It appears we are heading in the direction of being acoustically doomed - if we go to the concert hall to hear our favourite symphony orchestra we are fated to have a miserable time, unless our temperament is sprightly, aided by a pleasant 'engagement' with the girlfriend beforehand, and ensconced by a humidity within a precise range ... 
Maybe some clarification why those Bedini and green pens are such extraordinary claims.
Music on the CD is represented as digital data encoded by the bumps; short ones represent a '1', long ones are a '0'. The data is read by the laser, and converted to a digital data stream.
Beside the music data there is also subcode data, say household data, telling where one track ends or starts, lots of redundant data for error correction, etc. Also, the data per revolution is interleaved and has to be zippered together after reading, this is done to make the error correction more robust.
After all the data is recovered and placed in temp storage, the system starts to assemble the music data words, perform error correction, assemble it into blocks, then into frames, add headers where appropriate, then sends it to the outside world.
Now, if you want to say increase the transient reproduction of the music on a CD by some external means, how do you do that? You would have to precisely know which bumps are related to music and not to housekeeping or redundancy, you would need to know which music bumps are related to the high frequency spectral components, and then you would need to modify those bumps so that the high-frequency components are increased. Then you need to go back, identify which redundant data is associated with the bumps you just modified, and also modify them to make sure the error correction doesn't totally mess up the sound beyond recognition.
So do you understand how extraordinary a claim it is that this can be done? Do you find it unreasonable to ask for an extraordinary proof?
Do you understand how ridiculous you make yourself with such a claim in the eyes of those who actually know how stuff works?
Don't you think we are quite friendly to you, all things considered?
jan
Music on the CD is represented as digital data encoded by the bumps; short ones represent a '1', long ones are a '0'. The data is read by the laser, and converted to a digital data stream.
Beside the music data there is also subcode data, say household data, telling where one track ends or starts, lots of redundant data for error correction, etc. Also, the data per revolution is interleaved and has to be zippered together after reading, this is done to make the error correction more robust.
After all the data is recovered and placed in temp storage, the system starts to assemble the music data words, perform error correction, assemble it into blocks, then into frames, add headers where appropriate, then sends it to the outside world.
Now, if you want to say increase the transient reproduction of the music on a CD by some external means, how do you do that? You would have to precisely know which bumps are related to music and not to housekeeping or redundancy, you would need to know which music bumps are related to the high frequency spectral components, and then you would need to modify those bumps so that the high-frequency components are increased. Then you need to go back, identify which redundant data is associated with the bumps you just modified, and also modify them to make sure the error correction doesn't totally mess up the sound beyond recognition.
So do you understand how extraordinary a claim it is that this can be done? Do you find it unreasonable to ask for an extraordinary proof?
Do you understand how ridiculous you make yourself with such a claim in the eyes of those who actually know how stuff works?
Don't you think we are quite friendly to you, all things considered?
jan
Mr Eddy Sir,
should you not be scratching the surface of your own sanity ?
A patent office is not a scientific institute, the people working at a patent office are not cream of the crop in the head department.
A patent office is a stamp department, for stamp collectors, and part of what I lovingly phrase the 'Form 279B' system.
A patent doesn't have to make sense, a patent lawyer merely checks for lunacy originality, puts the dots in the right legal sequence, and hands in the motion. If no-one disputes the claim within the official time limit, by filing Form 279C, it's a Bingo.
The assumption that an inventor is brilliant, merely on the basis that he/she had the cash to collect 50 building permits, and was granted all 50, is a judgmental error of the stamped patent reader, not the patent office.
About as vain naïve as assuming that the one, on the other side of the table, is the sane one, as there's clearly a signed, sealed and delivered psychiatrist paper pinned to the wall.
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It appears we are heading in the direction of being acoustically doomed - if we go to the concert hall to hear our favourite symphony orchestra we are fated to have a miserable time, unless our temperament is sprightly, aided by a pleasant 'engagement' with the girlfriend beforehand, and ensconced by a humidity within a precise range ...
.... and all these factors also make sure that the reproduction in your home will never give you the same feeling as at the life event.
jan
I honestly have no idea … I suppose, I have seen other people selling CD demagnetisers, I presume they must be selling a few of them ... some people must be getting improved sound, ergo there must be something to it?
Jan, you really need to get with the times.
TruRed (TVR) Damper - $249.00 : Digital Systems & Solutions, UltraBit Platinum
Now here's a product line that has, as its main fault, the ability to give true audiophiles too many voicing options for CDs. In order to take advantage of the full capability of this marvel of technology and avoid the scorn of your friends, you of course need three of the reds and three of the blues.
(hat tip to the fellow who accidentally put me on to this in another thread, where he extolled the virtues of selecting fuse directionality)
TruRed (TVR) Damper - $249.00 : Digital Systems & Solutions, UltraBit Platinum
Now here's a product line that has, as its main fault, the ability to give true audiophiles too many voicing options for CDs. In order to take advantage of the full capability of this marvel of technology and avoid the scorn of your friends, you of course need three of the reds and three of the blues.
