I discovered by accident that if you let the ironed on paper transfer cool completely it peels off a lot more easily and doesn't require as much cleaning up. However next time I do a board I'm going to use a OHT transparency film as someone suggested on Gottee's site. - no paper to stick and you can see the toner sticking to the copper. 
Well it didn'r turn into a sticky gooey mess - more like a crumpled brittle mess. But then I found out I wasn't using Laser type OHT material - it was Inkjet stuff. and the bleeding toner wouldn't come off the "rough" surface of the transparency. - will have to get Laser OHT material.
- By the way - the Injet transparency passed through the laser printer OK it didn't like the hot iron though. 
- By the way - the Injet transparency passed through the laser printer OK it didn't like the hot iron though. 
I've used inkjet glossy photo paper with decent success in the past for toner transfer. Thing is, although it usually won't melt in the printer, it occasionally leaves some tiny spots of gluish coating on the drum. I had to clean the drum on several occasions. Inkjet papers are not made to stand the high temperatures. It works, but it will make your laser printer dirty after a few times.
I now use TTS (Toner Transfer System), which is a special paper made for this use. It costs a bit more than good inkjet photo paper, but it's worth it. I've not tried the transparent paper for laser printers; but it's rather expensive, so it's not worth the trouble compared to TTS, in my opinion.
Go see here.
The main trouble with inkjet photo paper is that it's pretty messy to clean the gluish stuff between close copper traces once transfered, and it can take a while. This problem doesn't exist with TTS, which has a special coating. Another advantage is that you can use it for making decals and silk screens.
I now use TTS (Toner Transfer System), which is a special paper made for this use. It costs a bit more than good inkjet photo paper, but it's worth it. I've not tried the transparent paper for laser printers; but it's rather expensive, so it's not worth the trouble compared to TTS, in my opinion.
Go see here.
The main trouble with inkjet photo paper is that it's pretty messy to clean the gluish stuff between close copper traces once transfered, and it can take a while. This problem doesn't exist with TTS, which has a special coating. Another advantage is that you can use it for making decals and silk screens.
My experiences
Hello all,
I’ve had great results using the following technique to make PCB’s, including those with surface mount device tracks….
1. Printing artwork: Use a laser printer, print onto WHITE side of “EPSON Photo Quality Inkjet paper”, normally priced at about US$30/100 sheets
2. Copper board: Prepare by scrubbing with real or artificial steel wool using a warm soapy solution. Dry using clean cloth. TIME: 3 minutes
3. Ironing: Set iron to maximum temperature. Place paper over board. Apply iron to board and paper for about 20-30 SECONDS, moving iron in steady motions. Perhaps end with 5 SECONDS of heavy downward pressure. Any longer and you start to run into problems removing the paper etc. TIME-30-40 SECONDS
4. Soak the paper in soapy solution for 5 minutes and then gently peel paper off. Should come off easily. TIME-5 minutes
5. If at this stage the ink transfer has not gone so well, wash the ink off with ACETONE, scrub board with soap/water and iron again.
6. Now, in a WELL VENTILATED space, place board in plastic container and add pool acid (aka hydrochloric acid, muriatic acid) available from all hardware stores.
7. Now slowly add 10-12% (aka 40m/v) peroxide, available from pharmacies to the acid solution. CAUTION: Chlorine will be released, toxic. CAUTION: Reaction generates heat, so go slowly. IF THE REACTION BECOMES TOO VIOLENT, ADD WATER to SLOW it DOWN.
8. Gently rock the plastic container back and forth, being careful to minimise exposure to chlorine gas. If reaction too slow, add more hydrogen peroxide (SLOWLY) ETCHING SHOULD BE DONE IN TIME OF 5-10 minutes
9. Neutralise the acid/peroxide solution by adding baking soda (sodium bicarbonate). This will cause fizzing so proceed SLOWLY. Add enough to stop the fizzing. Dilute the solution with water and dispose of as per your environmental requirements. Takes another 10 minutes perhaps
10. Wash the board in water, then acetone to reveal the copper layer. Time 1 minute.
11. Drill , time of say 5 minutes
That’s it! Method works VERY well. The hardest stage is the ironing process, but with practise, you should know how long to apply heat for etc. Too much heat seems to degrade the transfer. Good luck and remember that you follow these instructions at your OWN RISK. The chemicals involved can be VERY DANGEROUS and should be handled with GREAT CAUTION. GLOVES, GOGGLES advised.
Hello all,
I’ve had great results using the following technique to make PCB’s, including those with surface mount device tracks….
