Knowing some of you were there before me
: looking for some pointers in treating Alpha 15 for open baffle duty (MJK-style, crossed 2nd order at 100-150hz).
- Pre-treatment with ModPodge (how many coats, reverse side also?)
- Enabl patterns (pics most welcome as for placement of eventual mid rings!!!)
- MicroGloss (how many coats?)
- Dustcap treatment?
FWIW frame damping with ductseal on the outside of legs + around magnet // inner frame surfaces lined with acoustic foam (hoping it won’t rob too much off the backwave)
Muchas gracias!!
: looking for some pointers in treating Alpha 15 for open baffle duty (MJK-style, crossed 2nd order at 100-150hz).- Pre-treatment with ModPodge (how many coats, reverse side also?)
- Enabl patterns (pics most welcome as for placement of eventual mid rings!!!)
- MicroGloss (how many coats?)
- Dustcap treatment?
FWIW frame damping with ductseal on the outside of legs + around magnet // inner frame surfaces lined with acoustic foam (hoping it won’t rob too much off the backwave)
Muchas gracias!!
Hmmmmm...
While there are reports of eNabl really helping a driver, I can't see it being of any benefit for a bass driver: it's operating in its pistonic region, so cone break-up etc is a non-issue.
Frame damping would be a good idea, as would breaking up reflections through the cone from the basket.
If you want to measure your progress, put a LF square wave through the speaker, add a low-cut, so you only get clicks.
Put a mic near the cone, watch on an oscilloscope for reflections: using s=d/t, you can figure out roughly which surface leads to which reflection, then add damping accordingly.
I've seen this work very well for a pair of wide-band 12" drivers.
Chris
While there are reports of eNabl really helping a driver, I can't see it being of any benefit for a bass driver: it's operating in its pistonic region, so cone break-up etc is a non-issue.
Frame damping would be a good idea, as would breaking up reflections through the cone from the basket.
If you want to measure your progress, put a LF square wave through the speaker, add a low-cut, so you only get clicks.
Put a mic near the cone, watch on an oscilloscope for reflections: using s=d/t, you can figure out roughly which surface leads to which reflection, then add damping accordingly.
I've seen this work very well for a pair of wide-band 12" drivers.
Chris
Hi,
None of what you suggest will make any difference in the range
suggested other than the effect of adding some cone mass,
and there are lots of ways of doing that.
An electrical trap filter to suppress the +10dB peak at 2KHz
is a start point if you want change the driver behaviour.
rgds ,sreten.
None of what you suggest will make any difference in the range
suggested other than the effect of adding some cone mass,
and there are lots of ways of doing that.
An electrical trap filter to suppress the +10dB peak at 2KHz
is a start point if you want change the driver behaviour.
rgds ,sreten.
Thanks, but the straigthforward way for me would be to get a testimony of how other people (found a quote by Dave saying Chris would do this on some alphas) proceeded; also found several testimonies of the usual suspects quoting great results of coating/enabl on woofers... No measuring equipment nor time to reinvent the wheel, looking more for a manual by people who already did the experimenting work on these particular drivers. I think quite a number of forum members might benefit equally from such info as these are about the 'generic' OB woofers.
Best,
Simon
Hi.
If you want to believe in UnABL(e) thats up to you, I don't care.
Pretty dots will do absolutely nothing other than looking like they do.
The UnABL(e) subjective thread is full of fundamentally impossible
"testimonials" as to its effects and a wise man is always sensible.
If you want to think any of the UnABL(e) claims in the subjective
thread are true, consider why that thread exists in the first place.
rgds, sreten.
None of the mods you suggest will change a driver x/o
at 100Hz to 150Hz much, the mods seem pointless.
If you want to believe in UnABL(e) thats up to you, I don't care.
Pretty dots will do absolutely nothing other than looking like they do.
The UnABL(e) subjective thread is full of fundamentally impossible
"testimonials" as to its effects and a wise man is always sensible.
If you want to think any of the UnABL(e) claims in the subjective
thread are true, consider why that thread exists in the first place.
rgds, sreten.
None of the mods you suggest will change a driver x/o
at 100Hz to 150Hz much, the mods seem pointless.
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Much appreciated! Hopefully others will follow your wise example and let this thread evolve in a constructive manner.
Simon
Hi,
I can live with sarcasm. Fair enough you want to think EnABling
a bass driver is a good idea along with modge podging it etc...
Added mass changes it the most and probably the best stuff
for this is bitumastic car body underseal / antichip spray can.
