Good foil capacitor could costs several hundred, trafo a thousand or more.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/solid-state/134504-krells-sustained-plateau-sliding-bias.html
some silly data points-
I have a little family of amplifiers and they all sound different to me
Speakers are Magnepan 1.6QRs
My main amplifier to drive them is a Threshold S/500. Plenty of power from this old monster.
I recently bought a B&K ST-140 to use in my second system (KEF speakers). On a whim, I decided to compare it to the S/500. On the Magnepans, the B&K did sound warmer and more "tubey" than the S/500. Some people would definitely prefer this type of experience and I did at first. However, repeated listening started to show this as a coloration since it was evident on every recording.
I took a look at the schematic and noticed the big 47uF input capacitor. I replaced this with a like-value Elna Silmic II. While I was in there, I also replaced a few of the aged smaller power supply capacitors.
A second listen and suddenly the "big warm" sound was gone. The amplifier was now more "neutral" and came much closer to the S/500.
In the past I've heard differences between capacitors, tubes (same family, different manufacturers), power supplies (regulated vs. unregulated), amplifiers, preamps and even different topologies. I'm also sure that many of these differences could actually be measured if one knew what to look for.
As far as placebo goes - I did not have an "invested" interest in any of the DIY changes I've made. Heck, I've blown time and money on series regulators, only to scrap them because I didn't like the change. I've spent money on more expensive capacitors, only to prefer the Sprague Orange Drops!
I have a little family of amplifiers and they all sound different to me
Speakers are Magnepan 1.6QRs
My main amplifier to drive them is a Threshold S/500. Plenty of power from this old monster.
I recently bought a B&K ST-140 to use in my second system (KEF speakers). On a whim, I decided to compare it to the S/500. On the Magnepans, the B&K did sound warmer and more "tubey" than the S/500. Some people would definitely prefer this type of experience and I did at first. However, repeated listening started to show this as a coloration since it was evident on every recording.
I took a look at the schematic and noticed the big 47uF input capacitor. I replaced this with a like-value Elna Silmic II. While I was in there, I also replaced a few of the aged smaller power supply capacitors.
A second listen and suddenly the "big warm" sound was gone. The amplifier was now more "neutral" and came much closer to the S/500.
In the past I've heard differences between capacitors, tubes (same family, different manufacturers), power supplies (regulated vs. unregulated), amplifiers, preamps and even different topologies. I'm also sure that many of these differences could actually be measured if one knew what to look for.
As far as placebo goes - I did not have an "invested" interest in any of the DIY changes I've made. Heck, I've blown time and money on series regulators, only to scrap them because I didn't like the change. I've spent money on more expensive capacitors, only to prefer the Sprague Orange Drops!
I hate to say it, but that still leaves a potential market of 2/3d of a Million customers.
It is not if we are talking about brands like Macintosh, Krell, Conrad Jhonson etc.
Moreover some advanced insturments like Teac VRDS or Wadia upsampling algoritm in sound processor just out of DIYers scope.
We got nicely HiEnd sounding OPAMP ICs that cost several dollars, its a big advantage, but does not mean real HiEnd gone.
Moreover some advanced insturments like Teac VRDS or Wadia upsampling algoritm in sound processor just out of DIYers scope.
We got nicely HiEnd sounding OPAMP ICs that cost several dollars, its a big advantage, but does not mean real HiEnd gone.
I like that one
Now I will give you a free poormans upgrade to your system.
While sitting in your most favorite listening position, take both hands, one to each ear. Now push the back of the ear (between head and ear) forward a bit until your hear a difference. The results are dramatic, the highs are released, the mids become clearer and it gives your system new life.
No charge.
Heck, just tilt your head forward so your chin is resting on your chest. One of our upright ape hearing abilities, likely to allow us to hear the tightening of claws on tree limb before large cat body launch, will aso allow you to hear more high frequencies than if your head is positioned in the "alert" / "awake" position.
Bud
Bud
I don't think anyone is really saying that high end audio is stagnant, far from it, you've got engineers designing things and always the reason for making something new is to better what you made before - after all that's how our civilisation has managed to progress - that and the need for survival, be it better guns or a better product to keep you in business.
I think there are plenty of engineers in high end audio trying to be innovative in coming up with new ways to try and solve old problems. The trouble is that those problems have usually been solved many times already, so breakthroughs aren't likely to happen. This is why manufacturers spend lots of time trying to improve upon what could really be considered inconsequential things, such as what resistor should I use? Or lets go remaking this with different caps.
Of course when new technology comes in, many things can change and there's lots of room for improvement. The trouble is that the new technology is never really created with more then a passing thought towards high end audio. So a lot of the time you'll be waiting on something new and more powerful that the computer geeks have come up with. Then there's a 'oh' moment when the high end audio engineer realises what he could do with it.
