I just picked up a R&S UPL on eBay for a good price, but it suffered from a shipper that just didn't care if the item made it in one piece to its destination. Some pieces have broken off the case, mainly feet, however the LCD isn't right either. Only the upper left corner is illuminated, the rest is pretty dark and hard to read with lights on in the shop.
I am trying to decide whether to keep it, break the cal seal and attempt repair, or just return it.
When it first arrived, it would not even boot up. After several hours of poking around in DOS, I finally got the UPL software to start up. I also found and loaded a diagnostic BASIC program and ran all tests. They passed.
The issues are:
Broken feet
Noisy fan bearing
Dim/unevenly illuminated display
If that display could be repaired with a new backlight, or replaced entirely with something equivalent but maybe a bit better, I think the instrument could be servicable.
Does anyone have photos of the inside of a UPL? Has anyone repaired the LCD display on this particular unit?
I am trying to decide whether to keep it, break the cal seal and attempt repair, or just return it.
When it first arrived, it would not even boot up. After several hours of poking around in DOS, I finally got the UPL software to start up. I also found and loaded a diagnostic BASIC program and ran all tests. They passed.
The issues are:
Broken feet
Noisy fan bearing
Dim/unevenly illuminated display
If that display could be repaired with a new backlight, or replaced entirely with something equivalent but maybe a bit better, I think the instrument could be servicable.
Does anyone have photos of the inside of a UPL? Has anyone repaired the LCD display on this particular unit?
That is a real loss. I would stick the seller with it and send it back. Now they have a boat anchor on their hands and less value to be recouped when they try to sell it again.
If your price paid was fair market value for the instrument, I would find another seller (like a test equipment company). Or look for equivalent priced gear.
The last piece I purchased from eBay was poorly packaged as usuall. It arrived with a knob protruding out of the cardboard box. I even communicated with the seller saying please package properly with plenty of space around the item. My idea of space around the item is different than most. Just like my view of excellent condition is different than most.
If your price paid was fair market value for the instrument, I would find another seller (like a test equipment company). Or look for equivalent priced gear.
The last piece I purchased from eBay was poorly packaged as usuall. It arrived with a knob protruding out of the cardboard box. I even communicated with the seller saying please package properly with plenty of space around the item. My idea of space around the item is different than most. Just like my view of excellent condition is different than most.
This item certainly arrived with plenty of "space" around it---air space. LOL Seller packed it in a single wall corrugated box that was cut down from a larger size and poorly taped together. Inside, was a piece of Styrofoam on the bottom, a few loose, broken pieces of the same on the sides, and some crumbled up Kraft paper on top. The unit had been banging around in there on it's journey.
I got a response from R&S on the repair. "The standard repair/cal cost for the UPL is $3970." Ouch.. The 'accepted offer' was $2100. Seller posted "MINT" three times in the title, and from the photos, it sure looked it. But what arrived was broken and covered with a sooty substance, probably from road dirt or warehouse, due to the box not being sealed.
After hours of mucking around, I did make it operational, but that LCD display is a problem. If I could replace that, and get the seller to pay for the cost, it would be a nice unit, after cleaning up. But I am reluctant to break any seal to have a look inside, if I want to return it.
I got a response from R&S on the repair. "The standard repair/cal cost for the UPL is $3970." Ouch.. The 'accepted offer' was $2100. Seller posted "MINT" three times in the title, and from the photos, it sure looked it. But what arrived was broken and covered with a sooty substance, probably from road dirt or warehouse, due to the box not being sealed.
After hours of mucking around, I did make it operational, but that LCD display is a problem. If I could replace that, and get the seller to pay for the cost, it would be a nice unit, after cleaning up. But I am reluctant to break any seal to have a look inside, if I want to return it.
I'd send it back to the seller if you still can and get your money back. Then wait for the next one.
