Once again, I really enjoyed our DIY weekend. And my son Gabriel is really getting into this too (he's certainly pleased with having collected more "swag" again), this being his second year to attend. Other son James was there for Sunday, and found it interesting.
I wanted to get back to Pinocchio (and any other interested readers) w.r.t. one of his earlier posts i.e. when is the next get-together? I was part of a discussion late Sunday on that very topic. Some of us have met up in-between the "formal" get-togethers to talk, etc., and probably will again. However, when it comes to formal events, this has been our 3rd "big" get-together in a hall, and we tended to think that continuing with one annual winter get-together is the way to go:
Why? Well, with all the other things going on in other seasons, we tended to think that the winter scheduling works well. And keeping it "annual" - rather than more frequently -does have some advantages, such as giving DIY'ers enough time to work on new projects (or finish old projects) between get-togethers.
Our group has remained informal so far, so I'm just posting the preceding for information. As Pierre indicated in his earlier post, somebody will probably try to get the ball rolling as we approach the end of this year, so that we can have our 4th get-together in 2013.
- Ron
I wanted to get back to Pinocchio (and any other interested readers) w.r.t. one of his earlier posts i.e. when is the next get-together? I was part of a discussion late Sunday on that very topic. Some of us have met up in-between the "formal" get-togethers to talk, etc., and probably will again. However, when it comes to formal events, this has been our 3rd "big" get-together in a hall, and we tended to think that continuing with one annual winter get-together is the way to go:
Why? Well, with all the other things going on in other seasons, we tended to think that the winter scheduling works well. And keeping it "annual" - rather than more frequently -does have some advantages, such as giving DIY'ers enough time to work on new projects (or finish old projects) between get-togethers.
Our group has remained informal so far, so I'm just posting the preceding for information. As Pierre indicated in his earlier post, somebody will probably try to get the ball rolling as we approach the end of this year, so that we can have our 4th get-together in 2013.
- Ron
Like Mark, I want to publicly thank Pierre for making this event happen for us. He'll tell you that he doesn't do everything, and he doesn't, but he sure does a lot of the "heavy lifting" w.r.t. administration to make our get-together happen.
And I also wanted to thank attendees (and I'll have to send a thankyou to CSS) for donating items for "door prizes" - got to like free stuff! Now where will I put 1 mid-bass driver?
Wolfgang, we'll talk about the Montreal show some more. I'd like to do it again.
And I also wanted to thank attendees (and I'll have to send a thankyou to CSS) for donating items for "door prizes" - got to like free stuff! Now where will I put 1 mid-bass driver?
Wolfgang, we'll talk about the Montreal show some more. I'd like to do it again.
I for one am in. I enjoy the stuff you guys are doing. Absolutely first class work. ANd it sounds good to!
So as things this year wind down to autumn I will be making the rounds once again to see who is interested. I'm guessing the same type of planning meetings will be useful. Worked well last time.
Who knows, maybe some of the really best stuff is yet to come?
Figure i should chime in here with my thoughts,
Owen, your speakers sounded fantastic, it was a bit of shame that the turntable kept getting mechanical feedback forcing you to push up the HPF, i know they had much more authority than we got to experience.
Mark, Showstopper again. You just keep raising the bar bit by bit. Someone commented "i though you were just a subwoofer guy" after hearing the speakers and being blown away. For those not paying attention, we hit peaks of 110db at listening position, with nine watts... The woofers were loafing along at maybe 2mm xmax tops. It was so scary clean that everyone was hearing stuff they hadn't heard in their own recordings. At the start we had the crossover set fairly low, and pushed it up a bit later in the show, Pushing it up took something that sounded really good, and made it sound AMAZING! Theres a reason that once we set them up, we never disconnected them. Wolfgang even wanted to move the turntable over to them instead of the digital setup we had, just so he could hear some of his recordings on a set of speakers that had a lot going for them. We never ended up setting up the turntable as the wooden floors of the building really weren't playing nice with them. We did however play a FLAC version of Dark side of the moon that made him quite happy
After the show Mark brought one of the towers into my apartment to do some 1w frequency response testing. The first thing i noticed was that the little woofers were getting extension to 23hz! NO WONDER THE ROOM WAS SHAKING! Also, 1w is painfully loud on test tones with a high efficiency speaker.
Wolfgang: Very interesting demo on cleaning vinyl, I'm not sure if you saw me, but i was on the other side of the chalk board paying attention, I didn't however catch the solutions you use for cleaning with.
