Hi everyone,
I just joined.
Can someone provide a wiring diagram to be able to split a 4x12 cabinet with 8 ohm speakers such when all 4 speakers are used the impedence equals 8 ohms or have 2 sets of speakers each in series to read 16 ohms each. I believe this can be done with 3 input jacks. 1 jack would control 1 set of 2 speakers in series at 16 ohms and the 2nd jack to control the 2nd set of 2 speakers at 16 ohms and the 3rd jack would control all 4 speakers at 8 ohms wired in series/parallel.
I believe one of the jacks would have a 3rd terminal so that when nothing is plugged into it, all 4 speakers would be active at 8 ohms when the plug into the 8 ohm jack. When a plug is inserted into it, it would disconnect part of the wiring allowing for 16 ohm operation with those 2 speakers and 16 ohm on the 3rd jack.
Is this doable using certain types of input jacks or using a switch to change from 4 speakers, to 2 speakers at 16 ohms and the other 2 not used. or both sets of 2 speakers each at 16ohms each.
I understand the concept of series, parallel and series parallel wiring but am having difficulty trying to have difference wiring options in the same cabinet.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks
I just joined.
Can someone provide a wiring diagram to be able to split a 4x12 cabinet with 8 ohm speakers such when all 4 speakers are used the impedence equals 8 ohms or have 2 sets of speakers each in series to read 16 ohms each. I believe this can be done with 3 input jacks. 1 jack would control 1 set of 2 speakers in series at 16 ohms and the 2nd jack to control the 2nd set of 2 speakers at 16 ohms and the 3rd jack would control all 4 speakers at 8 ohms wired in series/parallel.
I believe one of the jacks would have a 3rd terminal so that when nothing is plugged into it, all 4 speakers would be active at 8 ohms when the plug into the 8 ohm jack. When a plug is inserted into it, it would disconnect part of the wiring allowing for 16 ohm operation with those 2 speakers and 16 ohm on the 3rd jack.
Is this doable using certain types of input jacks or using a switch to change from 4 speakers, to 2 speakers at 16 ohms and the other 2 not used. or both sets of 2 speakers each at 16ohms each.
I understand the concept of series, parallel and series parallel wiring but am having difficulty trying to have difference wiring options in the same cabinet.
Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks
Hi jsagg
Are you doing something like bi-amping a Marshall 4x12 or some thing like that ?
Simon
Hi Simon,
If bi amping is the ability to use 2 amps with the same speaker cabinet the answer is yes. I want the ability to use 1 amp with 1 set of 2 speakers (16 ohms) and the other using the other 2 speakers (16 ohms) and still have the ability to use the entire cabinnet at 8 ohms.
Thanks
Jerry
If bi amping is the ability to use 2 amps with the same speaker cabinet the answer is yes. I want the ability to use 1 amp with 1 set of 2 speakers (16 ohms) and the other using the other 2 speakers (16 ohms) and still have the ability to use the entire cabinnet at 8 ohms.
Thanks
Jerry
Hi Jerry
What are the amps ?
Are they valve or solid state ?
If you wire the 2 seperate pairs together in parallel you should be able to get MORE VOLUME !!!!
ie. - Bi amped cabinet 4 Ohms + 4 Ohms
& - Single amped cabinet 8 Ohms
Simon
2 speakers in series, gives you the 16 ohm impedance you want.
You would have 2 sets like this.
So you can use bi-amps.
If you want them to act as a single 8 ohm load, just paralell connect the 2 of them.
16 ohm is not so good for driving with usual amplifiers.
As amplifiers nowdays better like 4 or 8 ohm loads.
You could use 2 speakers in paralell, giving you 4 ohms.
You would end up with 2 of those, so you can bi-amp.
If you would like to use the cabinet as a single 8 ohm load, You can connect those in series, giving You an 8 ohm load.
You would have 2 sets like this.
So you can use bi-amps.
If you want them to act as a single 8 ohm load, just paralell connect the 2 of them.
16 ohm is not so good for driving with usual amplifiers.
As amplifiers nowdays better like 4 or 8 ohm loads.
You could use 2 speakers in paralell, giving you 4 ohms.
You would end up with 2 of those, so you can bi-amp.
If you would like to use the cabinet as a single 8 ohm load, You can connect those in series, giving You an 8 ohm load.
The amps are marshall 2061x which can be switched from 4 to 8 to 16 ohms. The other is a Fender Bandmaster with a Baseman output transformer from Kendricks amplifiers made at 8 ohms (not the typical 4 ohm OT used in bandmasters.
The reason I want 16 ohms is because I was advised that when the OT is set at 16 ohms, it uses all the windings and provides maximum tone, whereas 8 ohms uses less windings than 8 ohms and 4f ohms even less.
I understand the different results between series and parallel wiring. I'm just not sure how to accomplish both 16 and 8 ohms at the same time with separate jacks.
The reason I want 16 ohms is because I was advised that when the OT is set at 16 ohms, it uses all the windings and provides maximum tone, whereas 8 ohms uses less windings than 8 ohms and 4f ohms even less.
