The big music stores often run 20% off specials to make margins. I got a 6000dsp for $399 last year over the phone.
The processing on this product is where the value is IMO...
And why on earth would you not put a near silent $10 fan in it? I have a Crown XLS that I use in the studio/workshop but with the fan swap you can have a quiet iNuke that won't thermal on you.
The processing on this product is where the value is IMO...
And why on earth would you not put a near silent $10 fan in it? I have a Crown XLS that I use in the studio/workshop but with the fan swap you can have a quiet iNuke that won't thermal on you.
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That's a little different than I was thinking it looked like Soldermizer, doesn't that scratch the top?
I got my iNuke3000DSP with a 50' Speakon to Speakon, 25' Speakon to 1/4", 20' 1/4" to 1/4", and a 10' Speakon to 1/4". All wires are Hosa, and the price was $399 with $14 shipping. Well worth it, it wasnt used, it was new. Sadly that deal is no longer on ebay. But there is one that includes:
iNuke3000DSP
1x "2U Shallow "X" Rack Case"
2x "Speakon to 1/4" Cables"
It doesn't say how long the wires are, but from the picture they look about 25'. Costs $399 and free shipping
I got my iNuke3000DSP with a 50' Speakon to Speakon, 25' Speakon to 1/4", 20' 1/4" to 1/4", and a 10' Speakon to 1/4". All wires are Hosa, and the price was $399 with $14 shipping. Well worth it, it wasnt used, it was new. Sadly that deal is no longer on ebay. But there is one that includes:
iNuke3000DSP
1x "2U Shallow "X" Rack Case"
2x "Speakon to 1/4" Cables"
It doesn't say how long the wires are, but from the picture they look about 25'. Costs $399 and free shipping
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
5th Element: " Why on earth would you want to remove the output filter in a high power class D amplifier?"
Because I like to experiment, thinking it might improve the sound. One of many of my failed experiments
some are successful (like the fan-ectomy on the NU3000), most probably have no perciptible change, some can be undone (or seemingly!), and some result in an instant "keep for spare parts" object !!!
"Apart from being potentially hazardous to your loudspeakers..."
You would mourn the death of a Bose 901 ????
"... the amplifier would then probably start violating a handful of EMI laws too. Not recommended." If I want to turn my amp into a radio transmitter, that is my perogative But seriously, you are right ... lesson learned the hard way.
Mr. Doom, you did very well if you got a 6000DSP for $400! Good on ya! Since my evil mods do not always work, I may grudingly try a near-quiet fan just for fun. Being a frequent ebay-er, I am somewhat the authority on prices of these and when I first got my NU3000(s) about a year ago, I probably would have gladly paid $500 for a NU6000. Yours must have been radioactive (it IS an "iNuke", after all )or have some other horrible hidden fault, at that good price
Abcdmku, yes a 30 lb (?) concrete block probably will scratch the top, but it's a f*****g* BEHRINGER, for crying out loud!!!
A few scratches on it are not going to drop its value much when I sell it.
*I am not permitted to cuss apparently. You can probably figure out this one! But even w**** was bleeped, even though it is a perfectly good word for "prostitute" or as I intended it, more a client of such provider of services.
Because I like to experiment, thinking it might improve the sound. One of many of my failed experiments
some are successful (like the fan-ectomy on the NU3000), most probably have no perciptible change, some can be undone (or seemingly!), and some result in an instant "keep for spare parts" object !!!
"Apart from being potentially hazardous to your loudspeakers..."
You would mourn the death of a Bose 901 ????
"... the amplifier would then probably start violating a handful of EMI laws too. Not recommended." If I want to turn my amp into a radio transmitter, that is my perogative
But seriously, you are right ... lesson learned the hard way.Mr. Doom, you did very well if you got a 6000DSP for $400! Good on ya! Since my evil mods do not always work, I may grudingly try a near-quiet fan just for fun. Being a frequent ebay-er, I am somewhat the authority on prices of these and when I first got my NU3000(s) about a year ago, I probably would have gladly paid $500 for a NU6000. Yours must have been radioactive (it IS an "iNuke", after all )or have some other horrible hidden fault, at that good price
Abcdmku, yes a 30 lb (?) concrete block probably will scratch the top, but it's a f*****g* BEHRINGER, for crying out loud!!!
A few scratches on it are not going to drop its value much when I sell it.*I am not permitted to cuss apparently. You can probably figure out this one! But even w**** was bleeped, even though it is a perfectly good word for "prostitute" or as I intended it, more a client of such provider of services.
News flash! Additional soldermizing and the NU3000 has been resurrected...at least for now. I could not get a short across the inductor so I remote mounted it (two leads into the PCB). Now reading a short where I should...we have sound on Channel A. Now where to mount the loose inductor?
-- Soldermizer, turning well-designed electronics into breadboard-looking devices since 1972.
