I would not buy them to use them as such, not to say they could not do a fair job within their own limits. I do own a pair of FF225WK and have crossed-them over to various tweeters anywhere from 1.5kHz to 15kHz, but they have been ran as fullrange with helper tweeters the majority of the time. If either the 165 or 225 has to have a low-pass filter, I'd at least suggest going active for best results IMO.
IG
IG
Thank's..
My first message was not specific enough..
The goal is to find a driver (around 6 pouces) with paper cone, Mms as low as possible, Le as low as possible, sensibility around 90 db, using in MLTL or MLTL Bipole.
I did not find any other candidates at reasonably price..
I am aware that it is a shame to use a fullrange for that.
My belief is that a driver with low Mms and low Le sounds better in bass.
Is that true ?
I don't know, but that's what I noticed at listening, better impulse, better details,
less streaking.. I'am not sure about "streaking", I would say then it's boom, it's not boooom. Maybe you say dynamic ?
Phil.
Use up 200 hz..
My first message was not specific enough..
The goal is to find a driver (around 6 pouces) with paper cone, Mms as low as possible, Le as low as possible, sensibility around 90 db, using in MLTL or MLTL Bipole.
I did not find any other candidates at reasonably price..
I am aware that it is a shame to use a fullrange for that.
My belief is that a driver with low Mms and low Le sounds better in bass.
Is that true ?
I don't know, but that's what I noticed at listening, better impulse, better details,
less streaking.. I'am not sure about "streaking", I would say then it's boom, it's not boooom. Maybe you say dynamic ?
Phil.
Use up 200 hz..
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I don't know enough about driver parameters and how they specifically relate to certain performance characteristics, but I would guess that a low mass would equate to ability to accelerate the cone rapidly based on Newton's Second Law (F=ma). The inductance may have more to do with ultimate high frequency response rather than transients? I am not sure about that one. I could run a simulation in AkAbak and change just the Le and see what it does to the impulse response. That might be interesting.
I think Mms can be offset by a higher BL, but there is a limit to this at some point. I'm thinking Le is better kept low, but then again, it seems like other factors dominate driver behavior at low-frequency operation. What about plain ol' Qes? Seems like good damping goes hand-in-hand with impulse response, or is this incorrect?
In any case, if low Mms and Le are desired by the OP, either 165 or 225 are good candidates assuming all the other criteria of consideration fit the bill, I will not question the design at this point.
Heck I was thinking of a midbass application for my FF225WK, but only because I already have it and don't want to be buying extra drivers at this moment.IG
Hi all,
I make predict with MJ King sheet, (MLTL FF165WK) with differents Le..
It's change a little, but it's not significative, I think ?
Thank's for comment.
Phil.
I make predict with MJ King sheet, (MLTL FF165WK) with differents Le..
It's change a little, but it's not significative, I think ?
Thank's for comment.
Phil.
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An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I had the same thought. Did anyone get a chance to listen to the 'wide band with helper tweeter' designs from Zu Audio and Tekton. All these employ large diameter widerangers similar to the FF225WK. Understandably, due to higher efficiency than a usual BW limited midbass driver, these widebanders need much larger cabinets for the similar LF extension.
Agreed these have high efficiencies (at the cost of a large-huge box), but do these actually have better sound clarity or transient respone (if loaded in the same cabinet design) than a more usual BW limited midbass driver ??!!
Xrk, you are right..
I try several driver near from FF165WK, and impulse change just a little.
Maybe truth is not here.
Looking Acoutic Elegance drivers like this one :
AE Speakers --- Superb Quality, Unforgettable Performance, Definitely.
I was intrigued by Le 0,15 mH, the manufacturer said : inductance is more linear in low frequencies ?
Phil.
I try several driver near from FF165WK, and impulse change just a little.
Maybe truth is not here.
Looking Acoutic Elegance drivers like this one :
AE Speakers --- Superb Quality, Unforgettable Performance, Definitely.
I was intrigued by Le 0,15 mH, the manufacturer said : inductance is more linear in low frequencies ?
Phil.
Dan Wiggins's short writeup on the subject: http://www.diy-audio.narod.ru/litr/WooferSpeed.pdf
As a few [over] general pointers, moving mass & outright motor power determine efficiency, or at least a significant part thereof. System Q in essence defines transient response within the acceleration BW (< the mass corner). Within the mass-controlled BW, VC inductance as described in the link becomes the dominant factor.
Where things begin to get more complicated is with drivers designed to employ controlled resonance to extend their upper BW. Wideband drivers, fall into this category. Even the nominal piston / mass-controlled region is to some extent affected by this unless the higher frequencies are filtered out, & it's a somewhat different matter since we're then into the details of the suspension & cone design, their resonant / emittance characteristics etc. Short version though: if you want good transient response, aim for low VC inductance & a wide BW. Higher Le drivers will likely need a lower XO frequency.
As a few [over] general pointers, moving mass & outright motor power determine efficiency, or at least a significant part thereof. System Q in essence defines transient response within the acceleration BW (< the mass corner). Within the mass-controlled BW, VC inductance as described in the link becomes the dominant factor.
Where things begin to get more complicated is with drivers designed to employ controlled resonance to extend their upper BW. Wideband drivers, fall into this category. Even the nominal piston / mass-controlled region is to some extent affected by this unless the higher frequencies are filtered out, & it's a somewhat different matter since we're then into the details of the suspension & cone design
Somewhat related and originally from the Fullrangedriver.com forum, I'll post this here for kicks. There are some missing images eaten by Imageshack, but there is enough still. Member "hitsware" also completely filled a small fullrange's cone with some kind of caulk and it still emitted a fair amount of HF according to him.
Thanks for that link.
Just to clarify, the "transient response" you mention, that is improved by a lower Le, will manifest only as the high frequency extension of the driver(before cone break-up modes), if I got this right.
However the transient response in the bass region still is only governed by the system Q, as determined by the cabinet design...and I guess should not differ between two systems with the same Q, but different drivers with varying Le.
Is this correct ? Thanks.
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