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Safety Practices, General and Ultra-High Voltage
Safety Practices, General and Ultra-High Voltage
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Old 2nd October 2019, 11:39 PM   #401
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gideon1990 View Post
Nice scope and sticker, the only thing better is one straight from the philips labs.

I have seen your work before Lampie519 and I'm still amazed by the things you make. It also seems like it is cheaper than transformers?

On the HV safety aspect: I shocked myself last week with 400 uF at 380 V because I forgot to put in bleeder resistors. Do yourself a favour and put in those damn bleeders
Aiiiii that hurts.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 11:42 PM   #402
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lampie519 View Post
I also use resonant power supplies with many of my amps and D/A converters. No need for regulators indeed.
I have also such kind of scope, old, but do well, electronics stay fine plastic case do fall apart.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 11:43 PM   #403
nigelwright7557 is offline nigelwright7557  United Kingdom
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I always add a bleeder resistor with an LED in series so I can see if the amp is still charged.

I remember my first valve pre amp build. I built it up and it didn't work so I turned it off and touched the circuit and got a huge shock. My tutor said I had to discharge the smoothing cap. So next time I shorted out smoothing cap with a resistor. I touch circuit and got a huge shock again, I had forgot to turn it off !

Amazingly, I am now 63 but much more careful.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 11:45 PM   #404
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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That is quite smart, now I am convinced that where is hair, there is al lot less intelligence.
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Old 2nd October 2019, 11:49 PM   #405
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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For me, I do class d and hybrid amps, I am busy now with smps design, these are really dangerous, so your idea of a led, I do put it in, even in the total pcb for the smps, do I see a red light, I do not touch.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 12:39 AM   #406
nigelwright7557 is offline nigelwright7557  United Kingdom
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Some of my early SMPS designs were a bit touchy and I occasionally had exploding mosfets flying around the room. I used to turn it on from behind a chair to shield me from flying mosfets. What I did in the end was an overcurrent detect circuit on the mosfets.

I used a PIC micro to do the LLC frequencies and this had an input pin for over current detect. I also had an LED output to show if there was an overload. If the PIC detected overload it immediately turned everything off.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 12:59 AM   #407
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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We have a lot of smps controllers, and when do it right and use a isolation transfrormer things go right, deadtimes are the most underestimated errors.

slowly set voltage up helps, use of a pic is is not suitable for everywhone, need to program.

I have some parts, fase shift controllers and resonant, and is a NC1365.

regards.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 01:09 AM   #408
nigelwright7557 is offline nigelwright7557  United Kingdom
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I was a PIC consultant for 13 years so have used them extensively. The program is pretty simple. It just looks at feedback signal. If the feedback is low it decreases LLC frequency. If the feedback is high it increases LLC frequency. If it sees a over load it turns off IR2113 and puts on over load LED. Must be less than 200 lines.
Code:
		#include p16f506.inc
		LIST	R=DEC
;		LIST

;----- CONFIG Options --------------------------------------------------
;_OSC_LP              EQU  H'0FF8'    ; LP oscillator and 18 ms DRT
;_LP_OSC              EQU  H'0FF8'    ; LP oscillator and 18 ms DRT
;_OSC_XT              EQU  H'0FF9'    ; XT oscillator and 18 ms DRT
;_XT_OSC              EQU  H'0FF9'    ; XT oscillator and 18 ms DRT
;_OSC_HS              EQU  H'0FFA'    ; HS oscillator and 18 ms DRT
;_HS_OSC              EQU  H'0FFA'    ; HS oscillator and 18 ms DRT
;_OSC_EC              EQU  H'0FFB'    ; EC Osc With RB4 and 1.125 ms DRT
;_EC_OSC              EQU  H'0FFB'    ; EC Osc With RB4 and 1.125 ms DRT
;_OSC_IntRC_RB4EN     EQU  H'0FFC'    ; INTRC With RB4 and 1.125 ms DRT
;_IntRC_OSC_RB4EN     EQU  H'0FFC'    ; INTRC With RB4 and 1.125 ms DRT
;_OSC_IntRC_CLKOUTEN  EQU  H'0FFD'    ; INTRC With CLKOUT and 1.125 ms DRT
;_IntRC_OSC_CLKOUTEN  EQU  H'0FFD'    ; INTRC With CLKOUT and 1.125 ms DRT
;_OSC_ExtRC_RB4EN     EQU  H'0FFE'    ; EXTRC With RB4 and 1.125 ms DRT
;_ExtRC_OSC_RB4EN     EQU  H'0FFE'    ; EXTRC With RB4 and 1.125 ms DRT
;_OSC_ExtRC_CLKOUTEN  EQU  H'0FFF'    ; EXTRC With CLKOUT and 1.125 ms DRT
;_ExtRC_OSC_CLKOUTEN  EQU  H'0FFF'    ; EXTRC With CLKOUT and 1.125 ms DRT