1. Printing artwork: Use a laser printer, print onto WHITE side of “EPSON Photo Quality Inkjet paper”, normally priced at about US$30/100 sheets
2. Copper board: Prepare by scrubbing with real or artificial steel wool using a warm soapy solution. Dry using clean cloth. TIME: 3 minutes
3. Ironing: Set iron to maximum temperature. Place paper over board. Apply iron to board and paper for about 20-30 SECONDS, moving iron in steady motions. Perhaps end with 5 SECONDS of heavy downward pressure. Any longer and you start to run into problems removing the paper etc. TIME-30-40 SECONDS
4. Soak the paper in soapy solution for 5 minutes and then gently peel paper off. Should come off easily. TIME-5 minutes
5. If at this stage the ink transfer has not gone so well, wash the ink off with ACETONE, scrub board with soap/water and iron again.
6. Now, in a WELL VENTILATED space, place board in plastic container and add pool acid (aka hydrochloric acid, muriatic acid) available from all hardware stores.
7. Now slowly add 10-12% (aka 40m/v) peroxide, available from pharmacies to the acid solution. CAUTION: Chlorine will be released, toxic. CAUTION: Reaction generates heat, so go slowly. IF THE REACTION BECOMES TOO VIOLENT, ADD WATER to SLOW it DOWN.
8. Gently rock the plastic container back and forth, being careful to minimise exposure to chlorine gas. If reaction too slow, add more hydrogen peroxide (SLOWLY) ETCHING SHOULD BE DONE IN TIME OF 5-10 minutes
9. Neutralise the acid/peroxide solution by adding baking soda (sodium bicarbonate). This will cause fizzing so proceed SLOWLY. Add enough to stop the fizzing. Dilute the solution with water and dispose of as per your environmental requirements. Takes another 10 minutes perhaps
10. Wash the board in water, then acetone to reveal the copper layer. Time 1 minute.
11. Drill , time of say 5 minutes
That’s it! Method works VERY well. The hardest stage is the ironing process, but with practise, you should know how long to apply heat for etc. Too much heat seems to degrade the transfer. Good luck and remember that you follow these instructions at your OWN RISK. The chemicals involved can be VERY DANGEROUS and should be handled with GREAT CAUTION. GLOVES, GOGGLES advised.
Rule #1 from chemistry: NEVER ADD WATER TO ACID. Add acid to water.
Reason - dilution of acid with water may be exothermic, a drop of water in a pool of acid easily overheats to the point of evaporating in a splatter (into your eyes).
The other way round, acid into water, works because the surrounding nonreactive water cools everything down.
A lot of things may work for a long time before going wrong... but that's no reason to do it wrongly. Forinstance you could do the whole mixing by placing the mixing container in a water filled bucket. Much safer and neutralizes spills as well.
Anyway, wear gloves, rubber boots and especially, safety goggles. Chemical drops may easily find their way around regular eyeglasses. I found that out with formaline once, thank you very much.
If possible do all this close to a water hose that can be opened in 1-2 seconds with eyes closed to douse yourself.
Strong acids are no joke, even though they may sell at regular hardware stores.
Reason - dilution of acid with water may be exothermic, a drop of water in a pool of acid easily overheats to the point of evaporating in a splatter (into your eyes).
The other way round, acid into water, works because the surrounding nonreactive water cools everything down.
A lot of things may work for a long time before going wrong... but that's no reason to do it wrongly. Forinstance you could do the whole mixing by placing the mixing container in a water filled bucket. Much safer and neutralizes spills as well.
Anyway, wear gloves, rubber boots and especially, safety goggles. Chemical drops may easily find their way around regular eyeglasses. I found that out with formaline once, thank you very much.
If possible do all this close to a water hose that can be opened in 1-2 seconds with eyes closed to douse yourself.
Strong acids are no joke, even though they may sell at regular hardware stores.
MBK, I agree with all your statements. Best to exercise CAUTION.
If you know what you're doing and you're careful, the peroxide/acid etch works wonders and its other benefit is that it is a clear liquid, meaning it is easy to follow the progress of the reaction (unlike with Ferric Chloride) and therefore not over-etch the board.
If you know what you're doing and you're careful, the peroxide/acid etch works wonders and its other benefit is that it is a clear liquid, meaning it is easy to follow the progress of the reaction (unlike with Ferric Chloride) and therefore not over-etch the board.
Just buy some ammonium persulphate. It's not expensive and a lot less of a hassle than mixing your own etchant. It too has the benefit of a relatively clear solution so that you can see the etching process.
