Hi boy's,
“I find this very curious. Here we have 777, who has only recently joined.”
**Why? This is illegal?
“Here in the US, copying someone’s IP is both illegal and considered a bad thing. Stealing, a crime, bad karma. But in other areas of the globe, it is accepted.”
****Really? Where you live? Maybe illegal on paper, but “here in the US“ people copying someone’s IP everyday, steals and kill everyday.
“It would be rather naive of me to think that we could control all the unfair and bad things that happen in the world.”
****Agree! Very, very naive!
“I find this very curious. Here we have 777, who has only recently joined.”
**Why? This is illegal?
“Here in the US, copying someone’s IP is both illegal and considered a bad thing. Stealing, a crime, bad karma. But in other areas of the globe, it is accepted.”
****Really? Where you live? Maybe illegal on paper, but “here in the US“ people copying someone’s IP everyday, steals and kill everyday.
“It would be rather naive of me to think that we could control all the unfair and bad things that happen in the world.”
****Agree! Very, very naive!
There's a simple remedy to this vital issue :
We is to do a well organised large volume 2SJ313/2SK2013 purchase undertaking for all of us wellbehaved and nice law abiding boyz to start building them whatyoumacallit fine southern bred GR-25.
Next thing y'all know the Gene-tleman will refrain from selling them Alephs but be harrassing Mr Rollins sir with GR Clone boards he'll be offering by the buckload on them virtual high or short ways.
We is to do a well organised large volume 2SJ313/2SK2013 purchase undertaking for all of us wellbehaved and nice law abiding boyz to start building them whatyoumacallit fine southern bred GR-25.
Next thing y'all know the Gene-tleman will refrain from selling them Alephs but be harrassing Mr Rollins sir with GR Clone boards he'll be offering by the buckload on them virtual high or short ways.
“No. Just suspect.”
*****Why, for god’s sake.
“In case my assumption is correct that you registered twice, once with mike_diy and now with 777”
*****No. You are wrong, Hugo “Holmes”. Poor Mike.
“I thought that meant an instant ban?”
*****Why. Because I like DIYgene?
“We’re not ‘that’ crude.”
****Really, boys?
But, Aleph schematics are free on internet like many others from Pass Labs. Today people kill people around the world, steal freedom from many more. And after all you are so “crude” because some boy makes little profit from free schematic. You are “DIY” and he is thief.
If you are happy with ban, good lack.
*****Why, for god’s sake.
“In case my assumption is correct that you registered twice, once with mike_diy and now with 777”
*****No. You are wrong, Hugo “Holmes”. Poor Mike.
“I thought that meant an instant ban?”
*****Why. Because I like DIYgene?
“We’re not ‘that’ crude.”
****Really, boys?
But, Aleph schematics are free on internet like many others from Pass Labs. Today people kill people around the world, steal freedom from many more. And after all you are so “crude” because some boy makes little profit from free schematic. You are “DIY” and he is thief.
If you are happy with ban, good lack.
If you don't understand why. Then an explanation won't help either.
If you don't understand why. Then an explanation won't help either.
No..that is not what anyone is saying.
But what I think what we are saying is that some people ask for permission from Nelson and some don't. Those who don't are viewed differently from those who do.
This blustering comparison of circuit theft to killing wears thin.
I call it the "I was bad, but I wasn't as bad as I could have been" defense. The steps go like this:
1) Sure, there's a profit made on the circuits
2) But it's not as bad as killing someone
3) Therefore, since it's not as bad as killing someone, it's scarcely a crime...in fact it's no crime at all
The crowning touch is when the guilty party claims to have morals and ethics equal to or superior to those who point out the poor behavior. It's not unusual for the miscreant to then claim that he was 'forced' into taking the action in question by the actions of others. After which any further criticism is labeled 'persecution' and frequently followed by ramped up efforts to be bad as the offender attempts to 'punish' those who chastised him in the first place.
It's childish and immature, but a surprising number of (putative) adults engage in this sort of thing. Look at the behavior of certain world leaders over the last few years for concrete examples.
