No worries.
Suggestion: knock together a single Short Thor / whatever cabinet, leave it unfinished, and swap over the drivers, XO et al temporarily to that one & compare. If happy, then go ahead & finish the box & make another one. That way, you'll still have a pair of speakers for listening to during the build process.
Suggestion: knock together a single Short Thor / whatever cabinet, leave it unfinished, and swap over the drivers, XO et al temporarily to that one & compare. If happy, then go ahead & finish the box & make another one. That way, you'll still have a pair of speakers for listening to during the build process.
Hi all,
I got the new XOs in over the weekend, the baffle step comp. by itself makes them much fuller sounding but I would recommend you completely stuff the back half and experiment with the port size. I have it half closed off and it seems to smooth the bumps out quite a bit, Scott will have to tell us what is actually going on.
I have been messing with the BBC dip with Jim's supervision, trying different values in looking for the Holy Grail. The Millenium tweets I have might be quite different than the newer runs as mine are around 4yrs old. They are extremely sensitive in the 2k to 5k range and we are working on the harmonic balance. They have a tendency to get harsh and sibilent very easily.
The good news is, the imaging now is better than it was, and the size and depth of the musical picture is astounding.
Thanks to Jim these speakers are going to end up world class.
I'll get back in a couple days for another post.
Bill
I got the new XOs in over the weekend, the baffle step comp. by itself makes them much fuller sounding but I would recommend you completely stuff the back half and experiment with the port size. I have it half closed off and it seems to smooth the bumps out quite a bit, Scott will have to tell us what is actually going on.
I have been messing with the BBC dip with Jim's supervision, trying different values in looking for the Holy Grail. The Millenium tweets I have might be quite different than the newer runs as mine are around 4yrs old. They are extremely sensitive in the 2k to 5k range and we are working on the harmonic balance. They have a tendency to get harsh and sibilent very easily.
The good news is, the imaging now is better than it was, and the size and depth of the musical picture is astounding.
Thanks to Jim these speakers are going to end up world class.
I'll get back in a couple days for another post.
Bill
Two Birds with one stone
1) Cutting pipes square:
If a cutoff saw (chop saw or radial arm) is not available, and all you have is a hacksaw, then use a piece of 2" masking tape to mark the edge of your cut. 2" tape is important rather than 3/4" because 2" wont stretch as easy and will help you allign a "square" mark on the pipe. Cut only about a 1" section of pipe at a time, just barely cutting into the hollow center. Turn the pipe away from you so you can still see the cut you just made. It helps you allign the blade. Again only cut about 1" long, then rotate the pipe again. When completed, hold the pipe verticle on sandpaper taped to the workbench and slide it back and forth a few times. Easy as Pie.
2) Length of port:
The shorter the port length, the lower the tuning of the cabinet. My ports were cut to 4 1/8" + 3/4" MDF Baffle with 3/8" roundover at the port for a total of 4 7/8".
Hope this helps,
Ron
KarlXII said:
Originally posted by Byrd
Cutting the ports. I hate hacksaws, never get the cut straight
Byrd,
how did it go with the ports?
Did you try different lengths?
What was the result?
Are you done now btw?
1) Cutting pipes square:
If a cutoff saw (chop saw or radial arm) is not available, and all you have is a hacksaw, then use a piece of 2" masking tape to mark the edge of your cut. 2" tape is important rather than 3/4" because 2" wont stretch as easy and will help you allign a "square" mark on the pipe. Cut only about a 1" section of pipe at a time, just barely cutting into the hollow center. Turn the pipe away from you so you can still see the cut you just made. It helps you allign the blade. Again only cut about 1" long, then rotate the pipe again. When completed, hold the pipe verticle on sandpaper taped to the workbench and slide it back and forth a few times. Easy as Pie.
2) Length of port:
The shorter the port length, the lower the tuning of the cabinet. My ports were cut to 4 1/8" + 3/4" MDF Baffle with 3/8" roundover at the port for a total of 4 7/8".
Hope this helps,
Ron
Hey guys.
Thanks for the interest.
I used the cutting methid shown in the picture in
this post. Essentialy done on a router table with a stop against which the other side of the tube can run.
Still not finished. Busy with polishing and a few other bits of finishing. Attached is where I am at at the moment. A bit busy with work @ the moment, so only going to be able to finish them in a few weeks.
Hope you'all have great weekends.
Thanks for the interest.
I used the cutting methid shown in the picture in
this post. Essentialy done on a router table with a stop against which the other side of the tube can run.
Still not finished. Busy with polishing and a few other bits of finishing. Attached is where I am at at the moment. A bit busy with work @ the moment, so only going to be able to finish them in a few weeks.
Hope you'all have great weekends.
Attachments
Hi all,
I have been playing around with some RTA software, not completely competant with it yet, but it clearly shows the rolloff of the original cabs and the BBC dip in the new XO. My environment is a little noisy, you have to disregard some of the small peaks. This is 1/12 octave averaged but not smoothed. I think I'll be at this for a few days yet.
Bill
I have been playing around with some RTA software, not completely competant with it yet, but it clearly shows the rolloff of the original cabs and the BBC dip in the new XO. My environment is a little noisy, you have to disregard some of the small peaks. This is 1/12 octave averaged but not smoothed. I think I'll be at this for a few days yet.
Bill
High Karl
Thanks, yes, running the original XO. I am very happy with the sound of the speakers as they are. I can possibly understand why some may not like the level of brightness the Thor's are voiced with, especially if they had the previous cabinets.