Thanks again Pierre, It was great to see everyone again!
Hopefully my CBT is ready for the next show.
Owen, your speakers sounded fantastic, it was a bit of shame that the turntable kept getting mechanical feedback forcing you to push up the HPF, i know they had much more authority than we got to experience.
Mark, Showstopper again. You just keep raising the bar bit by bit. Someone commented "i though you were just a subwoofer guy" after hearing the speakers and being blown away. For those not paying attention, we hit peaks of 110db at listening position, with nine watts... The woofers were loafing along at maybe 2mm xmax tops. It was so scary clean that everyone was hearing stuff they hadn't heard in their own recordings. At the start we had the crossover set fairly low, and pushed it up a bit later in the show, Pushing it up took something that sounded really good, and made it sound AMAZING! Theres a reason that once we set them up, we never disconnected them. Wolfgang even wanted to move the turntable over to them instead of the digital setup we had, just so he could hear some of his recordings on a set of speakers that had a lot going for them. We never ended up setting up the turntable as the wooden floors of the building really weren't playing nice with them. We did however play a FLAC version of Dark side of the moon that made him quite happy
After the show Mark brought one of the towers into my apartment to do some 1w frequency response testing. The first thing i noticed was that the little woofers were getting extension to 23hz! NO WONDER THE ROOM WAS SHAKING! Also, 1w is painfully loud on test tones with a high efficiency speaker.
Wolfgang: Very interesting demo on cleaning vinyl, I'm not sure if you saw me, but i was on the other side of the chalk board paying attention, I didn't however catch the solutions you use for cleaning with.
Thanks again Pierre, It was great to see everyone again!
Hopefully my CBT is ready for the next show.
BTW guys, really good to see another regular diyFEST catching wind in its sails... maybe i'll make it someday -- we have had a visitor frm Ottawa at one of our FESTs
Mark, you VWR horn looks very interesting, i have heard a set at Bob's and eagerly awaiting officialT/S numbers.I should have 4 in hand shortly.
dave
Mark, you VWR horn looks very interesting, i have heard a set at Bob's and eagerly awaiting officialT/S numbers.I should have 4 in hand shortly.
dave
Just a note to Dave (Planet 10)
Didn't expect to see you contributing to our Ottawa get-together thread, but thanks for the encouragement, and you would certainly be welcome.
And if you didn't happen to notice - post 213 mentions you & one of your designs which I got my son to follow for his 1st DIY build (high school project). We didn't use the proper driver, but as you'll notice, it makes sound (and he's now interested in doing more).
- Ron
Didn't expect to see you contributing to our Ottawa get-together thread, but thanks for the encouragement, and you would certainly be welcome.
And if you didn't happen to notice - post 213 mentions you & one of your designs which I got my son to follow for his 1st DIY build (high school project). We didn't use the proper driver, but as you'll notice, it makes sound (and he's now interested in doing more).
- Ron
Headphone listening:
I was one of the guys who pushed for the inclusion of a headphone listening “quiet” period in the scheduling, so I better report on that:
There were 2 “tables” that were set-up for different comparisons. One table basically kept the source & headphone constant, so that DAC’s & amps could be compared - please check post #228 for more info on that. Unfortunately, I didn’t get around to listening to that set-up.
I listened/participated on the other table, which involved less controlled comparisons. I brought an old portable CD player as my source, into a Little Dot 1+ (tubed) headphone amp (that’s a retail product, not a DIY build), along with several headphones… the HiFiMan HE-300 seemed to be the most common partner.
MrSlim brought a laptop source, into his Gamma2 DAC build, & then into one of 2 headphone amps he built i.e. the Cavalli Kumisa and the Objective 2 (O2) …the O2 saw the most action; MrSlim & others brought along several headphones.
I didn’t compare all the headphones that were brought, though I think a couple of guys did get through a bunch of them, and hopefully they’ll post. FYI - verbal comments to me indicated that those guys favoured the HE-300. From the other phones that I did try myself, I’d say that the Shure SRH940 would be the headphones I liked best (after the HE-300’s).
Mini-review: I bought the (1st gen) HE-300’s, used, fairly recently (if I was buying new, I’d probably go through HeadDirect, since I think they’re the authorized seller). These are the entry-level dynamic design, and reviews seem to indicate that their notable strength or drawback (depending on preference) is warm midrange. I’ve mostly been pleased with their sonic character, but sometimes I think that I’d like to get a little more upper treble information. However, since I’m running them through a tube amp (& tube systems are often characterized for “warm” midrange), I was wondering if my set-up was compounding the warmth.