;_WDT_OFF             EQU  H'0FF7'    ; WDT disabled
;_WDT_ON              EQU  H'0FFF'    ; WDT enabled

;_CP_ON               EQU  H'0FEF'    ; Code protection on
;_CP_OFF              EQU  H'0FFF'    ; Code protection off

;_MCLRE_OFF           EQU  H'0FDF'    ; RB3/MCLR pin functions as RB3, MCLR tied internally to VDD
;_MCLRE_ON            EQU  H'0FFF'    ; RB3/MCLR pin functions as MCLR

;_IOSCFS_OFF          EQU  H'0FBF'    ; 4 MHz INTOSC Speed
;_IOSCFS_ON           EQU  H'0FFF'    ; 8 MHz INTOSC Speed


;20MHZ
	__CONFIG  _MCLRE_OFF &  _WDT_ON & _CP_OFF & _OSC_HS	

;*****************************************
;SUBWF FLAGS
;IF W > MEM THEN NC
;IF W = MEM THEN C
;IF W < MEM THEN C
;IF W<= MEM THEN C

;IF MEM>=W THEN C
;IF MEM<W THEN NC
;*****************************************
	#DEFINE SET0 1
	#DEFINE SET1 2
	#DEFINE SET2 4
	#DEFINE SET3 8
	#DEFINE SET4 16
	#DEFINE SET5 32
	#DEFINE SET6 64
	#DEFINE SET7 128

	#DEFINE LED PORTB,0
	#DEFINE OPTOINPUT PORTB,1
	#DEFINE NOTOVERCURRENT PORTB,2

;PORTC = GATES

FIRSTRAM	EQU	0XD	;16F506 RAM START ADDRESS

;10H TO 1FH IN BANK 0
	CBLOCK	FIRSTRAM
TEMP
TEMP1
TEMP2
TEMPL
TEMPM
PULSES
	ENDC

	ORG	0
	INCLUDE MACRO.ASM
	CLRWDT
	CLRF	FSR		;BANK 0 RAM

	MOVWF	OSCCAL	;SET UP OSC FREQ ACCURATELY

	MOVLW	0X30	;A2D ALL OFF
	MOVWF	ADCON0

	CLRF	PORTC ;ALL MOSFETS OFF
	MOVLW	0
	TRIS	PORTC

	CLRF	PORTB		;LED OFF
	MOVLW	SET1+SET2	; OPTO AND NOTOVERCURRENT ARE INPUTS
	TRIS	PORTB

	MOVLW	0X41	;COMPARATORS OFF
	MOVWF	CM1CON0
	MOVWF	CM2CON0

	CLRF	VRCON

	MOVLW	0XC0	;DISABLE WEAK PULL UPS ON PORTB
	OPTION

;WAIT 4 SECS TO LET POWER SUPPLY CAPS CHARGE UP
	MOVLW	4
	CALL	WAITWSECONDS

;**********
;SOFT START
;**********
RESTART
	MOVLW	0
	MOVWF	TEMPL
	MOVLW	20		;20ms
	MOVWF	TEMPM

SOFTSTART	;166KHz 30 cycle loop

	MOVLW	1
	CLRF	PORTC	;DEADTIME
	NOP				;DEADTIME
	MOVWF	PORTC
					;HAVE TO IGNORE OVER CURRENT HERE as s/c to start with
	CLRWDT
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	MOVLW	2
	CLRF	PORTC	;DEADTIME
	NOP				;DEADTIME
	MOVWF	PORTC
;;;;;;;;
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	DECFSZ	TEMPL,F
	GOTO	SOFTSTART

	DECFSZ	TEMPM,F
	GOTO	SOFTSTART

;*************************************************
;based on 30uh leakage inductance Lr, Lm =155uH and 200nf Cr
;*************************************************
ON	BSF	LED	;POWERED UP OK