Grey
I call it the "I was bad, but I wasn't as bad as I could have been" defense. The steps go like this:
1) Sure, there's a profit made on the circuits
2) But it's not as bad as killing someone
3) Therefore, since it's not as bad as killing someone, it's scarcely a crime...in fact it's no crime at all
The crowning touch is when the guilty party claims to have morals and ethics equal to or superior to those who point out the poor behavior. It's not unusual for the miscreant to then claim that he was 'forced' into taking the action in question by the actions of others. After which any further criticism is labeled 'persecution' and frequently followed by ramped up efforts to be bad as the offender attempts to 'punish' those who chastised him in the first place.
It's childish and immature, but a surprising number of (putative) adults engage in this sort of thing. Look at the behavior of certain world leaders over the last few years for concrete examples.
Grey
“I don't believe that Nelson Pass publishes the Aleph anymore. Specifically because of the antics of DIY Gene.”
****Oh, c’mon open your eyes please. He is guilty again.
“777 seems more interested in arguing- possibly trolling, than DIY projects”
Wrong again. I am in search for a good amp schematic. I would also like to find good PCB design for this amp. I think about Aleph 5. I did not start this post, but I think you’re so unfair about DIY-gene. All of you think “Why buy when you can build” and you build amp for probably $200-$600. Why you did not buy -you steal $x.xxx from real price for yourself.
****Oh, c’mon open your eyes please. He is guilty again.
“777 seems more interested in arguing- possibly trolling, than DIY projects”
Wrong again. I am in search for a good amp schematic. I would also like to find good PCB design for this amp. I think about Aleph 5. I did not start this post, but I think you’re so unfair about DIY-gene. All of you think “Why buy when you can build” and you build amp for probably $200-$600. Why you did not buy -you steal $x.xxx from real price for yourself.
777 said:
Typical statement of someone without a clue about the diy audio concept, but who's interested in monetary gain only.
Parts must be really cheap in Wisconsin if an Aleph 5 can be assembled there for $200 to $600.
Some members here spend more money each year on parts alone than what either a new or used Aleph 5 would cost.
A large portion of the Pass labs amp assemblers build one amp after another, if they just wanted a good amplifier they'd be better off just buying the factory model and be done with it.
The total hours required for building an amp can be spent on working for cash, an assembled and original Pass amp would come for free at the end of the balance.
Personally speaking, i make more money on interest rates alone than what it saves me to assemble an amplifier, DIY audio is just a Hobby and for some a hobby is more entertaining for the mind than making more cash.
Evidently hard to understand for people who only have a commercial drive, DIYgene should relocate to Wisconsin if that place is "really" populated by folks as Mike-diy and 777.
""DIY audio is just a Hobby"""
****Agree.
Pure Mike- again one Sherlock Holms.
****Tarraqon Boy, are you serious? Or you just have problem.
Can you accept that somebody could think different from what you do? You boys really hate DIY gene. I think we all see what is going on here.
................
****Agree.
Pure Mike- again one Sherlock Holms.
****Tarraqon Boy, are you serious? Or you just have problem.
Can you accept that somebody could think different from what you do? You boys really hate DIY gene. I think we all see what is going on here.
................ 
get my vote.Re: IP Infringement
You are factually incorrect, patent infringement is not criminal in the US (I hear in Germany that patent infringement is in fact a criminal matter, but that's hearsay), it is strictly a civil matter. Patent infringement is for sure not stealing, theft, larceny or any other criminal matter involving theft, it is INFRINGEMENT.
IMO purchasing a government sanctioned monopoly is not good karma and very much counter to a free market economy. And as bad as the current PTO is at judging how novel an invention is, it pretty much is boiling down to government sold limited monopolies. Ohh yea and just for good measure I have to throw in a "Were the Patent Office, not the Rejection Office", T-shirts that were passed out to examiners a few years ago.