So I swapped the Little Dot out & the O2 amp in. I would have to say that I thought that I was getting more upper treble information with the O2, and I don’t think that anything else was lost in the process. So, thankyou MrSlim, for bringing the O2 – it does seem to be a very nice little headphone amp for the DIY community, and I’m glad that I got a chance to try it.
I was one of the guys who pushed for the inclusion of a headphone listening “quiet” period in the scheduling, so I better report on that:
There were 2 “tables” that were set-up for different comparisons. One table basically kept the source & headphone constant, so that DAC’s & amps could be compared - please check post #228 for more info on that. Unfortunately, I didn’t get around to listening to that set-up.
I listened/participated on the other table, which involved less controlled comparisons. I brought an old portable CD player as my source, into a Little Dot 1+ (tubed) headphone amp (that’s a retail product, not a DIY build), along with several headphones… the HiFiMan HE-300 seemed to be the most common partner.
MrSlim brought a laptop source, into his Gamma2 DAC build, & then into one of 2 headphone amps he built i.e. the Cavalli Kumisa and the Objective 2 (O2) …the O2 saw the most action; MrSlim & others brought along several headphones.
I didn’t compare all the headphones that were brought, though I think a couple of guys did get through a bunch of them, and hopefully they’ll post. FYI - verbal comments to me indicated that those guys favoured the HE-300. From the other phones that I did try myself, I’d say that the Shure SRH940 would be the headphones I liked best (after the HE-300’s).
Mini-review: I bought the (1st gen) HE-300’s, used, fairly recently (if I was buying new, I’d probably go through HeadDirect, since I think they’re the authorized seller). These are the entry-level dynamic design, and reviews seem to indicate that their notable strength or drawback (depending on preference) is warm midrange. I’ve mostly been pleased with their sonic character, but sometimes I think that I’d like to get a little more upper treble information. However, since I’m running them through a tube amp (& tube systems are often characterized for “warm” midrange), I was wondering if my set-up was compounding the warmth.
So I swapped the Little Dot out & the O2 amp in. I would have to say that I thought that I was getting more upper treble information with the O2, and I don’t think that anything else was lost in the process. So, thankyou MrSlim, for bringing the O2 – it does seem to be a very nice little headphone amp for the DIY community, and I’m glad that I got a chance to try it.
Mark, what kind of sensitivity would I expect from two of those VWR drivers in parallel rather than four in series-parallel? And how low / what order did that css planar cross to get the kind of dynamics you get?
I need a mid in a 3-way that will do about 93db to mate to an AE TD12X near 3-400hz.
I need a mid in a 3-way that will do about 93db to mate to an AE TD12X near 3-400hz.
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I did note that Ron, and just from the front, i have had, or still have at least one of the drivers you use. ML-TLs are pretty tolerant and its good to see people trying out other drivers.
dave
Indeed. I see information is becoming available on these drivers. It seems they are the VWR126X. (Apologies if this has been posted already).
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Mark Kravchenko’s CSS speakers:
Mark has brought some interesting speakers to our past get-togethers, and this one was no different…actually he probably raised the bar. I understand that he came up with the design concept a few months ago, but he threw it together just before our get-together, so everybody including him was hearing these for the first time. We were all impressed.
As mentioned, it used multiples of a prototype CSS driver, but since some posts are mentioning a part #, they might be available before too long; I think that the ribbon tweeter may be available now, but someone else can clarify. Although I wouldn’t expect much bass from these relatively small drivers, the truth is that there was lots of bass (c/r other posts). I understand that the interior of Mark’s cabinet uses some variation of horn-loading (maybe look at the # of panels/folds in the interior design for the Exodus Anarchy tapped horn for a very rough comparison), with a mouth opening at the bottom back. A digital crossover was used at our get-together & the cross-over point was adjusted a bit during the course of our listening, but all-in-all, it was pretty remarkable to hear these things in action when Mark admits that construction didn’t get underway until days before our meeting.
