I have a total of four 3 cubic foot sealed enclosures that house two 10" drivers each. The current drivers are hand made and I don't have specifications for them. They were built for SQ. The enclosures are 1" thick and crazy strong.
I have two INuke 1000 for each array of two boxes and a MiniDSP feeding them. They sound pretty good now but I would like them to go a bit deeper and still be able to shake the house with a Basshead track or two.
I know that sub drivers have come a long way in the last few years and I am wondering if someone here has a recommendation for a driver that would really make a difference?
TIA,
Vince
I have two INuke 1000 for each array of two boxes and a MiniDSP feeding them. They sound pretty good now but I would like them to go a bit deeper and still be able to shake the house with a Basshead track or two.
I know that sub drivers have come a long way in the last few years and I am wondering if someone here has a recommendation for a driver that would really make a difference?
TIA,
Vince
You can try boxsim or winIsd to add the dimensions of this enclosure an throw a few hundred drivers specs at them until you're satisfied, another way is to use DATS and measure the actual drivers and see if any available drivers have the same specs.
Either way you probably want to design a new enclosures with these drivers (if you measure them with DATS) or design new enclosures with new drivers.
Either way you probably want to design a new enclosures with these drivers (if you measure them with DATS) or design new enclosures with new drivers.
Here are some other key things to consider:
1. how high in frequency do you need the subs to play? E.g. what crossover point will you use?
2. How important is max SPL, e.g. the sensitivity of the driver?
3. How important is frequency extension, e.g. how low the go before rolling off?
These things involve some tradeoffs. For example, if you get the longest stroke 10" sub it will be able to move a lot of air (on paper) but might need even more power than your iNuke amp (horribly overrated in terms of actual power output) can deliver. Such a sub may have high inductance, and so it may not be able to play much above 150Hz before rolling off. This varies from model to model, however.
If higher sensitivity is your goal, so the sub will play louder within its passband you would likely look for more of a high SQ woofer than a sub. You can still get good extension, but it is not one of those drivers with 20mm Xmax. Maybe 10-12mm, and since you have four of them it might be fine in terms of total output, and you might enjoy them more.
The suggestion by USRFobiwan to use a box modeler to model the response of potential drivers in your boxes is a very good one. I like to use Unibox for this purpose, because it's free and it allows me to model the rolloff due to v.c. inductance. You can download it from my software page via link in my sig. The only thing that is not obvious with this program is that the power you enter for multiple driver systems is the power applied to EACH driver, not to the series or parallel (or S-P) connection to all the drivers wired together. You can just model one driver and then add 6dB to get the SPL with four of them each driven by the same amount of power from a separate amp channel.
1. how high in frequency do you need the subs to play? E.g. what crossover point will you use?
2. How important is max SPL, e.g. the sensitivity of the driver?
3. How important is frequency extension, e.g. how low the go before rolling off?
These things involve some tradeoffs. For example, if you get the longest stroke 10" sub it will be able to move a lot of air (on paper) but might need even more power than your iNuke amp (horribly overrated in terms of actual power output) can deliver. Such a sub may have high inductance, and so it may not be able to play much above 150Hz before rolling off. This varies from model to model, however.
If higher sensitivity is your goal, so the sub will play louder within its passband you would likely look for more of a high SQ woofer than a sub. You can still get good extension, but it is not one of those drivers with 20mm Xmax. Maybe 10-12mm, and since you have four of them it might be fine in terms of total output, and you might enjoy them more.
The suggestion by USRFobiwan to use a box modeler to model the response of potential drivers in your boxes is a very good one. I like to use Unibox for this purpose, because it's free and it allows me to model the rolloff due to v.c. inductance. You can download it from my software page via link in my sig. The only thing that is not obvious with this program is that the power you enter for multiple driver systems is the power applied to EACH driver, not to the series or parallel (or S-P) connection to all the drivers wired together. You can just model one driver and then add 6dB to get the SPL with four of them each driven by the same amount of power from a separate amp channel.
Hi compadict
With 3 cu ft = 85 liter per box, I would for sure reccomend changing these to a vented design by installing some decent ports. I would think you can fit some that are long and large enough for a design with 2 tens.
Next I would, as suggested meassure the current drivers T/S parameters. I use Dayton DATS myselv, and it is really easy. Then figure if these can actually be usefull for a vented design fitting in your boxes, by use of WinISD sim tool.
Some will for sure say no, but I think you can get as "tight" bass response from a vented box as from a sealed (it's a bit of religion I think), but a vented box is by fare more efficinet in the low end, and with 6 10 inch drivers, you should quite surely be able to rattle your home.