-- Soldermizer, turning well-designed electronics into breadboard-looking devices since 1972.
Cats are enjoying outside time right now. Besides, just got home and the masonary needs to warm up
Here is a photo. As you can see, a rodent is subbing for a cat. I doubt the cat would cause over-heat, however, the towel could restrict airflow if draped over the edges. The whole idea of this exercise was to allow the amp's waste heat to heat the concrete paver (approx. 20x20x2 inches).
I was listening to some "trance" music and got a thermal even at not apparently too loud volume. This is not the first time, and not unusual (although it was on the amp that I "experimented upon" and I sometimes worry that my half-assed resoldering is failing.)
I just got an incredibly simple evil idea worthy of the Grinch when he figures out his reindeer substitute
What if I put the fan back in the amp, and had a switch for it? If I need to blast music, I have the fan running. If I need quiet, turn off the fan. Experience has shown that the thermal protection works ok. Best of both worlds?
Seriously, you're going wreak the amps running them without a cooling fan. BAD IDEA. The paver is only inhibiting cooling further vs. just having air naturally circulating above them. Please, please, put a fan in. These are delicate amps that are not built with the intention that their components will be operated for any long period at above 50C or so:
Behringer inuke NU6000 vs KAM KXD7200 bench tested - Speakerplans.com Forums - Page 2
My friends already blew out a nu1000dsp in their rec room by running it in clipping (red lights on solid) for a while on several occasions and had to upgrade to a nu3000dsp. After a long talk with them and a second opinion, they are trying to keep the new one out of the red.
I've had a nu6000dsp for about 3 months now, haven't used it that much but have had it up to about 50% output and it seems to be solid.
Have recently been trying to figure out the real power supply requirements, it is fused for 24A per the manual, is nominally a ~650w draw at 1/8th power, and draws big current spikes per the review linked above. I think what it comes down to is if you were to run some test tones at on both channels at about 2x1200w rms or greater, you would probably blow the fuse in short order, but not trip a typical 15a breaker, due to the trip characteristics of a breaker:
(x-scale is multiples of rated current)
Have recently been trying to figure out the real power supply requirements, it is fused for 24A per the manual, is nominally a ~650w draw at 1/8th power, and draws big current spikes per the review linked above. I think what it comes down to is if you were to run some test tones at on both channels at about 2x1200w rms or greater, you would probably blow the fuse in short order, but not trip a typical 15a breaker, due to the trip characteristics of a breaker:
(x-scale is multiples of rated current)
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
heat rises, s##t floats, coincidence?
Turbodawg: your concern is welcome. However, I willingly took the risk to run fanless. Originally I ran my "mod" with out the top on, with the idea like you, that it would give maximum convection. Later (partly for safety reasons) i put the cover back on. The amp seemed just as happy. Note that air can enter from the front as well as the fan hole in the rear. Warm air does what? It rises, and heats the cover. I see no difference if I have a concrete block on top of amp(s) ... the cool air still enters at the bottom (unobstructed) and still rises. Unless the laws of physics have changed, I see no problem with my "cat warmer." It may shorten the life of components, but my NU3000 has suffered most from my unwise mods beyond just removing the fan.
Turbodawg: your concern is welcome. However, I willingly took the risk to run fanless. Originally I ran my "mod" with out the top on, with the idea like you, that it would give maximum convection. Later (partly for safety reasons) i put the cover back on. The amp seemed just as happy. Note that air can enter from the front as well as the fan hole in the rear. Warm air does what? It rises, and heats the cover. I see no difference if I have a concrete block on top of amp(s) ... the cool air still enters at the bottom (unobstructed) and still rises. Unless the laws of physics have changed, I see no problem with my "cat warmer." It may shorten the life of components, but my NU3000 has suffered most from my unwise mods beyond just removing the fan.
The concrete will act as an insulator, preventing normal air convection outside the unit against the top cover, having a large block on top of the amp will absorb that heat and is much less effective. If you want to put that block to good use, place it on top of your subs.
Have you every taken any courses in thermodynamics or heat transfer, or have any real world training?
The best way to cool this without a fan is tip it on end so there is air flow from bottom to top.
But just so everyone is clear: SOLDERMIZER'S MOD'S ARE A BAD IDEA OR A TROLL.
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Speaking both as an amateur radio operator, and as someone that has designed radio broadcast transmitters and worked extensively with RF engineering and EMI compliance...
DO NOT REMOVE THE OUTPUT FILTER FROM A CLASS D AMPLIFIER. EVER.
Class D amps have fast edge rates coming out of their output stage - the frequency content of these signals have harmonics that go well up past 10MHz. Now feed them into a speaker cable which could be tens of feet long and could potentially make a great antenna. Boom, you've just created a radio transmitter.
