hi
They have free shipping on right now,,,,,,So go and have a look
Peerless- 12 ohm, 8" drivers,you might qualify
NS .. can you tell me the size that your baffles ended up ?
hi,
I made my slots at the baffle 2.25 " x 11" that's the opening I rounded the area between the slots so the actual size is 12" .
I have enclose a drawing,please excuse the messy artwork, I wish I had a drafting table ,lol.
The panels are 18" x 6' each, I did use 1" half round at the top and bottom of the slots ,and 1/4 round into the slot opening to the panels I ran one 6' piece per side , just like a picture frame would look.
I removed some plywood,I used a side grinder with a 6" abrasive layered sanding disc,was 60 grit,got it at the depo,to shave the area right at the cone edge to the slot ,I stopped about a 1' in from the edge,I built one slot with this shaved and one without ,get the grinder out and do this it helped the smoothness of the bass,I got the DATS for speaker measurements and when I learn what I need to know I will make some rough test as I am not a expert,I did run some test tones,and use my ears no dead spots or dropouts that I could hear,I played some Cher,ZZ top and Santana ,Iwas happy and had to turn down those amps,Belive by Cher didn't rattle the cones at all ,
,I'll try to finish those today so I can make a few pictures for you.
I like the sound I am getting from these and I have found about 12' apart is pretty good,anybody wants to jump in about optimum distance for slots,I'll listen......If I can help just ask!
Attachments
Hi, long time no see. Here are my recent works for bass units of the 3-channel system.
All 3 are slot-loaded, with 18" woofers. The central one has 2 drivers and arranged as push-pull. It's actually more like a pair of face-to-face shallow U-frames. That's for adapting the very-close-to-the-rear-wall positioning (for practical reason, no other option for the central sub). The rear lobe of the dipole is, I guess, more or less splited in 2 and becoming side-firing.
On the left side, the smaller baffle is more like an ordinary OB (shallow U-frame), just with a slot shape baffle hole and rear mounted driver.
(the taller one is fiddled mid array, the lower 'slot' type hole on it is not for loading but dispersion and, simply maintaining the strength of the slim baffle)
On the right, it was originally used at center which I posted here. This unit was later modded to have a cardoid response, well, sort of. (The trick is simply a cardboard with some punched holes at the back. ) So, why difference between the left and right? The space itself is asymmetry, I need more bass energy at the emptier right side. More output of the cardiod could be good.
Overall view with the whole system:
These 3 bass units are wired as Linear Matrix. The new build is partially for the matrix which tends to be center-heavy. So I need more output at the center for such character...
All 3 are slot-loaded, with 18" woofers. The central one has 2 drivers and arranged as push-pull. It's actually more like a pair of face-to-face shallow U-frames. That's for adapting the very-close-to-the-rear-wall positioning (for practical reason, no other option for the central sub). The rear lobe of the dipole is, I guess, more or less splited in 2 and becoming side-firing.
On the left side, the smaller baffle is more like an ordinary OB (shallow U-frame), just with a slot shape baffle hole and rear mounted driver.
(the taller one is fiddled mid array, the lower 'slot' type hole on it is not for loading but dispersion and, simply maintaining the strength of the slim baffle)
On the right, it was originally used at center which I posted here. This unit was later modded to have a cardoid response, well, sort of. (The trick is simply a cardboard with some punched holes at the back. ) So, why difference between the left and right? The space itself is asymmetry, I need more bass energy at the emptier right side. More output of the cardiod could be good.
Overall view with the whole system:
These 3 bass units are wired as Linear Matrix. The new build is partially for the matrix which tends to be center-heavy. So I need more output at the center for such character...
nice job shold sound great! Ralph Hellmer, Surreal Sound
Hi, long time no see. Here are my recent works for bass units of the 3-channel system.
All 3 are slot-loaded, with 18" woofers. The central one has 2 drivers and arranged as push-pull. It's actually more like a pair of face-to-face shallow U-frames. That's for adapting the very-close-to-the-rear-wall positioning (for practical reason, no other option for the central sub). The rear lobe of the dipole is, I guess, more or less splited in 2 and becoming side-firing.
On the left side, the smaller baffle is more like an ordinary OB (shallow U-frame), just with a slot shape baffle hole and rear mounted driver.
