Hypex Ncore

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Hey Boggit, you are to be commended for your efforts. I hope your venture is very successful.

There are several reasons why I have been of focussing on the input buffer design options. One is that one of my favourite brands, Theta Digital, has NC1200 based products (Dreadnaught and Prometheus). They appear to use the stock input buffer on the NC1200. I had always wanted to see/hear a shootout between the Prometheus and the Kaluga with a view that it would be a shootout between the supplies. But it appears there's another variable in the mix.

Secondly, I have been working on a balanced input for an amp I am building. It uses Self's ultra low noise typology of quad input buffers and four differential amplifiers with quad versions of the very highly praised LM4562 op amp, the LME49740. So input buffer design, including discrete designs, is flavour of the month with me.

So when someone begins to tout massive improvements in input buffer design I am naturally intrigued as to whether they've made the noise and linearity measurements to support these claims.

I suggest either buying the Theta's, or buying one of the commercial amps with LM4562 based buffers. What's superior in audio is in the eye of the beholder. We have people that spend $300000 on tube amps with over 1% THD. It up to the designer to implement what they think is best, and the end user to decide if they like the sound. That's all there is to it, end of story.
 
Julf it would of been easy to take the safe non conflicting approach to safeguard my commercial interests, however Bavmike is a good guy.

Fair enough, and I might have come across unduly harsh, but I do think SGK's requests are reasonable.

I'm not sure if anybody has correlated warm sounding to a particular measurement.
Bob Carver came pretty close. :)

I love what I do and I love people sharing the enjoyment I got when hearing the difference, measured or not.
Appreciated, and good to hear. But part of my point is that Bruno went further - when he heard a difference, he figured out ways to measure, understand and control the difference. And I don't think it is unreasonable to try to do the same - the first step is to a) verify the differences are real, and b) see if they are measurable.
 
What's superior in audio is in the eye of the beholder.

Yes and no. What is more pleasing to a listener is up to that listener's ears, preferences, and as you say, eyes. But for fully electronic (as opposed to electromechanical) systems, there is also the idea of "as accurate to the original signal as possible". That is something that can be measured.

When you buy a car, the only way you can decide if you like a car or not is by test driving it. That doesn't mean things like engine power, fuel efficiency, weight, braking distance, interior space etc. are not relevant criteria too.
 
I suggest either buying the Theta's, or buying one of the commercial amps with LM4562 based buffers. What's superior in audio is in the eye of the beholder. We have people that spend $300000 on tube amps with over 1% THD. It up to the designer to implement what they think is best, and the end user to decide if they like the sound. That's all there is to it, end of story.

You miss the point of the conversation entirely
 
Don't quite understand why you have to control a difference if it sounds better.
I will give my findings on the different op amps once I get them although of course they are only my opinions and I may be looking for different things in my music to someone else.
I don't really see anything wrong with Boggits comments he was just expressing his own opinion of what he found when listening to his modified equipment.
 
Don't quite understand why you have to control a difference if it sounds better.

Of course nobody is demanding you do, and if you are just a hobbyist building an amp for yourself, nobody is expecting you to. But it is of interest to the people who actually design the stuff - the engineers, who practice "the creative application of scientific principles to design or develop structures, machines, apparatus, or manufacturing processes, or works utilizing them singly or in combination; or to construct or operate the same with full cognizance of their design; or to forecast their behavior under specific operating conditions; all as respects an intended function, economics of operation or safety to life and property."
 
Any way to lighten the mood can anybody guess what this is? And no its not "The Bear"
NC500%20Stereo%20Mounting%20holes_zpsugsql6o3.jpg
 
Of course nobody is demanding you do, and if you are just a hobbyist building an amp for yourself, nobody is expecting you to. But it is of interest to the people who actually design the stuff - the engineers, who practice "the creative application of scientific principles to design or develop structures, machines, apparatus, or manufacturing processes, or works utilizing them singly or in combination; or to construct or operate the same with full cognizance of their design; or to forecast their behavior under specific operating conditions; all as respects an intended function, economics of operation or safety to life and property."
A fair point, and yes its part of the double edge sword we benefit from of posting on here. And one we must pay respect to.
 
The input impedance of the NC500 is 1.8k R, an easy load for an op amp like the LM4562. Fig 4.23 of Self's Small Signal Audio Design 2nd ed. gives you an idea of just how low the distortion of the LM4562 is when driving such a load in series feedback mode. I can think of ways the noise of the recommended input buffer might be lowered and, of course, one can implement a fully discrete design. But the recommended design is no slouch.
 
Julf I have listened back to back, front to back, back to back, in out, in out, with different Op amps. I have heard an immediate difference. The difference between the Burson and the Sparkos is less pronounced. Sometimes I sure Sometimes I'm not so. I really wanted to like the Burson more, slightly better margin, better packaged better website, look better, arrived faster. They have other products I want to work with and a good relationship would be good. However my ears tell me I prefer the Sparkos. Honestly if you asked me to identify which was which I could not say 100% which was which in isolation. I don't know that for a fact and it would be easy to I could. However if you listened back to back you would know. Now I think that's a pretty honest answer that you and my customers deserve.
 
The input impedance of the NC500 is 1.8k R, an easy load for an op amp like the LM4562. Fig 4.23 of Self's Small Signal Audio Design 2nd ed. gives you an idea of just how low the distortion of the LM4562 is when driving such a load in series feedback mode. I can think of ways the noise of the recommended input buffer might be lowered and, of course, one can implement a fully discrete design. But the recommended design is no slouch.
My Nord - Boggit NC500 monoblocks at present do have the LM4562 op amps and do indeed sound good so I am very interested in seeing what difference the Burson and Sparkos op amps make.
 
Promise me one thing Colmo, that you will be totally honest, warts and all. Its the only way to be on a medium like this. If you are you can not go wrong. As I always think when somebody says I love my Arcam A19 its amazing, I ask compared with what?.
I know you have some pretty amazing speakers so tell it how it is when you get the upgrade.
Don't worry Boggit I will be totally honest especially as I will have to live with my choice.
For those who don't know I was amongst the first to buy the Nord NC500 mono blocks which currently have the LM4562 op amps and standard Hypex buffers fitted.
They already sound pretty good to me but I have ordered the uprated buffers and Boggit is kindly sending me both the Burson and Sparkos op amps to try.
I will let you all know what my own views are even if it means I prefer the LM4562.
My test music will primarily be Violin and Piano.
Of course if you don't listen to that type of music others may prefer a different choice to me.
Just to complicate things further my ears are not the same as yours and how I think a violin should sound may not be your sound.
 
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