I understand the different results between series and parallel wiring. I'm just not sure how to accomplish both 16 and 8 ohms at the same time with separate jacks.
Hi Jerry
OK...The intention of the 4/8/16 switch on the Marshall is to make it easy to match the amplifier to any cabinet setup that it might come across.
ie:- 1cab, 2cab, not usualy 3cab & 4cab even.
I would be surprised if you heard any significant difference in 'tone' between the three settings, as long as they are all used with the correct impedance cabinet.
The only difference in 'tone' that is likely (which will infact be more a difference of volume) is if the Marshall is set to 16 Ohms, playing into a 16 Ohm cabinet.
Setting the Marshall to 4 Ohms and playing into a 4 Ohm cabinet will be WAY louder than the 16 Ohm setting & cabinet.
The other amp with the fixed Fender Bassman replacement transformer is obviously not going to be a perfect match to the other half of the 4x12 at either 4 or 16 Ohms.
So there will be a difference in tone (but in fact this is again more a difference of volume).
The Fender will play WAY louder into a 4 Ohm cabinet than a 16 Ohm one.
So the half of the 4x12 for the Fender could be wired either 4 or 16 Ohms.
It could also be wired BOTH 4 and 16 Ohms, with the adition of a 2 way switch, you could then change over impedance/volume and see which you like best.
What kind of music do you play is it VERY loud, normal or quiet ?
I can advise you also about the cabinet rewiring practicalitys as well.
Keeping it simple is always best, as when you have a weirdly wired up cabinet, no one can ever understand how to plug it in except you (especialy after a drink or two !).
It doesn't really matter, but just out of interest, I don't know the power of those particular amps, do you know what output valves they have.
Marshall EL84 or 34 ?
Fender 6L6 ? maybe...
Simon
P.S - some people feel that series/parallel verses parallel/series wired cabinets 'Sound' different.
Personaly I don't think it makes any significant difference, not compared at least to what the guitar is, and what the amp settings, drive/gain & EQ are at.
I like to play blues, jazz and some rock. I'm just starting to get into jazz. I like to play Eric Clapton, Mark Knopfler and Beatle music. For jazz, I like to attempt to play Larry Carlton, Peter White.
I also do not play very loud. I play at living room volume.
The fender can take either 6L6GC or E34L (output tube rewired to accompodate both tube types).
Marshall uses EL84 output tubes.
Thanks
Jerry
I also do not play very loud. I play at living room volume.
The fender can take either 6L6GC or E34L (output tube rewired to accompodate both tube types).
Marshall uses EL84 output tubes.
Thanks
Jerry
Hi Jerry
Yeah...dats wot I figured on the toobs.
Glad your looking after your hearing, I wouldn't like to be Brian May's next door neighbour !
Like you said, there are switched 1/4" jack sockets available.
Although perfectly good for line level studio use and stomp boxes etc.
They are just about the worst type of speaker connector one could use.
Very little contact pressure or real current handling capacity.
If I were doing a good rewiring job on a guitar cab, I would use 'Neutrik Speakon' tm. connectors.
These don't come with a switching option.
However all is not lost.
I would use 2 Speakons (1 for each pair of speakers).
And 2 heavy duty switches for selecting 4/16 Ohms on the pairs (the bigger the better, 10 Amps at least).
Toggle types can be used, but a rocker switch is my choice, as they don't get busted if the cab. falls over or gets ramed up against walls or other equipment (roadie proof !).
If the cab. doesn't have a recess plate or connector dish already, it might be also worth fitting one.
To achieve the use of all 4 speakers with one amp, I would make a special cable to use between the amp and cab.
This would be wired a bit like an insert cable on a typical mixer.
1 plug on the amp end, and 2 lengths of cable each with a plug at the cab. end.
The cable would be wired so that the 2 seperate pairs of speakers are connected in series when it's pluged in.
In conjunction with the 2 heavy duty switches on the cab. it would be possible to choose 8/20/32 Ohm impedances.
Obviously you would set both switches to 4 Ohms and end up with 8 Ohms total.
While your at it, beefing up the internal cab. wiring is a cheap and worthwhile thing to do as well (checking speaker polarity at the same time).
The other advantage of using the Speakon connectors is that it prevents the amp to speaker link being made with a 'regular' guitar cable.
Which is not great for connecting speakers.
Some beefy cable like for the internal wiring should be used for the 2 way cable.
Some people like the boxey sound of 4x12's.
Personaly I like 'high definition'.
If you get 4 second hand large wooley blankets, bundle them up into a sort of big mushroom shape and tie up with string and fix them behind each speaker, you might be surprised at the increased definition you get from the cab.
It can sound like you've just got a 1000 buck speaker.
Hope that all makes sense.
Cheers
Simon
Hi Jerry
Just another thought.
You obviously don't NEED the switches, I just thought it adds a bit of flexability to see if 4 or 16 'sounds' different, especialy with the Fender fixed OPT.
Simon
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