Sound Quality Vs. Measurements

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all the furniture builders who never figured out built in obsolescence like the automotive industry

A furniture company here has been manufacturing couches with a chassis value guarantee.
If a customer returns a couch to have it refurbished, the chassis worth is deducted from the retail cost.
Those couches can be refurbished several times, even upgraded during their lifespan, by picking more expensive fabrics on the next attempt.

If it looks good and, more importantly, sits good, why change a winner ?
A new edition of a car model may drive better, but quite often it's worse in all other aspects.
Nothing to do with conservationalism (??) , a bit like saying you threw out the Picasso, because you wanted something new.
 
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Supposedly,
Acoustic Sounds did some modifications to their pressing machines to eliminate vibration during the cooling of the vinyl, with the idea this could reduce surface noise. The projects done there have so little surface noise that the electronics proved to be the noise floor.

Vinyl Records, SACDs, DVD Audio, Audiophile Equipment | Acoustic Sounds

At first glance this makes no sense at all, in any case I would expect tape hiss on Axis:Bold as Love would be the limitation. I have several wonderful old EMI's where the tape hiss is clearly heard on fade in and fade out.
 
I just saw this quote and I think it's worth resharing

"Audio as a hobby is dying, largely by its own hand. As far as the real world is concerned, high-end audio lost its credibility during the 1980s, when it flatly refused to submit to the kind of basic honesty controls (double-blind testing, for example) that had legitimized every other serious scientific endeavor since Pascal."

I'd say that this quote is correct, audio reviews almost exclusively avoid blind listening.

I'd say John Curl is correct as well though.

I came onto this forum for one reason. That is to get kids to buy hi fi. Talking helps me understand how to do it. My two bosses are 43 and me about 60 so that's a step in the right direction. I often say daft things to provoke thought. Sometimes I play two sides at once. I hate the world where young people do not try to build hi fi. Could this age create the Beatles or the Stones? I doubt it. And yet music is the only area that is like the past. We are in big trouble as a society. Do I mind? Not really as I am not in it for big money. For the kids I mind very much. Audio is Heaven on Earth and that is a fact.

I think some aspects of hi fi are like an extreme religion. Regardless of the absolute truth of things Ivor Tiefenbrun's " if is sounds better it is better" is the only truth.
 
Dejan. As far as I can see there is no need for speed in regulators if the output dumpers are not included. I prefer simple series regulators in the Goldmund style. BD139/140 are seriously fast devices and cost pennies.

Shunt regulators do not do anything remarkable and often cause problems. Series with shunt voltage reference is good. I have used VBE multiplier regulator and was very pleased with the results. That is using the 0.7V BE as the shunt element. Most shunt regulators need an output capacitor to be fast so what's the point? They are fun to contemplate and that's about it. Under no circumstances have a regulator to the dumpers. If the
dumpers are up 10 V they will be obliged to become a regulator in themselves. Also that is a softer clipping option.
 
I am very depressed. In some recent driver evaluations, I am starting to notice more and more roll-off on the top end. Where I know I used to be able to hear the tweeter doing impedance measurements well into 18K, I am loosing it more like 12 to 13K. I went back and compared my HCA750 driving my guest room speakers ( mine, Seas-Dayton) compared to my Anthem AVR. I am not sure I hear a difference any more. I am not sure if I really hear a difference between my Anthem and NAD. So I plugged in a Kenwood amp. Yea, I can hear a difference. It is headed for e-bay.

What does this mean about the thread topic? Well, it helps make clear most of the subtleties we argue about are mostly in the upper registers. It also means, getting old sucks, but it is better than the alternative.
 
At first glance this makes no sense at all...

Second glance as well. Reading their claims about molding equipment and formulation was... amusing. Here's a sample:

Clarity Vinyl is the ultimate vinyl formulation because it contains no carbon black additive, common in vinyl formulas for LPs. Carbon black contains trace metals that become magnetized and cause electrical distortions in cartridges during playback. The result is a smearing of the sound. It's the same reason that cartridge demagnetizers are effective. By taking the carbon black out of the vinyl, we are able to dramatically reduce the distortion and thus bring more clarity to the playback process, providing a more realistic musical experience for the listener.
 