(the taller one is fiddled mid array, the lower 'slot' type hole on it is not for loading but dispersion and, simply maintaining the strength of the slim baffle)
On the right, it was originally used at center which I posted here. This unit was later modded to have a cardoid response, well, sort of. (The trick is simply a cardboard with some punched holes at the back. ) So, why difference between the left and right? The space itself is asymmetry, I need more bass energy at the emptier right side. More output of the cardiod could be good.
Overall view with the whole system:
These 3 bass units are wired as Linear Matrix. The new build is partially for the matrix which tends to be center-heavy. So I need more output at the center for such character...
hi,
WOW amazin', NICE Woodwork,Try a rug in front of the bass cabinet and see if it changes the bass,are you having echoes? the walls look slick,Lots of cancelations of wave fronts in those, I saw a dcx do you have a deq,it measures realtime whats happening,not critisizing system looks good wish I could here it !!!!!!
Cheers!
WOW amazin', NICE Woodwork,Try a rug in front of the bass cabinet and see if it changes the bass,are you having echoes? the walls look slick,Lots of cancelations of wave fronts in those, I saw a dcx do you have a deq,it measures realtime whats happening,not critisizing system looks good wish I could here it !!!!!!
Cheers!
Hi,
Thanks for all your kind words.
Replying some questions, first, the woofer is Emenence Sigma Pro18, old version, modified with PVA glue coating on cone, silicon oil treatment on spider, de-cap and adding phase plug...
It's a low Q driver with not so much Xmax, apparently not a good choice for OB. So don't follow this. I just own them since I didn't know OB. The problem is partially solved by high impedance drive, which I mentioned here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/155022-low-q-woofer-ob-high-zo-amp.html
Seems no one asked, but 3-ch linear matrix is an amazing thing to try, which I mentioned here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/193973-making-3-front-channels-out-stereo-signal.html
Because of the high impedance drive, I derive the 3-ch bass signals from line level. Which I (and seems no one, yet) didn't mention is 3-ch linear matrix for bass adds a huge effect in spaciousness and imaging. You can't indicate where the bass come from? It's worth to think again.
The woodwork, I'm glad you like it. In fact, I chose and used the ready-made pine boards bought from the hardware store. I studied the available dimensions first and then designed from there to reduce cutting and other works as much as possible. I live in an apartment and can't afford to mess up the place too long in any certain period. (so all those are just natural color of pine itself, no other finish whatsoever!)
And, yes, the living room of this apartment is full of hard and reflected surfaces. (Oh, that's the long wall, so it's actually not so big a place. I just manage to get a clean looking spot.) I live with it, and even utilize this character. You don't see the tweeters, do you? They're on floor behind the OB, up-firing, LOL !! (Flooder tweeter that is, see the link below.) The box of Behringer is DEQ2496, I use it mildly. It's always better to solve the problems acoustically, rather than electrically.
The odd combination of the system is a result I learned from a kind and knowledgeable friend, and the following very educative and informative threads:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/180301-lq-osd-acoustic-alternative.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/121385-loudspeakers-room-system.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/200040-stereophonic-sound-single-loudspeaker.html
And others I can't point out now...
And of course the system has been and will keep evolving. To-do list is always long...
Thanks for all your kind words.
Replying some questions, first, the woofer is Emenence Sigma Pro18, old version, modified with PVA glue coating on cone, silicon oil treatment on spider, de-cap and adding phase plug...
It's a low Q driver with not so much Xmax, apparently not a good choice for OB. So don't follow this. I just own them since I didn't know OB. The problem is partially solved by high impedance drive, which I mentioned here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/155022-low-q-woofer-ob-high-zo-amp.html
Seems no one asked, but 3-ch linear matrix is an amazing thing to try, which I mentioned here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/193973-making-3-front-channels-out-stereo-signal.html
Because of the high impedance drive, I derive the 3-ch bass signals from line level. Which I (and seems no one, yet) didn't mention is 3-ch linear matrix for bass adds a huge effect in spaciousness and imaging. You can't indicate where the bass come from? It's worth to think again.
The woodwork, I'm glad you like it. In fact, I chose and used the ready-made pine boards bought from the hardware store. I studied the available dimensions first and then designed from there to reduce cutting and other works as much as possible. I live in an apartment and can't afford to mess up the place too long in any certain period. (so all those are just natural color of pine itself, no other finish whatsoever!)
And, yes, the living room of this apartment is full of hard and reflected surfaces. (Oh, that's the long wall, so it's actually not so big a place. I just manage to get a clean looking spot.) I live with it, and even utilize this character. You don't see the tweeters, do you? They're on floor behind the OB, up-firing, LOL !! (Flooder tweeter that is, see the link below.) The box of Behringer is DEQ2496, I use it mildly. It's always better to solve the problems acoustically, rather than electrically.