They are typical Scandanavian speakers, which some (including Dave I am sure
), would describe as clinical & sterile.
I enjoy the sound because good recordings sound brilliant and bad recordings are outed for what they are. Usually people associate good recordings with classical & Jazz etc, however I have found a number of newer "pop" albums mixed pretty well. Jason Mraz for example or the Black Eyed Peas - Elefunk. OK, OK I know - I am not right up to the latest with my listening tastes These sound mellow and mild in my system
Put in something like this Leona Lewis album (if you can call it that) and the system is transformed into a screaming banshee. This is the approach to music that I take though. Others take an approach of wanting to make everything sound good, but then, for me, those special recordings don't shine like they could. Just my opnion and nothing wrong with either approach.
Maybe we should have both crossovers installed and a switch to switch between the two depending on the mix being listened to
I will be trying the new crossovers or active at some stage in the future. Too much work ATM though, so likely that will be a project for next Christmas.
Thanks, yes, running the original XO. I am very happy with the sound of the speakers as they are. I can possibly understand why some may not like the level of brightness the Thor's are voiced with, especially if they had the previous cabinets.
They are typical Scandanavian speakers, which some (including Dave I am sure
), would describe as clinical & sterile. I enjoy the sound because good recordings sound brilliant and bad recordings are outed for what they are. Usually people associate good recordings with classical & Jazz etc, however I have found a number of newer "pop" albums mixed pretty well. Jason Mraz for example or the Black Eyed Peas - Elefunk. OK, OK I know - I am not right up to the latest with my listening tastes
These sound mellow and mild in my systemPut in something like this Leona Lewis album (if you can call it that) and the system is transformed into a screaming banshee. This is the approach to music that I take though. Others take an approach of wanting to make everything sound good, but then, for me, those special recordings don't shine like they could. Just my opnion and nothing wrong with either approach.
Maybe we should have both crossovers installed and a switch to switch between the two depending on the mix being listened to
I will be trying the new crossovers or active at some stage in the future. Too much work ATM though, so likely that will be a project for next Christmas.
Hi all, I'm quite new to this forum and registered maily because of my interrest in the "Small Thor".
I have a little question regarding the Thors in general though. Its most probably already been raised and anwered, but going through 700 post is not an easy excercise, so maybe I've missed it.
Personally I feel that 2500Hz x-over is a bit on the high side for a MTM arangement, since the wavelenghts becomes very short and the chances of phase "distortion", if I may call it that, is quite high if the tweeter is not exactly at ear hight.
I've seen the talks of an alternative x-over, but didn't see any mentioning of the x-over frequency on it. Maybe I just missed it.
I couldn't help wandering wheather the use of a waveguide, like Zaph is using in one of his projects on the web, with a x-over frequency at around 1.5 to 1.7Khz wouldn't be a better option?
I have a little question regarding the Thors in general though. Its most probably already been raised and anwered, but going through 700 post is not an easy excercise, so maybe I've missed it.
Personally I feel that 2500Hz x-over is a bit on the high side for a MTM arangement, since the wavelenghts becomes very short and the chances of phase "distortion", if I may call it that, is quite high if the tweeter is not exactly at ear hight.
I've seen the talks of an alternative x-over, but didn't see any mentioning of the x-over frequency on it. Maybe I just missed it.
I couldn't help wandering wheather the use of a waveguide, like Zaph is using in one of his projects on the web, with a x-over frequency at around 1.5 to 1.7Khz wouldn't be a better option?
I've aquired a M-Audio Mobilepre USB soundcard and a Behringer ECM8000 microphone just to do some measurements on the SmallThor.
I really and truly suck om measurements since these are my first but hey, just tell me what I'm doing wrong and I'lll try to correct it til next time.
The setup was a PC with Svante´s Tombstone and the stuff above. All settings default.
I did the tests outside to not get the room into the picture.
This is from the front appx three feet away:
This is one feet away from the tweeter.
Too bad it was clipping all the way. ;
And finally, just a hair outside the bassport in the rear:
I really and truly suck om measurements since these are my first but hey, just tell me what I'm doing wrong and I'lll try to correct it til next time.
The setup was a PC with Svante´s Tombstone and the stuff above. All settings default.
I did the tests outside to not get the room into the picture.
This is from the front appx three feet away:
This is one feet away from the tweeter.
Too bad it was clipping all the way. ;
And finally, just a hair outside the bassport in the rear:
Just did a new measurement. Svante, the author of the test software (and phon of faktiskt.se) hinted that I could measure the port and the elements combined if i put the microphone inside the speaker. That and a 12db/hz tilt would make it fairly accurate to appx 100 hz. Said and done.
This is how the SmallThor rolls off in the low bass.
This is how the SmallThor rolls off in the low bass.
Congratulations Karl!
Those are unbelieved frecuency responses!
There are a lot and good DIY loudspeakers systems but yours are in the very special side.
Maybe some one who knows better the software can tell us if something is wrong over there. Its there a 1/24 octave resolution?
In the other side, in the subjetive side. How do you describe the sound scenario?
The performance of the speaker makes a wide and deep soundstage?
Those are unbelieved frecuency responses!
There are a lot and good DIY loudspeakers systems but yours are in the very special side.
Maybe some one who knows better the software can tell us if something is wrong over there. Its there a 1/24 octave resolution?
In the other side, in the subjetive side. How do you describe the sound scenario?
The performance of the speaker makes a wide and deep soundstage?