The trouble nowadays is that all these new inventions are highly integrated microchips, where the big improvements come with the release of a new chip, the surrounding components are more focussed on making the chip work, rather then on how it works. Thus there's less room for improvement by an independent designer then there once was.
I don't really mind, integrated solutions are easier to work with, and unless you have some sort of prejudice towards them, they will get you where you want to be a lot faster and no doubt more cost effectively then if they weren't there.
I think there are plenty of engineers in high end audio trying to be innovative in coming up with new ways to try and solve old problems. The trouble is that those problems have usually been solved many times already, so breakthroughs aren't likely to happen. This is why manufacturers spend lots of time trying to improve upon what could really be considered inconsequential things, such as what resistor should I use? Or lets go remaking this with different caps.
Of course when new technology comes in, many things can change and there's lots of room for improvement. The trouble is that the new technology is never really created with more then a passing thought towards high end audio. So a lot of the time you'll be waiting on something new and more powerful that the computer geeks have come up with. Then there's a 'oh' moment when the high end audio engineer realises what he could do with it.
The trouble nowadays is that all these new inventions are highly integrated microchips, where the big improvements come with the release of a new chip, the surrounding components are more focussed on making the chip work, rather then on how it works. Thus there's less room for improvement by an independent designer then there once was.
I don't really mind, integrated solutions are easier to work with, and unless you have some sort of prejudice towards them, they will get you where you want to be a lot faster and no doubt more cost effectively then if they weren't there.
All these changes or differences might be categorized as deviating from the ideal ( A "sterile" super low distortion unit). The "tubey" or "big warm" sound is in fact an error in reproduction. "Effect box" is quite accurate to describe such errors. I agree differences do exist , but to spend $1000's for carefully engineered errors is absurd. Wax in the ears is cheaper than high end.
Here is an overview - Capacitor distortion overview
Some caps are not (less) desirable , this can be measured/studied. The differences between devices of merit
(metalized poly or "audiophool caps") is so small that it can be dismissed. If anything ,the "voodoo cap" is adding parasitics to the audio chain.One might look to the power supply , OPS damping factor , or THD harmonics/IM products as more valid reasons for "They all sound different to me" effect.
OS
A Rolex watch in its time was the edge of technology. A cheap $5-00 Chinese watch today outstrips it in technology, functionality and time keeping. However a Rolex remains a sought after item.
Those with Rolexes perceive that they make a statement of having the best time pieces, those who have $ 5-00 Chinese watches perceive nothing, however they actually have better time pieces, but would love to own a Rolex instead.
I believe this is true for any luxury item, including high end audio, it is a statement of I can afford and if it is expensive we can use a lot more adjectives to explain why it sounds the way it does.
I just happen to hear a XBOX play a song that I enjoy in a youngsters flat, it blew me away, his XBOX cost less than one of my tweeters. I previously perceived it as junk/toys for kids wanting to play arcade games.
Those with Rolexes perceive that they make a statement of having the best time pieces, those who have $ 5-00 Chinese watches perceive nothing, however they actually have better time pieces, but would love to own a Rolex instead.
I believe this is true for any luxury item, including high end audio, it is a statement of I can afford and if it is expensive we can use a lot more adjectives to explain why it sounds the way it does.
I just happen to hear a XBOX play a song that I enjoy in a youngsters flat, it blew me away, his XBOX cost less than one of my tweeters. I previously perceived it as junk/toys for kids wanting to play arcade games.
10K$,50K$,100K$ or more for a single piece of `hi end` equipment ,WOW
For significantly less of this great money I can order live performance of my Top class favorite domestic bands, orchestras,musician & singers ,to play directly in my listening room,only for my ears,24/7 for a weeks in advance.
Best Regards Folks
For significantly less of this great money I can order live performance of my Top class favorite domestic bands, orchestras,musician & singers ,to play directly in my listening room,only for my ears,24/7 for a weeks in advance.
Best Regards Folks
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Advantage of an expensive box is not having to tell the band to Fock Uff every night.
10K$,50K$,100K$ or more for a single piece of `hi end` equipment ,WOW
For significantly less of this great money I can order live performance of my Top class favorite domestic bands, orchestras,musician & singers ,to play directly in my listening room,only for my ears,24/7 for a weeks in advance.
Best Regards Folks
Only one way to describe this reasoning ... more "high end" (below).
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
or this:
250,000 euros for the john and 20K for the amp !! all this while most of us have to make due with porcelain. and aluminum.
With the lack of any advancements in engineering , the only thing left is general build quality , voodoo , and perceived value (image).
I do like the amp (Vitus ss-050 - impressive build quality), I even found a schema ..
$26,000 for a overbiased lateral OPS ... geeeezz OS
Are you sure? I mean really, really sure? Think before you answer.
Part 2 of the question: Reproduction of what?
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