The UPL is "board-replaceable" only and the factory will not provide schematics. It is also at least 20 years old now so things do go. It is almost completely self-testing and there is only one calibration that is user enabled - the B1 Low Distortion Generator option self calibration. If this is not installed, it is factory service only.
The folks at R&S are real pro's at what they do, but they are used to well-heeled customers. With many machines retired by these well-heeled companies hitting the 2nd hand market, I am sure R&S has had to reassess what they would and would not support.
Good luck.
The seller has offered back a significant partial refund, which would cover replacement of the damaged components. The software is operating and I found the problem with the display was that some paper strips inside the chambers that hold the L shaped CCFL tube had dislodged and curled around the tube, blocking 80% of the light from reaching the panel.
I'm going to have to get a new front panel assemby, because the keypad doesn't work. R&S quoted $575 and 2 weeks lead time. The LCD is a Sharp LQ084V1DG21 model, and I found them for $150 on eBay, new.
So with the drive upgraded to a solid state flash drive, a new front panel and my repairs to the display CCFL reflectors, the display is good and the new keyboard should be fine.
I've watched for new units, but the only other units are in Korea and Japan and 3-4X what I paid for this unit and not configured for hi-fi audio testing, as this one is. I think my unit is a 2008 model, with the faster CPU, so that's a good thing.
I'm going to have to get a new front panel assemby, because the keypad doesn't work. R&S quoted $575 and 2 weeks lead time. The LCD is a Sharp LQ084V1DG21 model, and I found them for $150 on eBay, new.
So with the drive upgraded to a solid state flash drive, a new front panel and my repairs to the display CCFL reflectors, the display is good and the new keyboard should be fine.
I've watched for new units, but the only other units are in Korea and Japan and 3-4X what I paid for this unit and not configured for hi-fi audio testing, as this one is. I think my unit is a 2008 model, with the faster CPU, so that's a good thing.
I think you will like the UPL. I have one that I got several years ago that was damaged (sold that way on ebay) so I did end up replacing feet and such.
When new, the UPL came with a set of disks that could re-load the hard drive. R&S won't sell those anymore - the licensing reason they give is really a Microsoft issue because the disks would re-install MS-DOS and Microsoft ended that years ago.
Assuming a person had an unused MS-DOS install available - if you asked real nice - R&S might help with just the R&S UPL install software.
Also, my unit came with two big binders - an operating manual and a complete component level service manual (1078.2008.02) with a full set of schematics and parts lists - so clearly this instrument is not "board-replaceable" only.
I also had the same bad news as you - the front panel keypad did not work completely. I contacted R&S and got the same expensive answer as you did. Although you can run it with a PC keyboard rather than the front panel, I wanted the unit completely working, so I paid the price for a replacement (it came from Germany).
*****WARNING*****WARNING*****
The problem with the keypad in my unit was a cracked flex. It is thin and virtually un-repairable. I tried. You can't solder to it - it melts - and conductive coatings didn't work either.
Again - warning - the flex is very fragile. The new one cracked when I was plugging it in.
How bad does wasting 500 bucks make you feel? My feelings are un-printable.
I ended up making an entire new front panel keypad PCB with tiny switches behind the rubber buttons. DO NOT EVEN ASK how many hours that took to trace all the original wiring and to fabricate the replacement.
That's all in the past now and I really like the unit.
Later, I got a second unit off ebay cheap (the one without a front panel). The listing said the hard drive made a bad noise so no-one bid on it and I got it cheap. It was actually only a bad CPU fan - my first unit also had that issue - an easy fix.
When new, the UPL came with a set of disks that could re-load the hard drive. R&S won't sell those anymore - the licensing reason they give is really a Microsoft issue because the disks would re-install MS-DOS and Microsoft ended that years ago.
Assuming a person had an unused MS-DOS install available - if you asked real nice - R&S might help with just the R&S UPL install software.
Also, my unit came with two big binders - an operating manual and a complete component level service manual (1078.2008.02) with a full set of schematics and parts lists - so clearly this instrument is not "board-replaceable" only.