MLOOP
	BTFSC	OPTOINPUT
	GOTO	SLOWCLOCK	;GO IF OPTO HIGH (VOLTS TOO LOW)
;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;
;FASTCLOCK
;  166KHZ 2 * 15 CYCLE LOOP
FASTCLOCK
	CLRF	PORTC	;DEADTIME
	MOVLW	1		;DEADTIME
	MOVWF	PORTC
;;;;;;;;;;;;
	CLRWDT			;LET SETTLE 800ns
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	CLRF	PORTC	;DEADTIME
	MOVLW	2		;DEADTIME
	MOVWF	PORTC
;;;;;;;;;;;;
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	GOTO	MLOOP
;*************************
;125KHZ 2* 20 CYCLE LOOP
SLOWCLOCK
	CLRF	PORTC	;DEADTIME
	MOVLW	1		;DEADTIME
	MOVWF	PORTC
;;;;;;;;;;;;
	CLRWDT			;LET SETTLE 800nS
	NOP
	NOP			
	NOP
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	BTFSS	NOTOVERCURRENT	;GO IF OVER CURRENT
	GOTO	BROKEN			
	NOP
	CLRF	PORTC	;DEADTIME
	MOVLW	2		;DEADTIME
	MOVWF	PORTC

;;;;;;;;;;;;
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	GOTO	MLOOP
;************************
;SLOW FLASH LED
BROKEN	CLRF	PORTC	;MOSFETS OFF
	BSF	LED
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	BCF	LED
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	GOTO	BROKEN
;******************************************
;FAST FLASH LED
BROKENSOFT	CLRF	PORTC	;MOSFETS OFF
	BSF	LED
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	BCF	LED
	CALL	WAIT250MS
	GOTO	BROKENSOFT
;******************************************
;63 max input
WAITWSECONDS	MOVWF	TEMP2
	CLRC
	RLF	TEMP2,F	;*2
	RLF	TEMP2,W	;*4

	GOTO	SECS

WAIT1SECOND
	
	MOVLW	4
SECS	MOVWF	TEMP2
L3
	MOVLW	250			;250MS LOOP
	MOVWF	TEMP1
L2
	MOVLW	250	;1 MS LOOP
	MOVWF	TEMP
L1	CLRWDT	;10 CYCLE LOOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	DECFSZ	TEMP,F
	GOTO	L1

	DECFSZ	TEMP1,F
	GOTO	L2

	DECFSZ	TEMP2,F
	GOTO	L3
	RETLW	0
;************************************
WAIT1MS	MOVLW	250
	MOVWF	TEMP
W1M	CLRWDT		;20 CYCLE LOOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	NOP
	DECFSZ	TEMP,F
	GOTO	W1M
	RETLW	0
;***********************************
WAIT250MS	MOVLW	250
	MOVWF	TEMP2
W2M	CALL	WAIT1MS
	DECFSZ	TEMP2,F
	GOTO	W2M
	RETLW	0
;*************************************	
WAIT50MS	MOVLW	50
	MOVWF	TEMP2
W2M50	CALL	WAIT1MS
	DECFSZ	TEMP2,F
	GOTO	W2M50
	RETLW	0
;*************************************
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Old 3rd October 2019, 10:22 AM   #409
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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Thanks nigelwright, is program free? I will test it just curious what it does, I have a while ago search a program for a smps mig welder, I did now put in a big transformer, but smps is mucho better, maybe you now a solution, I think even this program because it has feedback is usable, I need then a very stable and clean supply for the pic, otherwise with welding spikes can kill it or disturb program whit desastreus consequenses for the smps itselfs, I have programmers for most of these chips.

Driving the mosfets needs then a couple of transistors in totempole and a driver transformer, because these pic has not enough current and are not designed for that.

In principle you do jus emulate a normal chip and have now own control, completely, I do see also other chips who are be used I have somewhere a program for that who do mig for example, on a atmegachip. I do find pic more easy.

I have to look at the transformer, because the primairy is quite low in induction, and I need to fill the coilformer, winding these need some experience.

As programming concerns, I can not do that, never learning that, and not so easy as I get older, now almost 63.

But I did undo hasp dongles in past and even everkey, so the NOP I see in your programs is much used that day But times a changed, it is not interesting anymore to play with that, and it is years ago.

thanks for the info,
kees
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Last edited by kees52; 3rd October 2019 at 10:30 AM.
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Old 3rd October 2019, 10:37 AM   #410
kees52 is offline kees52  Netherlands
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Is that pcb program from you? I go download the demo and look at it, because eagle is not interesting anymore I do not like that internet thing in it.

regards
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