A Revelation
Marcee Quantum Biterlizer
I have just reviewed this revolution that puts an end to all arguments over the difference between bit-identical music. Installed between my Patima Media Server and Sabrefunken DAC, the difference was immediate and unmistakeable. The noise floor dropped into the abyss. The air around the music became clear as inter-stellar vacuum, and the timbre of glockenspiels was finally true. Where it really made the most difference was internet radio from my Squeezebox touch. Now it rivals a Gold CD in quality. I could finally relax and just listen to the music. I understand it is available at her site on sale from $5995 to $5720, a true bargain.
Other Equipment used:
Punk Steamtable transport
Vintage Lafayette Receiver with Afgehoben Pentode NOS 1939 tubes
Knox gold cabling
Grave concrete waveguide compression horns with cadaver throats
Volt Guppy Richter sub-woofer with Minotaur labyrinth transmission line enclosure.
Mickey plush room treatments
I am working on the Marcee Quantum Biterlizer at this very moment, this revolutionary device will clean the digital bits as they pass through it, removing any dross and other added noise from crappy PSU's, bad ripping etc, it does this at a quantum level leaving perfect bits of either a 0 or a 1.
Have fun
Oh still no reply to my question on how this noise could be recorded with the bit pattern...
Marcee Quantum Biterlizer
I have just reviewed this revolution that puts an end to all arguments over the difference between bit-identical music. Installed between my Patima Media Server and Sabrefunken DAC, the difference was immediate and unmistakeable. The noise floor dropped into the abyss. The air around the music became clear as inter-stellar vacuum, and the timbre of glockenspiels was finally true. Where it really made the most difference was internet radio from my Squeezebox touch. Now it rivals a Gold CD in quality. I could finally relax and just listen to the music. I understand it is available at her site on sale from $5995 to $5720, a true bargain.
Other Equipment used:
Punk Steamtable transport
Vintage Lafayette Receiver with Afgehoben Pentode NOS 1939 tubes
Knox gold cabling
Grave concrete waveguide compression horns with cadaver throats
Volt Guppy Richter sub-woofer with Minotaur labyrinth transmission line enclosure.
Mickey plush room treatments
Sorry. We should have called it 'bad physics' or maybe 'so bad it isn't even wrong'.Scott6113 said:
Thank you for exhibiting your confusion about science. The idea that 'we don't know everything, therefore we know nothing' is often trotted out by people ignorant of science. They smile as though they are satisfied that they have put us in our place; we smile as they have merely exhibited their confusion.powerpan said:
If you want rapture, you'll have to duplicate my setup, Marce: http://3950.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/Lafayette-HE-401.jpg
http://www.floridavilla4us.com/tuscan-hills-5-bed-villa/i/mickey-mouse-room-2.jpg
http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/2009/08/03/gothic-stereo-speakers_2nZ3z_24702.jpg
http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Steampunk-Turntable.jpg
http://www.floridavilla4us.com/tuscan-hills-5-bed-villa/i/mickey-mouse-room-2.jpg
http://www.instablogsimages.com/images/2009/08/03/gothic-stereo-speakers_2nZ3z_24702.jpg
http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/Steampunk-Turntable.jpg
Another "theorhetorical" question: Instead of devoting their resources to copy protection and security technology, suing companies and kids, etc. why didn't the powers-that-be just divert a little bit to getting the word out that moving the files around on hardware or a network would corrupt the data?
Jeremy
That is great, coming from the person who wasn't even courteous enough to reply to a private message, despite saying he would in an earlier post, I had asked him if he was prepared to actually LISTEN to files that I would give him the download links to. It seems that many of you here only post to try and impress others of your own claimed knowledge of a subject, and band together to put down people who report different experiences.
This kind of thing has become all too common here recently where sarcastic replies are becoming the norm.
BTW, Martin Colloms did NOT do all the HFC listening sessions.They were done by different people, which would be seen if the other HFC threads on the subject were read. Neither did the HFC forum members receive the same .wav files that Martin Colloms used, and their own equipment would almost certainly be nowhere in the same league as that used by M.C.
A couple did report back to me that they heard differences, but preferred the poorer sounding rips because they seemed to sound a little louder.
A C.A. member tried to become a HFC member so that he could participate ,
but had difficulty registering. I passed his results on to M.C. by email.
There are at least 6 Sydney members who come from mainly backgrounds in I.T. who have heard these things directly at my place, and at regular get togethers at a friends place, who is also a DIYA member.
There should be a qualified and highly experienced E.E. present at our next meeting on March 3.
This DIYA member was present at the previous session and did hear differences between 2 rips of "Yello-Bostich (Reflected) " Thinking about it at home later he decided it must have been Psychoacoustic, because the checksums said so !