I also had the same bad news as you - the front panel keypad did not work completely. I contacted R&S and got the same expensive answer as you did. Although you can run it with a PC keyboard rather than the front panel, I wanted the unit completely working, so I paid the price for a replacement (it came from Germany).
*****WARNING*****WARNING*****
The problem with the keypad in my unit was a cracked flex. It is thin and virtually un-repairable. I tried. You can't solder to it - it melts - and conductive coatings didn't work either.
Again - warning - the flex is very fragile. The new one cracked when I was plugging it in.
How bad does wasting 500 bucks make you feel? My feelings are un-printable.
I ended up making an entire new front panel keypad PCB with tiny switches behind the rubber buttons. DO NOT EVEN ASK how many hours that took to trace all the original wiring and to fabricate the replacement.
That's all in the past now and I really like the unit.
Later, I got a second unit off ebay cheap (the one without a front panel). The listing said the hard drive made a bad noise so no-one bid on it and I got it cheap. It was actually only a bad CPU fan - my first unit also had that issue - an easy fix.
Lucky you!
I asked R&S both in Maryland and in Germany and although the "Service Manual" was available, and even though they knew the PDF did not include the schematics, they never gave me an answer as to how I could buy the paper copy of the manual with the schematics. When I asked again months later, I was told "board replaceable only." This has been within the last 2 years so perhaps policies changed.
So....if I ask very nicely, can I convince you to provide a copy of the schematics? i can do the copying here if you would not mind loaning out the originals.
Thanks!
I've got DOS 6.22 discs from the 1990s. As long as they still read...
I suspect I have the install software, as there is an INSTALL directory on the UPL drive with the following files:
03/10/2008 02:11 PM 0 CONFIG.ADD
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 610 CONTENT.DOC
05/22/1996 01:43 PM 223 DIG.CAL
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 30,735 DRIVER.LZH
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 82,050 DSP.LZH
04/03/2000 09:11 AM 16,086 FILECHK.EXE
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 12,961 FILECHK.LZH
01/07/2004 01:57 PM 15,159 INSTALL.BAT
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 3,063 LABEL.LZH
11/24/1992 02:55 AM 35,762 LHA.EXE
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 331,091 REF.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 2,237 ROOT.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 47,529 SETUP.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 80,576 TOOLS.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 821,736 UPL.LZH
01/04/1999 03:12 PM 637 UPLINST.BAT
16 File(s) 1,480,455 bytes
How many pages is that service manual? Any chance of scanning it and making a PDF? That would be highly valuable to UPL owners.
It looks like the ribbon cable cracked along the sharp edge of the aluminum panel where it exits the keypad area. There's no strain relief or sheath to prevent the radius of bend from exceeding the breaking point of the printed circuits. Thanks for the warning. I will be cognizant not to bend the cable any more than the absolute minimum required to install it. It probably broke when removing the panel and flipping it over to rest on top of the unit.
I could see a good project being to make the PCB layout and have a Taiwan-based PCB maker manufacture a few boards for $200. You could sell these to UPL owners who have the same problem.
I agree that I will probably like the unit when it's fully operational. I have been able to do some testing with an ext keyboard, but it's clumsy due to no space to keep such a thing in the shop shelving. Efficient operation really implores that the front panel be functional.
I suspect I have the install software, as there is an INSTALL directory on the UPL drive with the following files:
03/10/2008 02:11 PM 0 CONFIG.ADD
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 610 CONTENT.DOC
05/22/1996 01:43 PM 223 DIG.CAL
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 30,735 DRIVER.LZH
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 82,050 DSP.LZH
04/03/2000 09:11 AM 16,086 FILECHK.EXE
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 12,961 FILECHK.LZH
01/07/2004 01:57 PM 15,159 INSTALL.BAT
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 3,063 LABEL.LZH
11/24/1992 02:55 AM 35,762 LHA.EXE
09/23/2005 09:25 AM 331,091 REF.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 2,237 ROOT.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 47,529 SETUP.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 80,576 TOOLS.LZH
09/23/2005 09:24 AM 821,736 UPL.LZH
01/04/1999 03:12 PM 637 UPLINST.BAT
16 File(s) 1,480,455 bytes
How many pages is that service manual? Any chance of scanning it and making a PDF? That would be highly valuable to UPL owners.