At first glance this makes no sense at all, in any case I would expect tape hiss on Axis:Bold as Love would be the limitation. I have several wonderful old EMI's where the tape hiss is clearly heard on fade in and fade out.

Yes agree , i have experienced such also , But, i have also experienced total silence from , admittedly, only 3 of my reference LP's , yes CD SILENCE .....

I am very depressed. In some recent driver evaluations, I am starting to notice more and more roll-off on the top end. Where I know I used to be able to hear the tweeter doing impedance measurements well into 18K, I am loosing it more like 12 to 13K. I went back and compared my HCA750 driving my guest room speakers ( mine, Seas-Dayton) compared to my Anthem AVR. I am not sure I hear a difference any more. I am not sure if I really hear a difference between my Anthem and NAD. So I plugged in a Kenwood amp. Yea, I can hear a difference. It is headed for e-bay.

What does this mean about the thread topic? Well, it helps make clear most of the subtleties we argue about are mostly in the upper registers. It also means, getting old sucks, but it is better than the alternative.

I'm in the same boat too, two months ago i tested at 16K then got carried away testing loud for a friend and went behind the speaker to turn down (dipole) and took a shot to my left ear , i felt it immediately , going almost numb on that side . I haven't tested yet but its obvious i have lost upper frequency info in that ear , i hear much more upper freq detail from my right ear , there's definetly a dulling and now of course the unusual weirdness associated in adjusting when listening..

:mad::eek:



Do you have kids ?

Yes , no Picasso coach here , plus his work got around because in the early days his scratch was being recycled ...:)


:rofl:
 
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Talking reason has no effect on young'uns.

A critter here had his mind set on buying Beats headphones, from the web, at half the retail.
Laying out the giant ad campaign hype only made him more determined, what his friend circle had told was the single almighty truth.

So, blockhead me bought a genuine Dr Dre to demonstrate the difference to his Chinese clone. Zero effect.
Asked him about his favorite music tracks, downloaded them, and had him hear it through quality dynamic headphones. Zero effect.
Top of the range electrostatic headphones comparison. Zero effect.

Only thing that works is overbluffing them with another hype.
Which is where I draw the line : P*** Off, arrogant sheit generation !
 
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While this may appear to be a sweeping statement, it's relatively easy to prove. Take a product of your choice belonging to the economy sector of the market, look inside and replace just the two main caps with larger and better quality caps, and you will easily hear the difference.


What have you found in currently available electrolytics that you like better? I haven't tested any lower voltage ones for quite a while.
 
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While this may appear to be a sweeping statement, it's relatively easy to prove. Take a product of your choice belonging to the economy sector of the market, look inside and replace just the two main caps with larger and better quality caps, and you will easily hear the difference./QUOTE]

Even replace the caps with larger ones, same 'quality' (whatever that means) can be audible. There are a lot of amps with marginal PSRR and a larger cap will increase the higher mains harmonics spraying into the amp. Could well be audible!

jan
 
More than a few claim demagnetizing Lp's have an effect when using MC , never looked into it myself ....


Two things going on here, folks that apply serious bulk tape demagnetisers to LP's and those that simply exercise the cart with noise essentially no different statisticly than music. Use some basic physics to put actual numbers on these effects and it is obvious neither has an effect that could be measureable except under extreme laboratory conditions if at all.
 
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Second glance as well. Reading their claims about molding equipment and formulation was... amusing. Here's a sample:

Removing the carbon black from the formula has one really significant and recurring value- the records will wear out much faster. And getting to charge extra for that is even better. I suspect the lower surface hardness will cost in HF response as well. No wonder "less distortion".

At times I realize I'm constitutionally incapable of competing in High End audio. I just can't turn off my BS filter and invent on that scale. If any of these companies were much larger they would be hauled into court really fast. California has a law that allows lawyers to sue companies in the "public interest" and keep the winnings if companies are misrepresenting their products. It can be a really painful experience to deal with.
 
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