Veganism

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There are no doubt health benefits to a vegan diet so long as you educate yourself. However, it is more a lifestyle choice. "Ethics" play a large role (whatever they are) and someone a few weeks ago equated harming animals and harming people which made a big impression on me at the time. I became vegan for about two weeks! I missed all the animal products and read more about the pros and cons. It seems to me that to many vegans the issues are black and white, over simplistic and I don't think anything is that simple. I am now trying to justify to myself that it's ok to use animal products so long as the harm done is minimal, except I can't know that for sure I can only hope and believe that in the vast majority of cases it is.
 
Let's carry on from here then ;). I'm going to have to google that :) It help you with a particular problem, you aren't on it now?
Forks Over Knives. AKA The China Study Diet. Had high BP, like 147/98. Then deep chest pain - angina. Nearly at the same time my wife was watching this Forks Over Knives | The Film. FOK solved that almost overnight, BP fell like a rock.

I'll post more in a bit.
 
I'm vegan, 'Scott', for primarily ethical reasons. It's not something I go out of my way to discuss in social settings! A challenge in discussing it is that some people are unable to discover that you live differently to them for reasons of ethics without seeing that as a personally-directed condemnation of their own ethical choices. Which is counterproductive even if I was looking to 'convert' them.

I think veganism is largely good for animals, for the planet and potentially good for one's body (with due care, a caveat applicable to any diet). It's sadly all but impossible to avoid contributing to any animal suffering - which I appreciate is also caused by arable farming - but veganism, I hope, prevents contributing to the egregious abuse which indisputably happens in factory farming and industrialized slaughter. I can't speak to every country, but I live in the US, where plainly abusive agribusiness is protected and hidden. Google, for example, 'ag-gag law' if you're not familiar.

I think your step of avoiding e.g. factory farmed meat is very worthwhile for both you and animals. But especially since so many animal-derived foods have opaque supply chains, avoiding factory farming altogether is very difficult while continuing to eat them. I mean, who knows the story of the gelatin(e) in a packet of Fruit Pastilles?

I don't necessarily believe human suffering and animal suffering are equal moral 'bads', but I believe they exist on the same moral scale. I may differ from others on the degree, but I don't believe this is a controversial principle - most jurisdictions have well-supported criminal sanctions for the abuse of domestic animals, for example.

That's a bit of a ramble.
 
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I've been a vegan since 1999 (and a vegetarian since 1981), also for ethical reasons, and I think it's great that a subject like this is discussed on a forum like this. It really has become much better known than a few years ago, back then I regularly had to explain what veganism was. Otherwise I haven't much to add to what Earl Grey wrote.
 
What concerns me is not so much the nature of the food we eat, but the ever increasing consumption of it by an ever increasing number of humans on this planet.

For whatever reason, climate change appears to be with us and is already threatening food production. Just consider the global droughts of 2018. This may be just the beginning!

What we need is new thinking when it comes to the food we eat. Whether or not veganism is a positive way forward is certainly worth discussing.
 
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I was a vegan for 10 years, which was not an easy thing to do in 1980s France. :p I still prefer the vegan diet, and things are sooo much easier now. (I eat fish from time to time).

My reasons were not the typical ethical ones, although those reasons are perfectly fine with me. I just don't like meat - and dairy doesn't agree with me. I know a few younger vegans who do like meat but who don't eat it for ethical reasons. My ethics often surprise them, as I have no special love for cows or pigs (filthy beasts!).

Over the past 40 years just about every vegetarian/vegan joke and insult has been aimed at me. I've heard them too many times. I just nod and usually say "funny, never heard that one before." But no regrets, none at all. Choosing to live a fundamentally different lifestyle ultimately has its rewards. It changes your perspective and forces you to understand that not everyone sees the world in the same way - and shows you that many people never realize that there are other ways to live or view the world.
 
Thanks for the posts so far, this is exactly the kind of discussion I was hoping for. I mentioned being interested in the philosophy, I have a kind of philosophical question (someone will probably tell me it isn't ;) )

Here goes: Many animals wouldn't exist at all if they hadn't been bred in order to provide something for us. Would it have been better if they had never existed in the first place?

Very general and simplistic I know, but, for example, a lamb, it has a short life but, not a bad one....
 
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