I am searching for schematics or any information for a G&S Designs C4000.
It powers on but no sound.
I had it pushing 1- Kicker 18" cvr at 8ohms bridged in my daily driver with no problem for years.
I installed it in my project cruiser car that I am working on, I had it running 1 Kicker 18"comp vr dual 4 at 2 ohms and it played extremely well for about 2 weeks then a resistor inside burned beyond recognition and it stopped producing sound but the led is on and the fan is on but no sound. I want to repair the amplifier, so any information given on it would be greatly appreciated. I have installed audio since I was a youth but I am very green on amplifier repair. My only experiences with repairing amps were easy fixes such as broken terminals and visually burned parts, but I would like to learn and there is no time like the present to start. Thanks
It powers on but no sound.
I had it pushing 1- Kicker 18" cvr at 8ohms bridged in my daily driver with no problem for years.
I installed it in my project cruiser car that I am working on, I had it running 1 Kicker 18"comp vr dual 4 at 2 ohms and it played extremely well for about 2 weeks then a resistor inside burned beyond recognition and it stopped producing sound but the led is on and the fan is on but no sound. I want to repair the amplifier, so any information given on it would be greatly appreciated. I have installed audio since I was a youth but I am very green on amplifier repair. My only experiences with repairing amps were easy fixes such as broken terminals and visually burned parts, but I would like to learn and there is no time like the present to start. Thanks
If no one else can help, email me a few photos of the inside of the amp so I can see what you have.
babin_perry@yahoo.com
babin_perry@yahoo.com
On the BUZ71A FETs, what is the DC voltage on the three legs of the transistors. They should be all the same so you should only need to post one set of 3 voltages.
Pin 1:
Pin 2:
Pin 3:
Insert a 10 amp fuse in the B+ line to protect the FETs. I'd suggest that you clamp all transistors tightly to the heatsink before you apply power.
Pin 1:
Pin 2:
Pin 3:
Insert a 10 amp fuse in the B+ line to protect the FETs. I'd suggest that you clamp all transistors tightly to the heatsink before you apply power.
Re: Re: Amplifier Repair help needed for a G&S Designs C4000
I feel truly honored to have his assistance. I found this forum by searching for info in the G&S C4000 but I had no idea that Perry Babin was an active member here. A couple of years ago I ordered his cd and I was very impressed the way the he explained everything.
I bought the amp from an online estate sale really cheap.
When I installed it on in the 18" Kicker 8 @ohms it really impressed and it did not even heat up.
I felt that the 8ohm Kicker did not let the amp reach its full potential.
I had 2 18"s powered by 1 Us Acoustics USX-2150 bridged @2ohm each in my cruiser.
One amp went out then I had an opportunity to see what the could G&S Design C4000@2ohm could really do and I notice huge difference. about 2 weeks later the other USX2150 shut down I had just ordered a Phoenix Gold xs2500 to see if I could repair and use lucky for me that was supposed to be broken but the fuses were just melted in the socket it just looked bad but you can't even tell that it ever had a problem. When I installed the xs2500 on the other 18" bridged @2ohms my car really ROCKED!!! I could not believe how great the bass response was. The C4000 performed flawlessly and never ran hot nor went into protection for 2 months then one day a drove the car to work it played fine on the way to work and when I drove home turned the radio on and noticed that the bass was not as loud as when I parked. When I got home I found that the C4000 was on but it was not putting out any power.
So I replaced it with a Hifonics Atlantis X American Warrior 1ohm stable which has been playing for four months @2ohms but it is not as Powerful as the G&S Designs C4000.
I am going to put one Hifonics Atlantis X (Ihave two) on 1 voice coil and 1 Atlantis X more on the other voice coil until I get this C4000 fixed.
I could not find much information on the C4000 the only thing that I could find was for a C1000 at ampguts.com :
C1000
Competition Line
2 x 50W @ 4 ohms
2 x 100W @ 2 ohms
2 x 200W @ 4 ohms bridged
Fuse: External 25A
So I am thinking that the C4000 is
C4000
Competition Line
2 x 200W @ 4 ohms
2 x 400W @ 2 ohms
1 x 800W @ 4 ohms bridged
Fuse: External 100A
tsmith1315 said:
I feel truly honored to have his assistance. I found this forum by searching for info in the G&S C4000 but I had no idea that Perry Babin was an active member here. A couple of years ago I ordered his cd and I was very impressed the way the he explained everything.