Mark’s test CD’s included some pipe organ (of course), which demonstrated bass prowess; some other classical demonstrated dynamics, and transient response; requests were taken, so we also heard them perform rock (Pink Floyd, etc.). I found a Holly Cole selection a bit harsh in spots…arguably a characteristic of her voice, so I wasn’t certain if that was the performance or the speaker; in any case, the crossover point was tweaked a bit after that, and I think that the overall presentation from the speakers improved slightly due to that adjustment. Later, I got to move closer to the “ideal” listening location, to hear a few selections that I’m familiar with – from Shostakovich’s 5th (Bernstein), vocalist Roberta Gambarini (So In Love), and Kate Bush (Hounds). I heard a good amount of detail, speed, and all the instruments and voices seemed to be there…I didn’t pick up on any particular colouration.
Despite modest amplifier requirements (c/r other posts), volume was louder than I typically hear at home, and certainly room-filling (i.e. no “break-up” despite playing plenty loud). I think I’d have to hear the speakers under better conditions before reaching my final decision about their level of detail (since I’ve been listening to headphones lately, I’ve been “spoiled” by hearing little details in recordings), and “imaging” qualities (the meeting room was mostly hard surfaces, and I don’t think that the speakers were “finely-tuned” w.r.t. placement). However, I’m aware that probably 95% of my home listening is not from the “sweet spot”, so even I have to take my inconclusive comments about critical listening with a grain of salt.
Ultimately, I know that these speakers are still under development, but I heard enough to suspect that these speakers will be “keepers” once they are available. Kudos to Mark and CSS.
Mark has brought some interesting speakers to our past get-togethers, and this one was no different…actually he probably raised the bar. I understand that he came up with the design concept a few months ago, but he threw it together just before our get-together, so everybody including him was hearing these for the first time. We were all impressed.
As mentioned, it used multiples of a prototype CSS driver, but since some posts are mentioning a part #, they might be available before too long; I think that the ribbon tweeter may be available now, but someone else can clarify. Although I wouldn’t expect much bass from these relatively small drivers, the truth is that there was lots of bass (c/r other posts). I understand that the interior of Mark’s cabinet uses some variation of horn-loading (maybe look at the # of panels/folds in the interior design for the Exodus Anarchy tapped horn for a very rough comparison), with a mouth opening at the bottom back. A digital crossover was used at our get-together & the cross-over point was adjusted a bit during the course of our listening, but all-in-all, it was pretty remarkable to hear these things in action when Mark admits that construction didn’t get underway until days before our meeting.
Mark’s test CD’s included some pipe organ (of course), which demonstrated bass prowess; some other classical demonstrated dynamics, and transient response; requests were taken, so we also heard them perform rock (Pink Floyd, etc.). I found a Holly Cole selection a bit harsh in spots…arguably a characteristic of her voice, so I wasn’t certain if that was the performance or the speaker; in any case, the crossover point was tweaked a bit after that, and I think that the overall presentation from the speakers improved slightly due to that adjustment. Later, I got to move closer to the “ideal” listening location, to hear a few selections that I’m familiar with – from Shostakovich’s 5th (Bernstein), vocalist Roberta Gambarini (So In Love), and Kate Bush (Hounds). I heard a good amount of detail, speed, and all the instruments and voices seemed to be there…I didn’t pick up on any particular colouration.
Despite modest amplifier requirements (c/r other posts), volume was louder than I typically hear at home, and certainly room-filling (i.e. no “break-up” despite playing plenty loud). I think I’d have to hear the speakers under better conditions before reaching my final decision about their level of detail (since I’ve been listening to headphones lately, I’ve been “spoiled” by hearing little details in recordings), and “imaging” qualities (the meeting room was mostly hard surfaces, and I don’t think that the speakers were “finely-tuned” w.r.t. placement). However, I’m aware that probably 95% of my home listening is not from the “sweet spot”, so even I have to take my inconclusive comments about critical listening with a grain of salt.
Ultimately, I know that these speakers are still under development, but I heard enough to suspect that these speakers will be “keepers” once they are available. Kudos to Mark and CSS.
Nice review, Ron. Thank you. This headphone comparison session was a great way to start the day. My brother Daniel tried many of them, and the two he liked best are the Denon AH-D2000 and your HE-300. I did not get to try the Denon, but among those that I tried I too preferred your HE-300. They had real bass and were very comfortable.
Pierre
CSS LD25X Tweeter thread
Hi,
For those of you interested in the new tweets, there's a thread with measurements:
Report on the New CSS LD25X Tweeter - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video, and Electronics Customer Discussion Forum From Parts-Express.com
bearberry
Hi,
For those of you interested in the new tweets, there's a thread with measurements:
Report on the New CSS LD25X Tweeter - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video, and Electronics Customer Discussion Forum From Parts-Express.com
bearberry
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