Hello, about one month ago I started my diy esl project and a few days ago I finished my first esl. It sounds better than expected, louder than expected too compared to my first attempt about 12 years ago. I will finish the second speaker in about 1 day. I am very curious how it wil sound in stereo.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
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Hi, I fixed the broken(?) image link.
How they sound: as expected lower range (< 500 Hz) has lower output due to dipole radiation. But they go much lower compared to my first ESL DIY project. I hoped to cross over at around 700 Hz, but I would guess this can be lowered to about 300 - 400 Hz. Im very happy with that beacause I don't like to cross over in mid range frequency range.
I find it difficult to tell how higher range frequencies are. There could be some problems as I use a 1:150 step up transformer. I wil do measurements soon.
I got a pair of Final 0.3 commercial ESLs from a family member and when I disconnect the woofer of the Final and compare the ESL elements, my DIY ESL sounds better. (more open) If I combine the Final woofer together with my ESL, this combination sounds much better than the original Final. I still have the impression that the Final woofer is not of very high audio quality. The combination (Final ESL + Final woofer) sounds a bit dull. Not sure if the original product sounded like this: the membrane has been replaced a few years ago and after that the ESL hasn't been used.
If I compare the Final to my ESL without Final woofer, the low frequencies sound much better (cleaner) compared to the Final woofer. But just less volume. So its both better and worse...
How they sound: as expected lower range (< 500 Hz) has lower output due to dipole radiation. But they go much lower compared to my first ESL DIY project. I hoped to cross over at around 700 Hz, but I would guess this can be lowered to about 300 - 400 Hz. Im very happy with that beacause I don't like to cross over in mid range frequency range.
I find it difficult to tell how higher range frequencies are. There could be some problems as I use a 1:150 step up transformer. I wil do measurements soon.
I got a pair of Final 0.3 commercial ESLs from a family member and when I disconnect the woofer of the Final and compare the ESL elements, my DIY ESL sounds better. (more open) If I combine the Final woofer together with my ESL, this combination sounds much better than the original Final. I still have the impression that the Final woofer is not of very high audio quality. The combination (Final ESL + Final woofer) sounds a bit dull. Not sure if the original product sounded like this: the membrane has been replaced a few years ago and after that the ESL hasn't been used.
If I compare the Final to my ESL without Final woofer, the low frequencies sound much better (cleaner) compared to the Final woofer. But just less volume. So its both better and worse...
You are welcome. Although I got some problems with 1 channel of my amp that doesn't seem to enjoy the ESL load very much, I was able to listen both ESLs in stereo: it sounded very nice, although I have to admit I have not much experience in high-end audio. But at least I enjoyed it! I got some problems with bias voltage too so I have to fix those problems first, but it seems that those ESLs are much better than expected. (I'm always sceptic...)
I'm not sure if the Finals are working OK; I never heared a new pair. They sound dull in my opinion.
I will publish some measurements of both the Final and my own ESL soon; I already did some test measurement with a simple mic and pc soundcard but I don't know how reliable that is. The DIY ESL measurement shows a resonance peak at 50 Hz; another small peak at 20 kHz. SPL gradually raises after 50 Hz resonance up to 2 kHz; after 8 kHz it gradually drops again, followed by the peak at 20 kHz. But even though it seems far from a flat frequency response, I would think they sound "relaxed", not agressive like my first ESL DIY attempt. (I used a different transformer)
The Final has a similar response with woofer resonance at about 60 Hz; another peak at around 15 Khz. It shows a dip in between 50 - 500 Hz.
I bought a MCE-2000 electret mic and I just calibrated my soundcard; I hope to be able to do some more reliable? measurements soon.
Thanks!
Yesterday I did some frequency measurements. I used a MCE-2000 mic connected to my (callibrated) pc soundcard and I used Holmimpulse software to create a frequency response. I put the mic 200 cm in front of the ESL, vertically in the middle. I measured in my living room. I smoothed the response a bit.
I'm not sure if this response is reliable. One thing I don't understand is I don't see a clear dipole phase cancellation rolloff starting at around lambda/2 = 430 Hz. (-6 db/oct) I've seen different formulas to calculate at what frequency it should start to rolloff but I don't see a clear rolloff at all. The smallest dimension of my ESL is 40 cm (16 inch). But I do hear a thin bass response, typical for ESL loudspeakers. It it much better compared to my first ESL DIY attempt, but it still sounds weak. I expected to see this in the measurement but I don't see it. Any ideas?
Yesterday I did some frequency measurements. I used a MCE-2000 mic connected to my (callibrated) pc soundcard and I used Holmimpulse software to create a frequency response. I put the mic 200 cm in front of the ESL, vertically in the middle. I measured in my living room. I smoothed the response a bit.
I'm not sure if this response is reliable. One thing I don't understand is I don't see a clear dipole phase cancellation rolloff starting at around lambda/2 = 430 Hz. (-6 db/oct) I've seen different formulas to calculate at what frequency it should start to rolloff but I don't see a clear rolloff at all. The smallest dimension of my ESL is 40 cm (16 inch). But I do hear a thin bass response, typical for ESL loudspeakers. It it much better compared to my first ESL DIY attempt, but it still sounds weak. I expected to see this in the measurement but I don't see it. Any ideas?
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
I bought a new calibrated microphone, MiniDSP UMIK-1, for (hopefully) more reliable measurements. I used it with REW software. I measured in-room from listening position (about 3m distance from esl). I used an equalizer to flatten the frequency responce.
One thing I don't understand is bass response: the lower frequencies sound tight but "thin". I really like the quality, but compared to the average electrodynamic loudspeaker it sounds thin. When looking at the measurement, I don't see this lower output in LF range (I applied 1/12 octave smoothing). Resonance frequency is at 50 Hz, un-dampened. (still experminenting with mechanical dampening)
So my question is, why are my loudspeakers sounding thin despite this frequency response suggesting LF output till Fres @ 50 Hz?
Regards, J.
One thing I don't understand is bass response: the lower frequencies sound tight but "thin". I really like the quality, but compared to the average electrodynamic loudspeaker it sounds thin. When looking at the measurement, I don't see this lower output in LF range (I applied 1/12 octave smoothing). Resonance frequency is at 50 Hz, un-dampened. (still experminenting with mechanical dampening)
So my question is, why are my loudspeakers sounding thin despite this frequency response suggesting LF output till Fres @ 50 Hz?
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
Regards, J.
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If you use more smoothing (say 1 octave) you will see your bass roll off better, starting in the 150hz-300 hz range.
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