737 Max

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737 max might prove self drive is not the best idea. How can it anticipate new road problems like a pot hole? Assisted driving would be helpful. If my car told me to be careful and brake if I got it wrong that would be helpful. Not drastic braking. Just some assistance. Whilst abs isn't absolutely necessary it is useful. Volvo at low cost adapted abs to be an ice driving aid. It progressively shut the engine down. Nasty engine sound would say be careful. Inexperienced drivers found it very reassuring. They could do very good lap times on an iced up lake. A rally driver set the target with the system switched off.

For a patched together aircraft 737 looks well proportioned. Such a shame they lost the gamble.
 
Think about how many lives self driving cars will save. But people still object to them.

Mr Musk has recently gone on record as promoting a near term future world with ubiquitous fleet of robo-taxis with no steering wheels or control pedals of any kind - sorry Elon, while I quite like the extended cruise control of our Subaru Eyesight - false lane departure warnings in construction zones notwithstanding - but that idea scares the bejesus out of me.
 
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I remember something like that was mentioned much earlier in this thread in connection with the flight that was saved due to a third pilot being present ie the manual trim wheels required the force of two men to turn which was not reflected in the simulator where one guy could use them easily.

I'm not digging it out again though...

Almost. That was the flight the day before the crash. The 3rd man leaned forward and disengaged the autopilot which ended the emergency. That was something the crew on the crashed flight didn't think about. Or at least didn't attempt.

The line between business as usual and a fatal crash is extremely thin.

Jan
 
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Mr Musk has recently gone on record as promoting a near term future world with ubiquitous fleet of robo-taxis with no steering wheels or control pedals of any kind - sorry Elon, while I quite like the extended cruise control of our Subaru Eyesight - false lane departure warnings in construction zones notwithstanding - but that idea scares the bejesus out of me.

Absolutely... I can see motorway "road trains" as a viable possibility, as long all the vehicles are autonomous and linked, but real world driverless stuff is a long way off.
I spent a chunk of last week watching a maker of driverless, slow moving electric pods trying and failing to get one to work on a single track road that went through woodland - frequently losing gnss lock and mis identifying bushes at the roadside...
 
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A long way off is tomorrow. Dont know what kind of car that was but google has already started a driverless service in Arizona. There cars have put on over 20 million miles on real roads in real cities. Even if they prevent 80% of crashes they will save 30,000 lives a year just in the US!

Waymo – Waymo

And there saftey report.
https://storage.googleapis.com/sdc-prod/v1/safety-report/Safety Report 2018.pdf

Maybe on wide, straight, flat roads.... But that's not 99% of the world.
Can they spot and avoid wheel destroying potholes? Nope... Cope with single track roads where you have to reverse and avoid kerbs and soft verges? Nope. Cope with situations where you have to reverse out of a problem? Nope. Cope with gnss holes? Nope. Blizzards and heavy rain that block lidar and radar systems? Nope.
A long, long way from generalised use....
 
Almost. That was the flight the day before the crash. The 3rd man leaned forward and disengaged the autopilot which ended the emergency. That was something the crew on the crashed flight didn't think about. Or at least didn't attempt.


Jan

That sounds odd because switching on the autopilot switches off MCAS but so far I understood switching the autopilot off just starts another round of the MCAS trimming the nose down.
 
In the 737 you retract flaps at 3000 feet, enabling the MCAS and without being aware of MCAS you are testing it for the first time in the flight, at a height where it takes very little time to dive into the ground.
I wonder how redundant the flap position detection is?
Landing is a different matter, there are circumstances with adverse weather where you make flapless landings and these are exactly the landings where a "go around" is likely
 
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