science. But I think you're under a misapprehension that the subjective choice is a choice of the protocols- that is very much incorrect. The subjective choices are made by the test subjects under the conditions of a predetermined experimental protocol.

You may want to read a bit on how sensory testing works.


don t make me tell what i didn t told..
any serious testing must follow scientific protocols to
allow separation between what is caused by instrumentation
and what is independant from these influences...
if the result yielded is not in line with what was expected,
then the first thing to do is to repeat the experience..
if it doesn t change nothing, then the protocols must be
re evalueted to find if there s an error at the basis of this test,
rendering it flawed from the start..
if nothing is found, then the conclusion is that there s
effects that are unknown, and they will only be displayed
with a new experience whose protocols are calculated
to allow quantitative differentiation between what is known
and what is still not explained...
it s a fact that many dfiscovery were made this way, as
the expexted results and real world measurements showed
difference that couldn t be explained with the experience
precision borders...
 
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