I bought the amp from an online estate sale really cheap.
When I installed it on in the 18" Kicker 8 @ohms it really impressed and it did not even heat up.
I felt that the 8ohm Kicker did not let the amp reach its full potential.
I had 2 18"s powered by 1 Us Acoustics USX-2150 bridged @2ohm each in my cruiser.
One amp went out then I had an opportunity to see what the could G&S Design C4000@2ohm could really do and I notice huge difference. about 2 weeks later the other USX2150 shut down I had just ordered a Phoenix Gold xs2500 to see if I could repair and use lucky for me that was supposed to be broken but the fuses were just melted in the socket it just looked bad but you can't even tell that it ever had a problem. When I installed the xs2500 on the other 18" bridged @2ohms my car really ROCKED!!! I could not believe how great the bass response was. The C4000 performed flawlessly and never ran hot nor went into protection for 2 months then one day a drove the car to work it played fine on the way to work and when I drove home turned the radio on and noticed that the bass was not as loud as when I parked. When I got home I found that the C4000 was on but it was not putting out any power.
So I replaced it with a Hifonics Atlantis X American Warrior 1ohm stable which has been playing for four months @2ohms but it is not as Powerful as the G&S Designs C4000.
I am going to put one Hifonics Atlantis X (Ihave two) on 1 voice coil and 1 Atlantis X more on the other voice coil until I get this C4000 fixed.
I could not find much information on the C4000 the only thing that I could find was for a C1000 at ampguts.com :
C1000
Competition Line
2 x 50W @ 4 ohms
2 x 100W @ 2 ohms
2 x 200W @ 4 ohms bridged
Fuse: External 25A
So I am thinking that the C4000 is
C4000
Competition Line
2 x 200W @ 4 ohms
2 x 400W @ 2 ohms
1 x 800W @ 4 ohms bridged
Fuse: External 100A
Perry's very generous with assistance. He'll get my vote for the forum's Most Valuable Poster anytime someone wants to take a poll.
Be careful. Chances are, the low impedance load is what caused the problem.
I'm not familiar with this generation of G&S, but slightly earlier ones were private label PPI amps and not rated for less than 2 ohms stereo/4 ohms bridged. Given the spec's you quoted, it doesn't look like the C-series are stable at 2 ohms mono.
I'll look around to see if i have any spec's on this model.
BIG4REST said:
When I powered the amp up, the power draw seems to fluctuate. The measurements were taken on pins 1 & 2 with the DMM on DCV (set to 20) and on pin 3 were taken on DCV (set to 2000 m). The 1 pins on all seem to fluctuate between about 1.71 to 000, 2 pins from about 13 to 9.73 and 3 pins form about 012 to 000.
Left side
Highest to Lowest
1.71 to 000
13.43 to 9.75
011 to 000
1.71 000
13.44 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.48 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.49 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.44 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.48 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.44 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.48 9.75
011 000
right side
1.71 000
13.44 9.78
013 000
1.71 000
13.53 9.75
011 000
1.71 000
13.44 9.65
012 000
1.71 000
13.48 9.45
012 000
1.71 000
13.52 9.71
013 000
1.71 000
13.51 9.51
013 000
1.71 000
13.56 9.71
013 000
1.71 000
13.56 9.42
013 000
It sounds like the amp is repeatedly going into protection or the power supply can't produce enough current. What are you using as a DC power supply?
Have you checked all of the output transistors to confirm that none are shorted?
With your meter set to DC volts and the black probe on one of the non-bridging speaker terminals, do you see any DC on either channel when the amp tries to power up?
When you replaced the resistor, how did you know the correct value?
Have you checked all of the output transistors to confirm that none are shorted?
With your meter set to DC volts and the black probe on one of the non-bridging speaker terminals, do you see any DC on either channel when the amp tries to power up?
When you replaced the resistor, how did you know the correct value?
Perry Babin said:
It sounds like the amp is repeatedly going into protection or the power supply can't produce enough current.
----What are you using as a DC power supply?
TRIP LITE Model PR-10b Precision Regulated DC Power Supply
Output: 13.8V DC 10 AMP
Fully Regulated Low Ripple
Electric Overload Protection With
Instant Automatic Reset
-----Have you checked all of the output transistors to confirm that none are shorted?
No, I did not check because I'm not sure how to? But I am egaer to learn!