The odd combination of the system is a result I learned from a kind and knowledgeable friend, and the following very educative and informative threads:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/180301-lq-osd-acoustic-alternative.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/121385-loudspeakers-room-system.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/200040-stereophonic-sound-single-loudspeaker.html
And others I can't point out now...
And of course the system has been and will keep evolving. To-do list is always long...
Hi,
Thanks for all your kind words.
Replying some questions, first, the woofer is Emenence Sigma Pro18, old version, modified with PVA glue coating on cone, silicon oil treatment on spider, de-cap and adding phase plug...
It's a low Q driver with not so much Xmax, apparently not a good choice for OB. So don't follow this. I just own them since I didn't know OB. The problem is partially solved by high impedance drive, which I mentioned here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/155022-low-q-woofer-ob-high-zo-amp.html
Seems no one asked, but 3-ch linear matrix is an amazing thing to try, which I mentioned here: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/193973-making-3-front-channels-out-stereo-signal.html
Because of the high impedance drive, I derive the 3-ch bass signals from line level. Which I (and seems no one, yet) didn't mention is 3-ch linear matrix for bass adds a huge effect in spaciousness and imaging. You can't indicate where the bass come from? It's worth to think again.
The woodwork, I'm glad you like it. In fact, I chose and used the ready-made pine boards bought from the hardware store. I studied the available dimensions first and then designed from there to reduce cutting and other works as much as possible. I live in an apartment and can't afford to mess up the place too long in any certain period. (so all those are just natural color of pine itself, no other finish whatsoever!)
And, yes, the living room of this apartment is full of hard and reflected surfaces. (Oh, that's the long wall, so it's actually not so big a place. I just manage to get a clean looking spot.) I live with it, and even utilize this character. You don't see the tweeters, do you? They're on floor behind the OB, up-firing, LOL !! (Flooder tweeter that is, see the link below.) The box of Behringer is DEQ2496, I use it mildly. It's always better to solve the problems acoustically, rather than electrically.
The odd combination of the system is a result I learned from a kind and knowledgeable friend, and the following very educative and informative threads:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/180301-lq-osd-acoustic-alternative.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/121385-loudspeakers-room-system.html
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/200040-stereophonic-sound-single-loudspeaker.html
And others I can't point out now...
And of course the system has been and will keep evolving. To-do list is always long...
Really nice set up, CLS! Cool stuff! I am kind of a OB bass addict myself, so I can imagine the joy you get out of this system...
BTW, have you tried different distances from the bass to the rear wall?
Very aesthetically pleasing design!
I use those pine project boards, and some I laminate myself, for guitar speaker cabinets because they resonate nicely and are light. Are you not concerned by their resonant nature?
Maybe, one day, when the tweaking bug bites, you could try laminating another material (hardwood strips, steel angle or arborite) to the back. I have laminated a pine baffle I made for an electric organ, with arborite, creating a constrained layer damped panel. The panel became much stiffer and much less resonant. Not what I was looking for in that application, it sucked the life out of the tone but made for a good hifi speaker baffle. If applied to the back the thin layer would not change the appearance of your nice design.
I use those pine project boards, and some I laminate myself, for guitar speaker cabinets because they resonate nicely and are light. Are you not concerned by their resonant nature?
Maybe, one day, when the tweaking bug bites, you could try laminating another material (hardwood strips, steel angle or arborite) to the back. I have laminated a pine baffle I made for an electric organ, with arborite, creating a constrained layer damped panel. The panel became much stiffer and much less resonant. Not what I was looking for in that application, it sucked the life out of the tone but made for a good hifi speaker baffle. If applied to the back the thin layer would not change the appearance of your nice design.
Last edited:
Thanks again
Uh, the space for speaker's positioning is really limited. They have to stay there, more or less.
And yes, the pine board is for musical instrument, not speaker, LOL !! For that, I did something to make them not so 'musical', hehe...
Firstly, the mid array baffle is narrow, with not much plain surface to resonate. The lower part is braced with the stand. And those midrange drivers work leisurely, don't excite the baffle too much.
And the 2 smaller bass units on left/right are braced at the rear side, not shown in the photos. They are small related to the driver's size, too. An interesting trick is applied under them. They are supported at the center of gravity, and maintained upright by very soft springs or foam blocks near front/rear edges, thus a fore-aft metronome. Push it slightly, it'd rock slowly back and forth with frquency under 1Hz.
