with the "Heritage" line, PWK squeezed a lot of performance (profit?) from a cheap 15 with a 54 ounce magnet. If a more powerful motor/lower qes motor had been used with 1/3 of K33's xmax then bass below horn cutoff would have been sacrificed and balance leaner. The same balancing network with a 2.5mH inductor and autoformer was used in Heresy, Cornwall, LS/Belle and K-horn with just cap and autoformer tap changes.
Great Plains 15/16" woofers should be good for new builds - not sure about their use in Klipsch Heritage cabinets.
A midbass horn with high Lf cutoff can sound "hollow".
Time delays between horns might not help matters. Moving the tweeter back into the midhorn's driver plane might improve focus.
The Classic is large, but might (?) be one of the best things to do with putting that woofer to use.
My K-horns fire into walls which resonate, making bass sound terrible. The often criticized K400 might be my favorite part of that system
Yep, I was really surprised at the K-33e when my dad finally showed me what came out of that box... I expected either huge, JBL-style cast frames, or alnico or both... Certainly not a $100 Eminence driver...
I mean, there's something to be said for blowing off all the aesthetics and just going with what works, but still...
So it sounds like you're saying if I do build the Deans, even then I should think about forgoing the K-33s and go with something better like the Great Plains'?
Makes sense I guess...
I asked on the Klipsch forum, but is there anything the K-Horn bass bins with the Klipsch drivers do exceptionally well? Any reason at all I should be thinking of recreating the Belle Bass horn?
Thanks for chiming in GM, I've been absorbing your posts for a while now...
All things considered, maybe I should just build some conrscalas and sell them if I can't stand them.
its a mix - re: Altec - I would say those could be nicer in direct radiator application than the vintage Eminence or CTS K33. FWIW I thought a 421 sounded better in the Karlson than my K33E. The old alnico 416 had a certain smooth & mellow character.
In a folded horn, depending upon how its execute, the added upper midrange might rattle around or not matter so much as long as the mid driver or HF horn can work at a reasonably low crossover point.
here's a 1 watt sim of K33E vs Great Plains 515-G (I'm astounded at the low moving mass figure) This is the higher Qts version they make so probably more suited to Belle. With 515-G's Xmax about 1/2 of K33E, the Eminence should beat it when forced on the low end. Perhaps some of the current Eminence would be just about as good as the GP in some folded horns.
I used the stock back chamber volumes for Belle and Classic. Depending upon driver, those could be reduced in size to some advantage other than loosing some low end resonance. With the stock back chamber, Belle at 100 watts input hits 515's Xmax around 70Hz. Reducing Belle's back chamber from 58L to 25L, flattens 515's graph, and allows a full 100 watts without exceeding
Xmax.
you can see between 60 and 90Hz, the much larger Classic's cone excursion is reduced
and the horn doing work in that area. My FH1 which is 6" deeper than the Belle, rolls off outdoors below 110Hz.
you can see also where Belle looses "gain" on its high end due to the flat spot in its expansion - I'm hoping
that will work to my advantage in a baby Belle with 12pe32 as low Q drivers can tilt the response curve upwards.
In a folded horn, depending upon how its execute, the added upper midrange might rattle around or not matter so much as long as the mid driver or HF horn can work at a reasonably low crossover point.
here's a 1 watt sim of K33E vs Great Plains 515-G (I'm astounded at the low moving mass figure) This is the higher Qts version they make so probably more suited to Belle. With 515-G's Xmax about 1/2 of K33E, the Eminence should beat it when forced on the low end. Perhaps some of the current Eminence would be just about as good as the GP in some folded horns.
I used the stock back chamber volumes for Belle and Classic. Depending upon driver, those could be reduced in size to some advantage other than loosing some low end resonance. With the stock back chamber, Belle at 100 watts input hits 515's Xmax around 70Hz. Reducing Belle's back chamber from 58L to 25L, flattens 515's graph, and allows a full 100 watts without exceeding
Xmax.
you can see between 60 and 90Hz, the much larger Classic's cone excursion is reduced
and the horn doing work in that area. My FH1 which is 6" deeper than the Belle, rolls off outdoors below 110Hz.
you can see also where Belle looses "gain" on its high end due to the flat spot in its expansion - I'm hoping
that will work to my advantage in a baby Belle with 12pe32 as low Q drivers can tilt the response curve upwards.
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