In terms of paper, the best (and most expensive) for me is still Press'n'Peel Blue. I got mine from Techniks in the US. I paid around $65 AUD for 20 sheets (which is still a lot cheaper than the $35 AUD for 5 sheets that most electronic stores charge in Australia). 20 Sheets will last me quite some time, since I only cut out as much as I need and then stick that onto a full size piece of A4 paper (I print a copy first onto plain paper to see where it will ultimately print, and then with a new sheet of paper, I stick the press-n-peel onto it in the correct location).
In terms of paper, the best (and most expensive) for me is still Press'n'Peel Blue. I got mine from Techniks in the US. I paid around $65 AUD for 20 sheets (which is still a lot cheaper than the $35 AUD for 5 sheets that most electronic stores charge in Australia). 20 Sheets will last me quite some time, since I only cut out as much as I need and then stick that onto a full size piece of A4 paper (I print a copy first onto plain paper to see where it will ultimately print, and then with a new sheet of paper, I stick the press-n-peel onto it in the correct location).
Tried press and peel
Maybe the stuff I used was old and had expired, but I had little suucess. To be frank, the success of the EPSON inket Photo paper and its COST effectiveness makes me content to remain using it long into the future. In fact I may actually build a stockpile of the stuff, its so good. Try it!
Oh, and don't forget that Ammonium persulphate is also nasty stuff! Once again, know what you;re doing and exercise CAUTION!
In fact, a good practise implemented in my lab days:
For EVERY single experiment, whether you were familiar with the reagent or not, write out a RISK ASSESSMENT of the chemicals being used, specifically the risks associated with the chem. In this case, a detailed read on one of the many websites will suffice till you can repeat the risks and TREATMENT in your sleep!
Some info on (NH4)2S2O8:
Inhalation:
May irritate the mucous membranes. May cause lung edema. Symptoms may include sore throat, shortness of breath, inflammation of nasal passages, coughing, and wheezing. Any exposure may cause an allergic reaction. Asthma-like symptoms and life-threatening shock may result.
Ingestion:
Corrosive. May produce abdominal pain, nausea and vomiting.
Skin Contact:
Corrosive. May cause skin burns.
Eye Contact:
May cause severe irritation and pain.
Chronic Exposure:
Prolonged skin contact may cause an allergic reaction with dermatitis.
First Aid Measures
Inhalation:
Remove to fresh air. If not breathing, give artificial respiration. If breathing is difficult, give oxygen. Get medical attention.
Ingestion:
If swallowed, DO NOT INDUCE VOMITING. Give large quantities of water. Never give anything by mouth to an unconscious person. Get medical attention immediately.
Skin Contact:
Immediately flush skin with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes while removing contaminated clothing and shoes. Get medical attention immediately. Wash clothing before reuse. Thoroughly clean shoes before reuse.
Eye Contact:
Immediately flush eyes with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes, lifting lower and upper eyelids occasionally. Get medical attention immediately.
Maybe the stuff I used was old and had expired, but I had little suucess. To be frank, the success of the EPSON inket Photo paper and its COST effectiveness makes me content to remain using it long into the future. In fact I may actually build a stockpile of the stuff, its so good. Try it!
Oh, and don't forget that Ammonium persulphate is also nasty stuff! Once again, know what you;re doing and exercise CAUTION!
In fact, a good practise implemented in my lab days:
For EVERY single experiment, whether you were familiar with the reagent or not, write out a RISK ASSESSMENT of the chemicals being used, specifically the risks associated with the chem. In this case, a detailed read on one of the many websites will suffice till you can repeat the risks and TREATMENT in your sleep!
Some info on (NH4)2S2O8:
Inhalation:
May irritate the mucous membranes. May cause lung edema. Symptoms may include sore throat, shortness of breath, inflammation of nasal passages, coughing, and wheezing. Any exposure may cause an allergic reaction. Asthma-like symptoms and life-threatening shock may result.
Ingestion:
Corrosive. May produce abdominal pain, nausea and vomiting.
Skin Contact:
Corrosive. May cause skin burns.
Eye Contact:
May cause severe irritation and pain.
Chronic Exposure:
Prolonged skin contact may cause an allergic reaction with dermatitis.
First Aid Measures
Inhalation:
Remove to fresh air. If not breathing, give artificial respiration. If breathing is difficult, give oxygen. Get medical attention.
Ingestion:
If swallowed, DO NOT INDUCE VOMITING. Give large quantities of water. Never give anything by mouth to an unconscious person. Get medical attention immediately.