But who cares about that, that is not being constructive ....
What you want to do is construct is a faith / belief paradigm.
In other words evolving nonsense. Your welcome to it.
rgds, sreten.
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Someone told me enable is made from a mixture of toothpaste... Could that be true?
The benefits of enabling a driver could be weighed against purchasing a better driver.
I have the Alpha 15 and a Jamo close out from PE whose specs and sims less suit OB yet it sounds more musically satisfying to me. Having said that, the Alpha 15 is excellent in H-frames as is.
For bass duty, the amp you choose will have a great impact on the sound of the Alpha. I'd consider this before enable.
This is DIY and we can do whatever we choose, but I would not enable an Alpha 15.
The benefits of enabling a driver could be weighed against purchasing a better driver.
I have the Alpha 15 and a Jamo close out from PE whose specs and sims less suit OB yet it sounds more musically satisfying to me. Having said that, the Alpha 15 is excellent in H-frames as is.
For bass duty, the amp you choose will have a great impact on the sound of the Alpha. I'd consider this before enable.
This is DIY and we can do whatever we choose, but I would not enable an Alpha 15.
Yup, ta3020 based amp into parallelled pair of alphas / channel. Tubes on top (well ofcourse
).Simon
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In that case I would choose the Betas.
And how would you treat those?
Seriously, got a great deal on the alphas, so alphas it will be...Simon
Did some more searching on the forum, here's BudP on the effects of treating a woofer:
"For woofers, the major change is a removal of noise. As an example, a large group of Bass Violas playing any number of fast, loud and intricate musical passages, often are portrayed as variable rumbles with instruments discernible within, but clotted by an overall bass buzz. Treated, the buzz disappears, the instruments are left, and their contribution to the information about the space they are playing in becomes more available. In addition, the room the drivers are playing into ceases to have objectionable levels of bass enhancement or suck out, depending upon what position you happen to be in. All of this will become more noticeable with higher crossover frequencies, but even when used on a sub woofer the effects are quite noticeable."
BudP's procedure seems to be enabl + three coats of MicroGloss on large woofers. Alternative could probably be some layers of ModPodge + enabl + less MicroGloss. Also found Mamboni process as an option for woofers. To be continued...
Simon
"For woofers, the major change is a removal of noise. As an example, a large group of Bass Violas playing any number of fast, loud and intricate musical passages, often are portrayed as variable rumbles with instruments discernible within, but clotted by an overall bass buzz. Treated, the buzz disappears, the instruments are left, and their contribution to the information about the space they are playing in becomes more available. In addition, the room the drivers are playing into ceases to have objectionable levels of bass enhancement or suck out, depending upon what position you happen to be in. All of this will become more noticeable with higher crossover frequencies, but even when used on a sub woofer the effects are quite noticeable."
BudP's procedure seems to be enabl + three coats of MicroGloss on large woofers. Alternative could probably be some layers of ModPodge + enabl + less MicroGloss. Also found Mamboni process as an option for woofers. To be continued...
Simon
One fellow did some testing with toothpaste on his JX92. The official material is high particle flat arylic paint (Polyscale)
I haven't EnABLed my alpha 15s yet, but did put a couple thin coats of mod-podge, with positive benefit. This is something i have been doing for 35-some years with good benefit. Ties together the fibre the paper is made from and lowers the cone self-noise.
I'll let you know how i like them once EnABLed (don't hold your breath, i'm not much into OBs and these get minimal use)
dave
Thanks, this seems to be the main benefit in treating woofers and makes sense. Any take on ModPodge versus MicroGloss for this duty?
Would you happen to have an 'Enabl 2' pattern for these? Would the generic pattern for woofers be the same two-ring pattern of 'Enabl 1'? Gathered much info about the tap test, but still taking my first taps there (hahaa). While I'm not sure enabl will do anything on woofers, it won't hurt either and I'm willing to experiment. Even some of my new - although somewhat fatiguing - friends on this forum agree it looks pretty
Simon
I would use mod-podge 1st.
I have no patterns here... i always take the generic rings and scale them to where the tap test says i should put a ring-set. My collection of templates is huge... and often a templat efor one is the template for another (ie FE126 outer pattern is also the FE206 whizzer pattern...
dave
I have no patterns here... i always take the generic rings and scale them to where the tap test says i should put a ring-set. My collection of templates is huge... and often a templat efor one is the template for another (ie FE126 outer pattern is also the FE206 whizzer pattern...
dave
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