I am in the process of building a pair of speakers based on the Econowave design using a Eminence Delta 12LF woofer and the JBL CD Horn and D220ti in a 120L ported enclosure which I modeled in WinISD.
I am using a MiniDSP 4-way as a crossover and have two NAD C320BEE amplifiers.
Before I cut the holes in the baffle I was just toying with the idea of making it 3-way using the Eminence Alphalite 6A and JBL Mid Horn for the midrange and crossing over at 500hz and 2000hz. A bit like the JBL PRX535 speaker.
Is this worth the extra cost (another amp and midrange drivers) or will the 2-way work fine?
I am using a MiniDSP 4-way as a crossover and have two NAD C320BEE amplifiers.
Before I cut the holes in the baffle I was just toying with the idea of making it 3-way using the Eminence Alphalite 6A and JBL Mid Horn for the midrange and crossing over at 500hz and 2000hz. A bit like the JBL PRX535 speaker.
Is this worth the extra cost (another amp and midrange drivers) or will the 2-way work fine?
Member
Joined 2009
Yes ! a 3 ways gives better results than a 2 ways.
500 to 2000Hz, a 5" can do better the job.
I vote for 3 way! 
Although I don't like the idea of using Alphalite 6A driver.
I'd try to get 500hz -20khz with compression drivers,
like these
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-204
and
Selenium ST200 Super Tweeter
Although I don't like the idea of using Alphalite 6A driver.I'd try to get 500hz -20khz with compression drivers,
like these
http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-204
and
Selenium ST200 Super Tweeter
I vote for 3 way!
I'd try to get 500hz -20khz with compression drivers,
like these
Selenium D250-X 1" Phenolic Horn Driver 1-3/8"-18 TPI Pro Audio Compression Driver
and
Selenium ST200 Super Tweeter
like this idea
Great points! After spending several years trying to get my 2-way waveguides to sound great I have concluded that 12" woofers are really not meant to be driven past 1KHz (even 800Hz) if we want a certain high quality sound. My ribbon design (PHL1120 + Neopro5i) always sounded better for music listening then my TD12M + QSC/BMS 4550 and I kept coming back to the midrange performance of the 12" woofer. Having perfect directivity is great for online discussion but in the real world the final result has to sound great. Audio amazingly always has some compromising choice.
Of course I think the OP should upgrade the CD to the B&C DE250 or similar. I was never a fan of those selnium choices.
Of course I think the OP should upgrade the CD to the B&C DE250 or similar. I was never a fan of those selnium choices.
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I vote for 3 way!
I'd try to get 500hz -20khz with compression drivers,
like these
Selenium D250-X 1" Phenolic Horn Driver 1-3/8"-18 TPI Pro Audio Compression Driver
and
Selenium ST200 Super Tweeter
Interesting...
If i were to use that D250 for the midrange which horn would work best in this frequency band?
Excuse my ignorance, how would a 3-way design affect the radiation pattern?
Do you have any good literature that might help me?
Seems like you've got a lot of reading to do! You could start here: http://www.harman.com/EN-US/OurComp...ents/White Papers/LoudspeakersandRoomsPt2.pdf
Member
Joined 2009
Wall reflections will affect somewhat the perceived tonality and to a great extent the imaging. If you don't care about imaging and you are not looking for extreme detail then, yeah 3-way will be a good choice.
In general a 3-way will sound better than a big woofer 2-way. But the Econowave is a Constant Directivity design and will perform much better than a typical 3-way where directivity wasn't a design consideration.
I don't have literature on hand unfortunately but it's a very well documented topic. Basically a speaker will "beam" at the frequency where the wavelength equal the diameter of the radiating surface. At higher frequencies the response pretty much turns into garbage so doug20 had a good point about not using 12" beyond 1500Hz. At lower frequencies the radiation pattern widens and eventually becomes an omni. There are ways to control the dispersion such as the cone shape, phase plugs, phase shields, horns, waveguides and dipoles. Getting it right however is extremely difficult.
I'm not an expert on horn designs, but I'd use narrow horn like this
Goldwood GM-600PB 1" Horn 1-3/8"-18 TPI
,because crossover point is going to be high and drivers need to be closer together. I'd install horn on the very top of the speaker's baffle, and put bullet tweeter on top of speaker box(above mid compression driver)
Can someone explain importance of directivity in a home environment? I understand that it should provide better imaging, since left and right channels don't intermix. Any other subjective benefits?
A much better read on directivity as it relates to the designs under discussion is here.
http://www.pispeakers.com/Pi_Speakers_Info.pdf
I'm doing 3Waves for my surrounds.
http://www.pispeakers.com/Pi_Speakers_Info.pdf
I'm doing 3Waves for my surrounds.
Im confused on your point. A 3-way design is not extremely detailed and lacks imaging?? I always thought my 3-way design (Neopro5i, PHL1120, TD12S) was extremely detailed. More so then any paradigm or B&W speaker I have owned.
I didn't not even like 12" woofers running past 1KHz and I own probably the best designed 12" woofer (TD12M from AESpeaker). I really wish it was not an issue since I want 2-way waveguides to sound amazing to me without having larger waveguides (larger boxes).
Note: all my discussion around how they sound is more of a music thing. For HT 2-way waveguides with 12" woofers XOed at > 1kHz are simply incredible.
Sorry, I wasn't around on Sunday after I posted. I actively XO the 1120 just under 2KHz with my ribbon, Its originally a Curt C. design (HTGuide/Parts Express speaker designer).
If the OP wants, he should maybe order the SEOS-15 waveguide from the group buy thread. Add a DE250 CD and XO at 900Hz then the larger woofer issues may not exist any more.
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Great looking rig, Charlie! 
Bet it sounds great.
I wouldn't get my hopes up on that Selenium CD. Unless you want to use a LOT of EQ - and a big horn. It's not as easy as it seems.
Bet it sounds great.I wouldn't get my hopes up on that Selenium CD. Unless you want to use a LOT of EQ - and a big horn. It's not as easy as it seems.
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