It looks like the ribbon cable cracked along the sharp edge of the aluminum panel where it exits the keypad area. There's no strain relief or sheath to prevent the radius of bend from exceeding the breaking point of the printed circuits. Thanks for the warning. I will be cognizant not to bend the cable any more than the absolute minimum required to install it. It probably broke when removing the panel and flipping it over to rest on top of the unit.
I could see a good project being to make the PCB layout and have a Taiwan-based PCB maker manufacture a few boards for $200. You could sell these to UPL owners who have the same problem.
I agree that I will probably like the unit when it's fully operational. I have been able to do some testing with an ext keyboard, but it's clumsy due to no space to keep such a thing in the shop shelving. Efficient operation really implores that the front panel be functional.
The UPL is a gem, and using the front panel is a breeze until you need to type in file names, then the keyboard is a must. My keyboard is stored under the front edge of the case when the flip down feet are opened in the downward position, and on top on the front edge when the feet are closed and the case is fully horizontal..
I'm planning to replace one of my Tektronix mainframes on the shelf above my bench with the UPL. With the feet closed, there is 1/2" of space to shoehorn it in there, underneath the other Tek mainframe. Two mainframes currently occupy this space, one atop the other.
I found a miniature keyboard that is 11" wide which can be used for the odd time when I modify a setup and wish to save it. Most of the time, I expect to recall a setup and just tweak the generator output level. I may be able to stick it in a space to the right of the stack of equipment for storage.
I read Ken Rockwell's review on the UPL and that's what sold me on it.
I found a miniature keyboard that is 11" wide which can be used for the odd time when I modify a setup and wish to save it. Most of the time, I expect to recall a setup and just tweak the generator output level. I may be able to stick it in a space to the right of the stack of equipment for storage.
I read Ken Rockwell's review on the UPL and that's what sold me on it.
The niftiest keyboard for the UPL - at least for me - is a BTC-5100 with the AT plug. It is 88-keys and fits right in there. They also feel great to type on since they were clones of the IBM F. The only thing is the "misplacement" of the up arrow key - it is not an "inverted T" arrangement like the venerable but outrageously expensive IBM Spacesaver. It's close enough for me.
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I bought this SolidTech keyboard:
SolidTek PS/2 Mini Laptop Keyboard
I bought a PS/2 to AT adapter cable for it. The one you have looks ideal and is a space saver too.
SolidTek PS/2 Mini Laptop Keyboard
I bought a PS/2 to AT adapter cable for it. The one you have looks ideal and is a space saver too.
Most of the ones I've come across in the last year or so appear to have been "salvaged" by liquidation dealers who have no idea of what they are selling, or what actual state they are in. They go for $3K to $4K. The sellers who know what a UPL is and what options mean what to whom don't sell it cheap, and with the right options, it can be $5K to $10K.
For audio, the one option that makes a UPL truly worthwhile is the B1, the analog Low Distortion Generator. While an equivalent feature is standard on an AP SYS-2722 and accounts for its excellent spec of -117dB THD+N, this feature is an option on all R&S analyzers - the UPD, UPL and UPV. The standard R&S generator is digital. The B2/B29 AES/EBU and B3 second generator options may also be interesting for some but the B1 is the cat's meow.
The attached THD of a 1kHz 1Vrms signal generated by my UPL with B1 speaks for itself. The analyzer was configured unbalanced and without passing through a notch filter. It translates to 0.0000331%. THD+N is in the 0.00025% range.