Such soft feet make them very calm when playing. Not as dead still as the fully suspended swings I've tried, but this is much easier to make. For the limited working bandwith, it's a compromise I can take (these are working under 200-some Hz). Related discussions can be found on several famous OB threads here, about swings... Compared to box speakers, light and flimsy are the nature of OB. After trials and errors, I found soft supports or suspended is better than rigid mounting.
As to the bigger central one, the push-pull pair of woofers are mechanically connected by those short studs, which effectively cancel the force of cones' motions and largely suppress the major source of vibration. Panels at other parts are facing the sound pressure, causing only very slight vibration when playing loud (not enclosed as a box, so the pressure is low). As a sub for under 80Hz, I don't worry too much about that. Those panels are not large enough to resonate in that range of frequency.
I did think of adding braces when planning. Got lazy eventually. When finished, I found it's OK. Just luck
Uh, the space for speaker's positioning is really limited. They have to stay there, more or less.
And yes, the pine board is for musical instrument, not speaker, LOL !! For that, I did something to make them not so 'musical', hehe...
Firstly, the mid array baffle is narrow, with not much plain surface to resonate. The lower part is braced with the stand. And those midrange drivers work leisurely, don't excite the baffle too much.
And the 2 smaller bass units on left/right are braced at the rear side, not shown in the photos. They are small related to the driver's size, too. An interesting trick is applied under them. They are supported at the center of gravity, and maintained upright by very soft springs or foam blocks near front/rear edges, thus a fore-aft metronome. Push it slightly, it'd rock slowly back and forth with frquency under 1Hz.
Such soft feet make them very calm when playing. Not as dead still as the fully suspended swings I've tried, but this is much easier to make. For the limited working bandwith, it's a compromise I can take (these are working under 200-some Hz). Related discussions can be found on several famous OB threads here, about swings... Compared to box speakers, light and flimsy are the nature of OB. After trials and errors, I found soft supports or suspended is better than rigid mounting.
As to the bigger central one, the push-pull pair of woofers are mechanically connected by those short studs, which effectively cancel the force of cones' motions and largely suppress the major source of vibration. Panels at other parts are facing the sound pressure, causing only very slight vibration when playing loud (not enclosed as a box, so the pressure is low). As a sub for under 80Hz, I don't worry too much about that. Those panels are not large enough to resonate in that range of frequency.
I did think of adding braces when planning. Got lazy eventually. When finished, I found it's OK. Just luck
Hi, long time no see. Here are my recent works for bass units of the 3-channel system.
All 3 are slot-loaded, with 18" woofers. The central one has 2 drivers and arranged as push-pull. It's actually more like a pair of face-to-face shallow U-frames. That's for adapting the very-close-to-the-rear-wall positioning (for practical reason, no other option for the central sub). The rear lobe of the dipole is, I guess, more or less splited in 2 and becoming side-firing.
On the left side, the smaller baffle is more like an ordinary OB (shallow U-frame), just with a slot shape baffle hole and rear mounted driver.
(the taller one is fiddled mid array, the lower 'slot' type hole on it is not for loading but dispersion and, simply maintaining the strength of the slim baffle)
On the right, it was originally used at center which I posted here. This unit was later modded to have a cardoid response, well, sort of. (The trick is simply a cardboard with some punched holes at the back. ) So, why difference between the left and right? The space itself is asymmetry, I need more bass energy at the emptier right side. More output of the cardiod could be good.
Overall view with the whole system:
These 3 bass units are wired as Linear Matrix. The new build is partially for the matrix which tends to be center-heavy. So I need more output at the center for such character...
You have motivated me
I have just placed an order for 12 x 10" woofers and 4 x 15" woofers
Hi,
Glad to hear (see) that. Good luck to your new projects. And please keep us updated.
Last but not least, (I've mentioned here somewhere) about the area of slot opening, in the original NP's article, it's about 30% of Sd (sum of all woofers, of course). In my experiences, you might want to do some experiments with your own drivers and baffle before you fix everthing. I took 40-some % of Sd eventually. YMMV
Glad to hear (see) that. Good luck to your new projects. And please keep us updated.
Last but not least, (I've mentioned here somewhere) about the area of slot opening, in the original NP's article, it's about 30% of Sd (sum of all woofers, of course). In my experiences, you might want to do some experiments with your own drivers and baffle before you fix everthing. I took 40-some % of Sd eventually. YMMV
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