Skin Contact:
Immediately flush skin with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes while removing contaminated clothing and shoes. Get medical attention immediately. Wash clothing before reuse. Thoroughly clean shoes before reuse.
Eye Contact:
Immediately flush eyes with plenty of water for at least 15 minutes, lifting lower and upper eyelids occasionally. Get medical attention immediately.
Ever seen an MSDS for ethanol, or tobacco? I would rate persulphate as comparatively harmless, next to some of the cleaning chems available in the supermarket. So long as you don't stick it up your nose, or put a spoonful in your mouth you should be fine.
I'm sure its safer than peroxide / HCl, which has the potential to produce chlorine gas (VERY nasty).
I'm sure its safer than peroxide / HCl, which has the potential to produce chlorine gas (VERY nasty).
Cu + H2O2 > CuO + H20
CuO + 2HCl > CuCl2 + H2O
No Chlorine is produced > what you will get is HCl fumes which when absorbed by the mucous membranes in your nose,mouth and eyes will form hydrochloric acid and cause some harm. In some regards it is fortunate that the HCl fumes react with the humidity in the air and you can see them and so you can keep "upwind" In the above equations the Copper Oxide is insoluble and the Copper Chloride is soluble and is why the mixture etches away the copper.
As already said, gloves , eye protection, out doors in the open air and sodi bicarb on hand and use care and don't breath the fumes.
CuO + 2HCl > CuCl2 + H2O
No Chlorine is produced > what you will get is HCl fumes which when absorbed by the mucous membranes in your nose,mouth and eyes will form hydrochloric acid and cause some harm. In some regards it is fortunate that the HCl fumes react with the humidity in the air and you can see them and so you can keep "upwind" In the above equations the Copper Oxide is insoluble and the Copper Chloride is soluble and is why the mixture etches away the copper.
As already said, gloves , eye protection, out doors in the open air and sodi bicarb on hand and use care and don't breath the fumes.
The reaction can generate Cl2 gas
Hydrogen Peroxide as a Replenisher
The Hydrogen Peroxide system of replenishing has been unpopular in the PCB industry, for no outstanding reason, but not in the closely related Photo-Chemical Milling industry. Perhaps the real reason why it is not popular, is that a reliable control system, for both components required to replenish the system, Hydrogen Peroxide, and Hydrochloric Acid, has only recently become available. Previously, it was probable that those people who took on the challenge of devising their own control system would likely have chosen the least expensive, and easiest system to control replenishment system, which is the Chlorine system. The overall etch/replenishment reaction for Hydrogen Peroxide is:
H2O2+2HCl+Cu >>> CuCl2+H2O
The use of Hydrogen Peroxide also produces a purer Cupric Chloride, without Sodium Chloride (NaCl) impurities, but the Hydrochloric Acid level must be carefully monitored, as it is consumed in the regeneration part of the reaction. This replenishment method also suffers from the fact that over-replenishing with the Hydrogen Peroxide can generate free Chlorine gas.
The fact that the replenisher ingredients are supplied in water solutions, as well as the fact that the replenishment reaction produces water, limits the maximum Cupric Chloride content of the etch, but it is still possible to get to as high as , depending on the concentration of the Peroxide and HCl replenishers
Hydrogen Peroxide as a Replenisher
The Hydrogen Peroxide system of replenishing has been unpopular in the PCB industry, for no outstanding reason, but not in the closely related Photo-Chemical Milling industry. Perhaps the real reason why it is not popular, is that a reliable control system, for both components required to replenish the system, Hydrogen Peroxide, and Hydrochloric Acid, has only recently become available. Previously, it was probable that those people who took on the challenge of devising their own control system would likely have chosen the least expensive, and easiest system to control replenishment system, which is the Chlorine system. The overall etch/replenishment reaction for Hydrogen Peroxide is:
H2O2+2HCl+Cu >>> CuCl2+H2O
The use of Hydrogen Peroxide also produces a purer Cupric Chloride, without Sodium Chloride (NaCl) impurities, but the Hydrochloric Acid level must be carefully monitored, as it is consumed in the regeneration part of the reaction. This replenishment method also suffers from the fact that over-replenishing with the Hydrogen Peroxide can generate free Chlorine gas.
The fact that the replenisher ingredients are supplied in water solutions, as well as the fact that the replenishment reaction produces water, limits the maximum Cupric Chloride content of the etch, but it is still possible to get to as high as , depending on the concentration of the Peroxide and HCl replenishers
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.