I had previously invited Sydney DIYAudio moderator "wintermute" to listen himself and report back. Unfortunately, he was unable to do so at the time.
Tony is still welcome to do so if he can spare the time.
Have a nice day !
Getting closer here, qusp ...
You guys are missing the point. Of course the information represented by the contents of the files is identical, but the analogue apparatus storing that information in the two cases is different. Put on your digital glasses, of course they are the same; replace them with your analogue ones and the differences scream at you.
I am not arguing that noise is somehow captured by different ripping, rather that a different pattern of noise is generated during playback. In the world of computer audio a huge amount of effort and discussion occur on precisely this problem of minimising PC interference during playback.
Unfortunately, thinking of audio as digital information does not solve sound quality problems. At the level of the oscilloscope it's still all an analogue rat's nest, and the same old problems of stopping the behaviour of one bit of electrical circuitry affecting another bit rear their ugly heads ...
Frank
Sorry, feeding the same playbook equipment can sound different. If the playback side is susceptible to interference then if you change the electrical signature of the interference during playback of the two files then they will sound different. Since the the two files are not identical in every sense, the PC functioning, and hence electrical activity, in the process of reading the files from the media will differ. That's the sequence ...
It's no good saying it's poor engineering if this happens, we are dealing with consumer level products. Ears are sensitive, and manufacturers have budgets which say, this is good enough; the two are in conflict ...
Frank
For the moment consider a parallel situation in the world of the CD; corresponds to an even "worse" scenario, absolutely identical files. Slides in, plays, sounds good. User takes it out, then someone comes into the room and says "Play that again!". This time, unbenownst to the owner, while picking up the CD a bit of dirt gets stuck on the inner rim. Meaning that when seated on the spindle the CD flutters up and down slightly as it spins. The poor old laser servo mechanism goes into overdrive trying to maintain focus, current spikes from the consumer grade power supply pulse to keep the servo happy. And finally the DAC is lashed with much higher levels of PS noise. "Gee, that CD sounds all different now, what's going on ...".
Does one need data to demonstrate this type of scenario?
Frank
Does one need data to demonstrate this type of scenario?
Frank
Hi fas42,
I always thought the storage and retrieval of data was always digital. I just can't see an "analogue apparatus storing that information".
Following this logic, each time you play any track it will sound different. Will starting and stopping a CPU intensive task affect the sound? Will intense disk activity affect the sound? These should be very easy to test in a controlled manner.
Sometimes in life one gets much further with thought experiments than "real" data. If the engineering of bridges worked on the basis that you required a number of bridges to collapse before you changed the way you designed them I don't think too many people would be happy; so, if a scenario makes sense as a thought experiment in the electronics world, and I adjust your approach based on that, and the subjective results improve because of the changed approach I feel I have sufficient "data".
You might say the data that "proves" the world of PC playback has these "issues" is the level of energy expended in playing with software which alter how the PC operates during playing of music files. One player has a massive number of options which allow one to fiddle with precisely how it does its job, and to shut down extraneous PC activity. The creator cheerfully confirms that the bit pattern fed to the DAC is always, is always the same, but the users go nuts tweaking the settings. So they are all mad, or there's something in it ...
Frank
You might say the data that "proves" the world of PC playback has these "issues" is the level of energy expended in playing with software which alter how the PC operates during playing of music files. One player has a massive number of options which allow one to fiddle with precisely how it does its job, and to shut down extraneous PC activity. The creator cheerfully confirms that the bit pattern fed to the DAC is always, is always the same, but the users go nuts tweaking the settings. So they are all mad, or there's something in it ...
Frank
Cheers, Greg ...
We choose to view it as digital, but in the world of magnetic patterns on a hard disk, or pits on a CD it's very, very analogue. Provided we always view it as digital there's no problems, where it can come slightly undone is when we finally want to use analogue means to comprehend the material. An analogy might be a text file, the text as informations stays the same; but then it is presented in an analogue view: different fonts, background colour, the size of font might be a touch small to read some material easily, a grease stain on the monitor blurs the text in one corner - the world of digital has intercepted that of analogue ...
Yes, software like xxHighEnd allows you to play to your heart's content with these things ...
Frank
Hey sandyK, where's my invite, or am I being shunned for being a heretic.
If you like we could develop a test that would prove this one way or the other. I have a bit of spare time on my hands now.
so many words, so little sense, so many blatant contradictions.... when the very basic premise of the argument is crazy, there needs to be some sort of mechanism by which you decide to not follow people down the rabithole.
methinks somehow you have all made your computers and DACs worse somehow to the point where they barely function
methinks somehow you have all made your computers and DACs worse somehow to the point where they barely function
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