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I paid $2100 for mine (but due to shipping damage, seller offered $800 refund). B4, B10 options. It's superior to my Tektronix AA501 and SG5010 analyzer/generator, in terms of distortion levels. But rarely does a customer amplifier hit the dot triple-ought digit distortion levels. Well, maybe a Hafler power amp, or a Accuphase moving coil preamp.
I would imagine B1 is a plug in option and that the software already has a provision for it.
I would imagine B1 is a plug in option and that the software already has a provision for it.
Any circuit details available for that option? The performance is exceptional. The analyzer side must have some hybrid of analog preprocessing and digital processing to get that performance.
The repair quotes mentioned earlier look real. R&S charge a flat fee for any repair. Where I used to work we had some R&S signal generators that used a lithium battery as backup for the memory containing the calibration constants. R&S wanted $3500 to replace the battery. Looks like they're up to $3900 now.
On the topic of eBay test equipment: A few years back I wanted an HP3577A network analyzer. Found one at a good price on eBay. Looked good in the pictures and seller said he'd babied it in his lab. It was packaged in a similar fashion to your UPL. That analyzer weights in at about 70 lbs! It arrived with one corner crushed and pushed in by probably 40-50 mm. Those HP35xx-series instruments are sturdy. That took some serious work do. There were no obvious signs of damage to the box. It's anybody's guess what happened. My guess is that the equipment fell off the lab bench at one point and the seller wanted it gone. Maybe stick USPS will the insurance claim.
After a bunch of back-and-forth email with the seller, I filed a claim with eBay/Paypal and got my money back. I then dropped the analyzer off with the USPS so the seller could file his insurance claim.
I haven't shopped for test equipment on eBay since.
It looks like you got yourself a nice analyzer, though.
Tom
On the topic of eBay test equipment: A few years back I wanted an HP3577A network analyzer. Found one at a good price on eBay. Looked good in the pictures and seller said he'd babied it in his lab. It was packaged in a similar fashion to your UPL. That analyzer weights in at about 70 lbs! It arrived with one corner crushed and pushed in by probably 40-50 mm. Those HP35xx-series instruments are sturdy. That took some serious work do. There were no obvious signs of damage to the box. It's anybody's guess what happened. My guess is that the equipment fell off the lab bench at one point and the seller wanted it gone. Maybe stick USPS will the insurance claim.
After a bunch of back-and-forth email with the seller, I filed a claim with eBay/Paypal and got my money back. I then dropped the analyzer off with the USPS so the seller could file his insurance claim.
I haven't shopped for test equipment on eBay since.
It looks like you got yourself a nice analyzer, though.
Tom
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I still have somewhat good luck with eBay sellers. Plus the fact that buyer protection is so strong and favors the buyer in most instances even when it shouldn't sometimes.
One thing that concerns me, the mention of a lithium ion battery that holes calibration constants in the UPL. I thought the calibration constants were. Cal files on the hard drive. I didn't know there was a ticking time bomb in there. But of course the way the circuit boards are sandwiches together I cannot find any battery or see it battery.
If Rohde & Schwarz comes back to me with a invoice and a definite date when they can ship me a new keypad / front panel, then I think it will be a good deal.
One thing that concerns me, the mention of a lithium ion battery that holes calibration constants in the UPL. I thought the calibration constants were. Cal files on the hard drive. I didn't know there was a ticking time bomb in there. But of course the way the circuit boards are sandwiches together I cannot find any battery or see it battery.
If Rohde & Schwarz comes back to me with a invoice and a definite date when they can ship me a new keypad / front panel, then I think it will be a good deal.
Unfortunately, I do not have schematics for the B1 option. What I do know is that it is an SVO with 2 integrators and a loop inverter, implemented with very precisely matched components and thermally monitored and compensated by the machines's firmware.
The input signal is pre-processed in the analog domain then digitized for the 32-bit DSPs.
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