------With your meter set to DC volts and the black probe on one of the non-bridging speaker terminals, do you see any DC on either channel when the amp tries to power up?
3.50v to -1.10
------When you replaced the resistor, how did you know the correct value?
I don't know the correct value. I was hoping that I could find a formula or schematic to find out, but I have not had any luck so far. I figured that the original resistor was burnt so bad that it the original properties may have been altered. I had my nephew to take it to the local Electronic Parts Outlet to see if the local expert could figure it out, he told my nephew that it was reading 100 ohms and he could not be sure if the properties changed. So I just picked a larger wattage resistor in replacement of the burned one to see if it would produce sound but just I figured it did not work.
Thanks
tsmith1315 said:
Thanks for your help!
Now that I think about it, I had a Failed Alternator and Failed Battery due to a the Alternator's Bad Wiring Harness. The previous owner had a new alternator put on the car. The original alternators on some Lincolns including this one were hard wired in, so the replacement has to come with the harness or an adapter has to be spliced in. After replacing the alternator and a battery going through the systems wiring and I replace the both battery cables I added another ground and I was still having trouble I added a 3 farad capacitor. I was the checking the charging system I just happened to take the battery back to get checked and looking at the alt connection it was perfect but when I peeled back the perfect looking wiring harness loom and I noticed a terrible hack job of a splice. It loosely taped corroded and melted. I correctly replaced the wires with 4 gauge and I have not had one problem with any amp or battery are anything. but upon turning the radio back on I noticed little lower out put like only woofer was playing and there kind of a was thumping distortion narrowed it down to this little line driver thing that I bought on the internet. It is a Turbo 1 RCA Line Driver by PAC the left side put out nothing but a thumping distortion. I took it out of the system and the sound was clean again. So I think it could have played a role in the amp failures. Since I got rid of the bad line driver, the bad wiring harness and battery has been replaced I have not had a problem at all.
The problem that I have now is that I have 4 broken amps (that come power on but produce no sound). Lucky I never got rid of any of my old amplifiers (except my a couple of Coustic Power Logics).
I was thinking the same thing about the amp being driven at 2ohms, so when I first installed it I would play it little at a time and bit more every day for the first week then it played perfect and the C4000 it did even get as warm as the sx2500 and never cut off.
The amplifier C4000 was played at 2ohm bridged 45 minutes day for about 2 months (without being driven into distortion). One day during my 20 minute drive to work the amp played great but on my way home the amp did not produce any power after sitting at work 8 hours. It previous played fine during the 20 minutes drive to work.
Is the failure due to the stress of being driven into 2 ohms bridged when it is not stated to be 2ohm bridge stable? I would love really to know, because I sounded Great pushing the kicker @ 2 ohms bridged I just could not believe the Sound and the Feel.
The output transistors are the TIP35C and TIP36C.
With your meter set to ohms, you should not read anything near 0 ohms when the probes are touched to the terminals of any individual transistor. If they're shorted (~0 ohms), they're likely shorted from leg 2 to leg 3 but you should check 1-2, 1-3 and 2-3. Check all of the output transistors individually. If it appears that several are shorted, you'll need to remove that group of transistors from the board and check them individually. If you find only 1 shorted, you can reinstall the rest to see if the amp will power up. If it does, you need to replace all in that group.
For the resistor, the amp is likely symmetrical and will have at least one other resistor connected in a circuit similar to the one that failed. If you can find that resistor in the other channel or on the other side of the board, you can determine the value of the original part. Look for resistors with color codes and size as those around the failed resistor.
Running an amp below it's lowest rated impedance can certainly cause it to fail prematurely.
With your meter set to ohms, you should not read anything near 0 ohms when the probes are touched to the terminals of any individual transistor. If they're shorted (~0 ohms), they're likely shorted from leg 2 to leg 3 but you should check 1-2, 1-3 and 2-3. Check all of the output transistors individually. If it appears that several are shorted, you'll need to remove that group of transistors from the board and check them individually. If you find only 1 shorted, you can reinstall the rest to see if the amp will power up. If it does, you need to replace all in that group.
For the resistor, the amp is likely symmetrical and will have at least one other resistor connected in a circuit similar to the one that failed. If you can find that resistor in the other channel or on the other side of the board, you can determine the value of the original part. Look for resistors with color codes and size as those around the failed resistor.
Running an amp below it's lowest rated impedance can certainly cause it to fail prematurely.
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