What's it broadcasting over? Probably lots of things. NDB radio beacons that aircraft use to find airports, HF radio communication channels used by long range aircraft to communicate with radio traffic controllers, ham radio operators using the HF band, maritime mobile, and others. Go download the radio frequency allocation chart for your country and read it up to 20MHz, you'll probably find there's a dozen or more things you could interfere with.
And when companies/agencies get interfered with, they call the FCC or its equivalent in your country. Industry Canada here have fantastic radio location gear and a lot of well trained people. If a navigational band gets interfered with, they can potentially be at your house within hours, and I imagine most other governments have equally capable agencies. You'll get your equipment seized, and potentially several thousand dollars worth of fines. That's standard. But in a post 9/11 world, if you manage to interfere with an aircraft transmission and homeland security gets involved... things could be much worse.
In conclusion, DO NOT REMOVE THE OUTPUT FILTER FROM A CLASS D AMPLIFIER. EVER.
"but filterless amps exist, it can't be that bad!"
Yeah, and you'll find out that they stop at the tens of watts, use class BD or sigma delta switching, have slower edge rates and lower efficiency as a result, still require ferrites, and tell you not to use speaker wire lengths over a few inches. Thinking that an iNuke or similar amplifier falls in the same category is utter lunacy.
"But it sounds better!"
Throw out the old output filter inductors, and wind new inductors with litz wire on decent inductor cores. Maybe even replace the output capacitors with good film caps. It might make things sound just as good. If it doesn't, buy a better amp.
End of rant. Thanks.
DO NOT REMOVE THE OUTPUT FILTER FROM A CLASS D AMPLIFIER. EVER.
Class D amps have fast edge rates coming out of their output stage - the frequency content of these signals have harmonics that go well up past 10MHz. Now feed them into a speaker cable which could be tens of feet long and could potentially make a great antenna. Boom, you've just created a radio transmitter.
What's it broadcasting over? Probably lots of things. NDB radio beacons that aircraft use to find airports, HF radio communication channels used by long range aircraft to communicate with radio traffic controllers, ham radio operators using the HF band, maritime mobile, and others. Go download the radio frequency allocation chart for your country and read it up to 20MHz, you'll probably find there's a dozen or more things you could interfere with.
And when companies/agencies get interfered with, they call the FCC or its equivalent in your country. Industry Canada here have fantastic radio location gear and a lot of well trained people. If a navigational band gets interfered with, they can potentially be at your house within hours, and I imagine most other governments have equally capable agencies. You'll get your equipment seized, and potentially several thousand dollars worth of fines. That's standard. But in a post 9/11 world, if you manage to interfere with an aircraft transmission and homeland security gets involved... things could be much worse.
In conclusion, DO NOT REMOVE THE OUTPUT FILTER FROM A CLASS D AMPLIFIER. EVER.
"but filterless amps exist, it can't be that bad!"
Yeah, and you'll find out that they stop at the tens of watts, use class BD or sigma delta switching, have slower edge rates and lower efficiency as a result, still require ferrites, and tell you not to use speaker wire lengths over a few inches. Thinking that an iNuke or similar amplifier falls in the same category is utter lunacy.
"But it sounds better!"
Throw out the old output filter inductors, and wind new inductors with litz wire on decent inductor cores. Maybe even replace the output capacitors with good film caps. It might make things sound just as good. If it doesn't, buy a better amp.
End of rant. Thanks.
Uli Behringer of The Music Group Q&A - Page 21
Uli says "Upon request from professional touring sound companies, we just launched a very powerful 12,000 Watt version which basically contains two NU6000 amps in a 2U case."
Aha - so it's two NU6000 amps, must be some mods to get to be stable at 2 ohms per side.
"... we are currently testing some low-noise fans and are positive to be able to improve this aspect."
Later, he makes a note of the nu4-6000
"We are currently studying the market demand for a 4-channel DSP version in order to evaluate if such a model would justify the R&D investment. It would be great to get some feedback here."
Looks like new things are coming.
Uli says "Upon request from professional touring sound companies, we just launched a very powerful 12,000 Watt version which basically contains two NU6000 amps in a 2U case."
Aha - so it's two NU6000 amps, must be some mods to get to be stable at 2 ohms per side.
"... we are currently testing some low-noise fans and are positive to be able to improve this aspect."
Later, he makes a note of the nu4-6000
"We are currently studying the market demand for a 4-channel DSP version in order to evaluate if such a model would justify the R&D investment. It would be great to get some feedback here."
Looks like new things are coming.
Turbodawg: I am not a troll (although people who know me might argue I have a personality resembling one). Mods a bad idea? Depends. Arguments for "yes": voids a warranty. Removing the output inductors? Definitely unwise (also amp refused to work afterwards.) Gmarsh, I repent of that mod. Argument "No": But the no fan mod was successful -- in reducing the fan noise.