I would try to go for a tuning of 25 Hz if the river box combination allows for it.
regards Baldin
Maybe post some pictures of the drivers and the boxes?
With 3 cu ft = 85 liter per box, I would for sure reccomend changing these to a vented design by installing some decent ports. I would think you can fit some that are long and large enough for a design with 2 tens.
Next I would, as suggested meassure the current drivers T/S parameters. I use Dayton DATS myselv, and it is really easy. Then figure if these can actually be usefull for a vented design fitting in your boxes, by use of WinISD sim tool.
Some will for sure say no, but I think you can get as "tight" bass response from a vented box as from a sealed (it's a bit of religion I think), but a vented box is by fare more efficinet in the low end, and with 6 10 inch drivers, you should quite surely be able to rattle your home.
I would try to go for a tuning of 25 Hz if the river box combination allows for it.
regards Baldin
Maybe post some pictures of the drivers and the boxes?
cut holes in your existing enclosures and use the drivers you already have, along with these:
Dayton Audio RSS265-PR 10" Aluminum Cone Passive Radiator
(if enclosure large enough, use the 15'' version: 1 in each enclosure should suffice for dual 10's.)
it comes with weights for adjusting the tuning. You'll go from ''loud'' to ''very loud'' and ''low'' to ''very low'' ;-)
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FYI:
just did a 122.7db in-room with a single 8 incher, using a 12'' passive rad. At 30hz.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/312043-max-output-28-35hz-12.html#post5220258
Granted, it's one hell of a 8'', but still. You'll get anywhere between 4 to 6db gain just by adding PRs. That's pretty much what i did in the thread above (taken an existing sealed enclosure, cutting a hole and install a PR...)
Make sure you have 1.8x the Vd, minimum, or put 3x per enclosure for a dual-tens.
just did a 122.7db in-room with a single 8 incher, using a 12'' passive rad. At 30hz.
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/312043-max-output-28-35hz-12.html#post5220258
Granted, it's one hell of a 8'', but still. You'll get anywhere between 4 to 6db gain just by adding PRs. That's pretty much what i did in the thread above (taken an existing sealed enclosure, cutting a hole and install a PR...)
Make sure you have 1.8x the Vd, minimum, or put 3x per enclosure for a dual-tens.
If you like the idea and sound of sealed cabs passive radiators are probably not for you!
The working principle behind PRs is the same as the one behind ported cabs.
The problem often cited with ported speakers is smeared transients and poor group delay due to the air mass in the port taking a finite amount of time to get excited and to stop.
The same problem exists with PRs but the difference is that while the air mass in a port tube is measured in grams the moving mass of a suitably tuned PR is measured in pounds.
To me the only acceptable use of PRs is in tiny desk top speakers where the correct port can easily be larger than the actual cabinet.
The working principle behind PRs is the same as the one behind ported cabs.
The problem often cited with ported speakers is smeared transients and poor group delay due to the air mass in the port taking a finite amount of time to get excited and to stop.
The same problem exists with PRs but the difference is that while the air mass in a port tube is measured in grams the moving mass of a suitably tuned PR is measured in pounds.
To me the only acceptable use of PRs is in tiny desk top speakers where the correct port can easily be larger than the actual cabinet.
I am already using SB34NRX75-6 now and very happy with this.However i now want 2 subwoofers and will build stereo tower subwoofers because bass is not uniform in room.I was planning to buy 1 more piece of SB34NRX75-6 but the box volume seems very large ,about 70 liters internal volume minimum and not well accepted by wife.(She says she accepts it but i am sure she will say they are very big in future)
Now i see this one when you are talking CSS drivers!
Creative Sound Solutions | High End Speakers and Speaker Kits
When i entered parameters to win ISD ,the box volumes are at less than 1 cubic feet!For both CSS 10 and 12 inch drivers.This is 26 liters!
It is unbelievable! I will be very happy if i build slim tower stereo subwoofers with them!
I am planning to cross them at 100-200 hz (for multi use in future.With Woofer assited wideband projects )
I am not sure how much high frequency it can support.I am asking to CSS now.
regards
Now i see this one when you are talking CSS drivers!
Creative Sound Solutions | High End Speakers and Speaker Kits
When i entered parameters to win ISD ,the box volumes are at less than 1 cubic feet!For both CSS 10 and 12 inch drivers.This is 26 liters!
It is unbelievable! I will be very happy if i build slim tower stereo subwoofers with them!
I am planning to cross them at 100-200 hz (for multi use in future.With Woofer assited wideband projects )
I am not sure how much high frequency it can support.I am asking to CSS now.
regards
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