This is probably the most important point (which most are not making at all, I've seen so many use terms like illegal, theft, stealing, etc...), this thread is about how ppl FEEL about diygene's business practices event though there is no difference between him and those that do get permission from Nelson Pass legally assuming there is no infringement (board artwork, trademark, etc...).
Actually IP holders use this argument all the time about "pirating and stealing" various IP, it has very little to do with whatever market they happen to be in. Hell this statement is made yearly by the RIAA about file sharing of music stating as fact that X dollars of revenue was lost because X songs were "stolen". Of course this is absurd, but they still say it.
As far as what DIY audio is all about, that's going to vary so much I wouldn't even attempt to prognosticate for everyone
But I would guess that there are just as many on the frugal side as the ones that will spend big bucks on some uber cap.
Panelhead said:
You are factually incorrect, patent infringement is not criminal in the US (I hear in Germany that patent infringement is in fact a criminal matter, but that's hearsay), it is strictly a civil matter. Patent infringement is for sure not stealing, theft, larceny or any other criminal matter involving theft, it is INFRINGEMENT.
IMO purchasing a government sanctioned monopoly is not good karma and very much counter to a free market economy. And as bad as the current PTO is at judging how novel an invention is, it pretty much is boiling down to government sold limited monopolies. Ohh yea and just for good measure I have to throw in a "Were the Patent Office, not the Rejection Office", T-shirts that were passed out to examiners a few years ago.
Bas Horneman said:
This is probably the most important point (which most are not making at all, I've seen so many use terms like illegal, theft, stealing, etc...), this thread is about how ppl FEEL about diygene's business practices event though there is no difference between him and those that do get permission from Nelson Pass legally assuming there is no infringement (board artwork, trademark, etc...).
jacco vermeulen said:
Actually IP holders use this argument all the time about "pirating and stealing" various IP, it has very little to do with whatever market they happen to be in. Hell this statement is made yearly by the RIAA about file sharing of music stating as fact that X dollars of revenue was lost because X songs were "stolen". Of course this is absurd, but they still say it.
As far as what DIY audio is all about, that's going to vary so much I wouldn't even attempt to prognosticate for everyone
But I would guess that there are just as many on the frugal side as the ones that will spend big bucks on some uber cap.While the suggestion to 'not feed the troll' is well intentioned, there are more layers to this than a simple case of a DIY member with a bad attitude. Because there are other people who seem to think that their mere desire for something is sufficient rationale to take it, it's important to publicly identify the bad guys and make a bit of a stink so that other people--potential customers, in this case--know that certain behaviors are not acceptable. To ignore that sort of thing can all too easily give certain types of people the impression that they will be likewise tolerated if they decide to do the same sort of thing.
I'm under no illusions that 777 merely needs education in order to see the error of his ways. He's chosen his path and rationalized it. I've met (and grew up with) far too many of his ilk to expect him to suddenly smack his forehead and exclaim, "The scales have fallen from my eyes!" It's about as likely as the possibility of me winning the lottery. 777 has indicated that he likes Gene. Whether they are friends, relatives, business associates...or perhaps even one and the same person...it says something less than flattering about 777's character and personality.
As for the question of voting this odious creature off the island, I'd have to say that the proposal--though tempting in this case--isn't a good idea. That sort of government is dangerous in the long run.
I must say that for someone who bills himself as a "DIY master" in his profile, I've seen precious little to back up the claim.
Grey
I'm under no illusions that 777 merely needs education in order to see the error of his ways. He's chosen his path and rationalized it. I've met (and grew up with) far too many of his ilk to expect him to suddenly smack his forehead and exclaim, "The scales have fallen from my eyes!" It's about as likely as the possibility of me winning the lottery. 777 has indicated that he likes Gene. Whether they are friends, relatives, business associates...or perhaps even one and the same person...it says something less than flattering about 777's character and personality.
As for the question of voting this odious creature off the island, I'd have to say that the proposal--though tempting in this case--isn't a good idea. That sort of government is dangerous in the long run.
I must say that for someone who bills himself as a "DIY master" in his profile, I've seen precious little to back up the claim.
Grey
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