The concrete block as "cat warmer": still in evaluation stages. On the negative side, field reports indicate the cat is just as content lying on top of the block when the amp has been off all night On the positive side, the cat no longer takes up desk space.
The concrete block as "cat warmer": still in evaluation stages. On the negative side, field reports indicate the cat is just as content lying on top of the block when the amp has been off all night
On the positive side, the cat no longer takes up desk space.
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hello I am thinking of getting an INUKE 6000 to power a sub I am building and I have questions for those of you who have the DSP versions. Can the DSP crossover to an external amp for the main speakers . I want to use a tube amp I have for my mains and reading the lit on the DSP INuKEs I cant see how the crossover works except using both channels of the INUKE.I do have a yamaha digital crossover I can use instead and not buy the DSP version. thanks
Mark
Mark
A few points on this:
- The nu6000 has a bridged amp section in each channel, it cannot be bridged further. It's real world perfomance has been bechmarked in the speakerplans thread linked above. So if you're building a single driver sub, you would need dual 4 ohm voicecoil sub to max out the amp. Or multiple drivers/subs.
- There is no line level output on the dsp amps, there is no way to filter a set of mains in the dsp if you are using it for the sub. It is entirely possible to use a non-dsp crossover on your mains which is preferable IMHO because it keeps you from making more digital conversions. You can run your mains without a crossover (rec. sealing the ports if vented), or a passive speaker level high pass (I prefer 1st order), or a simple line level active or passive filter.
thanks turbodawg for answering my main question about the dsp crossover having no outputs as I suspected . I will be using two dual 4ohm subs each in series to give me stereo 8ohm subs one a t-line and one sealed. The inuke 6000 seems ideal as it outputs 1000rms into 8ohms stereo which is how much these subs reaally need.and its dirt cheap.
thanks mark
thanks mark
Taking a shot at the amp...Florida style...
I'm not yet home, but email says my NU6000 has been delivered to my home. It occurs to me I live in a fairly safe neighborhood. They can leave packages. A good step up from a few apartments I lived in, where I would subscribe to a newspaper (remember them? Made from dead trees! Really!). Problem was the newspaper was rarely there by late morning Also here in Florida "deadly force" is more often allowed, but I don't think we're allowed to use bait 
I'm not yet home, but email says my NU6000 has been delivered to my home. It occurs to me I live in a fairly safe neighborhood. They can leave packages. A good step up from a few apartments I lived in, where I would subscribe to a newspaper (remember them? Made from dead trees! Really!). Problem was the newspaper was rarely there by late morning
Also here in Florida "deadly force" is more often allowed, but I don't think we're allowed to use bait
First reports...nobody had stolen the package (Ya just gotta love that "Castle Doctrine"). More seriously...I unpacked the amp, and (what else) after making sure it powers up (yes) noisy fans and all. I took off the top and disconnected the fans. The NU6000 internals are substantially different than the NU3000. Bypassing the fans is even easier. There are two fans. I simply disconnected the PCB plug and left it free. Unlike the NU3000, there are no ducts to direct the air to heat sinks, so none to remove (duh!). The heat sinks are quite different than the NU3000's. The stick on heat sinks won't work here. In fact, I can't even see the MOSFETs - perhaps they are on the under side of the PCB? The heat sink is a little metal strip with a phillips screw in the center. I am stymied on what, if any, heat sink mods might work here.
Unlike the NU3000, the fanless NU6000 (cover on) goes into protect fairly easily, with very little volume. I am currently experimenting with open top to see if that works better.
Unlike the NU3000, the fanless NU6000 (cover on) goes into protect fairly easily, with very little volume. I am currently experimenting with open top to see if that works better.
Actual DIY question!!!
Even at a room temp. of 74 deg. F, the amp is resetting itself randomly, even at idle (possibly due to t-storms in area -- my UPS clicked once also). In any case I want to try bigger heat sinks. DigiKey sells a confusing array of them. how do I determine what MOSFET is used, and/or what type of heat sink to look for?
Even at a room temp. of 74 deg. F, the amp is resetting itself randomly, even at idle (possibly due to t-storms in area -- my UPS clicked once also). In any case I want to try bigger heat sinks. DigiKey sells a confusing array of them. how do I determine what MOSFET is used, and/or what type of heat sink to look for?
I'm quite sure what you are doing is an extremely bad idea, but by all means feel free to continue to waste your time (and money) since it seems to be worth very little.
Is it any mystery that an amp with two bridged sections and two powerful fans is not going to like being run without a fan??? You've probably already permanently damaged the amp, taking a good percentage off it's service life. Stop now.
Sheesh.
Is it any mystery that an amp with two bridged sections and two powerful fans is not going to like being run without a fan??? You've probably already permanently damaged the amp, taking a good percentage off it's service life. Stop now.
Sheesh.
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