(hat tip to the fellow who accidentally put me on to this in another thread, where he extolled the virtues of selecting fuse directionality)
The human brain may be unreliable.
However, with my ears and that human brain, reliable or not, I enjoy live music.
With the very same ears and brain, reliable or not, I listen to reproduced music in my living room.
My aim is, when listening to reproduced music, to have an experience which is as close as possible (within my budget) to the experience of listening to live music.
Possibly my joy of listening to live music is influenced by the placebo effect. May be yes, may be no, I don't know and I don't care. All I care about is the joy of listening to live music.
Possibly my joy of listening to reproduced music is influenced by the very same placebo effect. So what?
The hearing mechanism (ears plus brain), reliable or not, is what enables me to enjoy music, both live and reproduced.
Some people are interested in how their sound setup measures.
I'm interested only about how my sound setup sounds to me.
Indeed, it is purely subjective. What I like, some other people hate, while I hate what some other people like. Which is why I cannot rely, neither on technical data and measurements results, nor on others' listening impressions, in order to choose pieces of gear to my setup.
Those who are interested mainly in the experience of listening to reproduced music rely primarily on their hearing mechanism, reliable or not.
Those who are interested primarily in 'scientific evidence', trust measurements results and don't trust their ears.
Possibly, those people who don't trust their ears don't trust themselves generally. Which is why they need the 'stamp of approval' by measurements results, or 'scientific evidnce'.
Anyhow, this debate goes on and on for years and apparently it is going to go on endlessly, until the end of times. It isn't likely that even a single 'subjectivist' is going to be 'converted' by the arguments of the 'objectivists – and vice versa.
Furthermore, those who lack confidence in themselves often feel the need to get assurance in their stand by arguing their point endlessly. So be it.
Since exactly the opposite has been argued, may I assume that you haven't read any of the discussion?
What I was trying to say is that for me every live music experience has been that an experience, I wasn't there to ***** the PA, and if it was below par bemoan it (even where you sit/stand/fall over can effect the sound), I was there to enjoy the music surrounded by other nutters that like the same music as me...
How do you choose those pieces? Throw a dart at a board? It appears you've excluded any other selection technique.
All good points in your post ... what I like about live music is that it is characterised by comfortable intensity: the sensation of the sound has tremendous impact, it resonates deeply in my being, it makes me feel inspired. Much hifi in comparison is insipid, has no guts because if you turn up the volume to achieve that it starts to SHOUT AT YOU - some rare people call this distortion,
. Sorry, good music replay has got nothing to do with being "nice" for me -- it should grab you by the short and curlies, and say, "Listen to me, sonny Jim!" ...
No Superstitious Explanations Required....
I fully agree that the above items cannot change the data stream encoded (optical pits and lands) on the disc, however it may be that the green pens alter light reflections within the body of the disc, and by so doing alter Focus Error Signal, and the Tracking Error Signal.
In my experience the audio performance of typical consumer CD players is very prone to servo currents due to power supply and earthing interactions.
I have serviced thousands of typical CD players, and very often I have found that maladjusted servo and focus gain and offsets cause sub-optimal audio output when no error interpolation is induced.
Overly high servo currents typically cause harshness/noise in the audio output.
An interesting test would be to record the servo spectral content with a standard disc, and the same disc treated.....I venture that the Green Pen may well cause a (subtle) difference.
Dan.
Thanks Jan, for those who do not understand the CD encoding/decoding process.
I fully agree that the above items cannot change the data stream encoded (optical pits and lands) on the disc, however it may be that the green pens alter light reflections within the body of the disc, and by so doing alter Focus Error Signal, and the Tracking Error Signal.
In my experience the audio performance of typical consumer CD players is very prone to servo currents due to power supply and earthing interactions.
I have serviced thousands of typical CD players, and very often I have found that maladjusted servo and focus gain and offsets cause sub-optimal audio output when no error interpolation is induced.
Overly high servo currents typically cause harshness/noise in the audio output.
An interesting test would be to record the servo spectral content with a standard disc, and the same disc treated.....I venture that the Green Pen may well cause a (subtle) difference.
Dan.
Maybe if you have a DAC and analog output circuitry in the same box, fed by the same mediocre power supply, there can be an impact. But it is straight-forward engineering to fix those things at the design stage. But, yes, many modders and tweakers do not know about straightforward engineering, and they make changes that have an audible impact and call it 'improvement'....
Anyway, if you look at the geometry of a tracking laser, with a narrow beam riding fractions of a mm above the surface, it is extremely unlikely that any reflections alter the focus.
BTW it is short bumps and long bumps for the laser, not pits and land.
jan
Not even then. Basic optics. And Stereophile actually showed test data from Peter vW which confirmed that the "tweak" had absolutely no effect.
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