Compound loading 6th order quarterwave "Super Planar" horns and pipes concepts/builds

That is a great idea =D

Application would be live sound, mostly in acoustically difficult locations; therefore the narrow V dispersion is exactly what I'm looking for.

Regardig routering, well, I'm not too inexperienced - BUT: I'd love to 3d-print the waveguide!

Regds
Gerald

Mr GKH ,

Very cool, and Yessir, that sort of HF waveguide would be very helpful for a difficult room ....

I love your idea for 3D-printing the HF waveguide! :yes:

We had a heck of a time searching the web and ebay trying to find the proper vertically sized pre-made HF waveguides for dual 1" drivers ..... We just couldn't find such a thing at the time, at least not for a reasonable price, so that's why he built his own :D
 


...We had a heck of a time searching the web and ebay trying to find the proper vertically sized pre-made HF waveguides for dual 1" drivers ..... We just couldn't find such a thing at the time, at least not for a reasonable price, so that's why he built his own :D

Mr. MMJ,
that's the reason why I'm so interested in this WG. I could never design this by myself.:)
 
Driver chat

Mr GKH,

I am getting some more images together for you that you may find helpful if you plan to custom build a set of these Super Planar Line-Array module designs ...... I will post them here tomorrow for you :)

About the drivers you mentioned:

The Visaton W200S-8 is not a good choice for PA work due to it's low SPL rating and it's low Fs figure ... It is a Hi-Fi driver, not a PA driver, and it would burn up quickly if it were pushed hard enough to produce sufficient SPL in a demanding PA application ......... A better choice that is not too expensive would be something like the Peerless/Tymphany FSL-0818R01-08 driver but ideally something with more Xmax ....... There is also the Faital Pro 8FE200 and the Celestion TF0818 which are both reasonably priced ...... Power handling and Xmax are still limited on those drivers though... There are more capable 8" PA drivers to be found for more money but if you were going to spend THAT much on an 8" driver you might as well step up to 10" drivers or 12" drivers and get a substantial increase in performance......

Unfortunately when it comes to 8" PA drivers I have tried modeling them in these types of cabinets but i didn't really like the results because i found that the 8s just weren't as cost effective (or space effective) as the 12s when you start comparing the cabinet sizes, prices , decibels produced etc ...... Even with twice as many 8" woofers they just could not keep up with the 12s ......

The B&C compression driver that you mentioned looks like it has a nice response curve but the driver may be delicate according to it's specs .... The Faital Pro HF100 is around the same price over here, nice published curve, similar modest power handling ....... Mr V used Dayton DT250P-8 compression drivers and he liked them a lot:) .... The Selenium D220ti is a revered model that isn't very expensive and should be small enough to fit into the tight space where it will be tucked..... The Eminence PSD2002 is of course excellent but is larger in diameter so may not fit ....
 
Hi MMJ,

thank you for this long comment! Well, the Visaton sure is a Hifi driver :), you are absolutely right. The Faital is in a reasonable price range...

Selenium and Dayton are rather problematic to get in my country, unfortunately.

Power handling is not so much my concern as perfect sound and directivity; also decent optics are a major concern as I would like to use such a system in venues like (old) churches and such.
 
Splendid

Ok , that is a great thing :yes:


As far as Eminence goes it looks like the Beta-8A might be a good low-cost candidate for a x2 SUPER PLANAR Line-Array module ...

The Delta-10A looks like a great low-cost candidate for a 10" x2 version ... .

And for a truly impressive and respectable level of output and clarity the KAPPALITE 3012HO should produce some extraordinary results in the 12" x2 version (the cabinet shown in the build photos here was a dual 12" cabinet)..


GKH,
Take a look at the published response curves of all three of those drivers , they have a rising upper midrange response, and this is especially the case with the 10" and 12" drivers mentioned , their extra presence in the 1.5khz to 2.5khz range really helps to bring vocals and vocal clarity to the forefront ........ These drivers will also be somewhat "beamy" up in that range which is like "taking lemons and making lemonade" for us because when mounted in the "toed-in" or "crossfiring" sort of baffle it means that we are spreading that vital upper-midrange energy horizontally somewhat thanks to the 20 degree angle built into the baffle but the vertical dispersion will remain narrow just as you prefer it :cheers:

Also notice that the 10" and 12" mentioned above have a response that drops off like a rock with very sharp nosedive curve above 2.5khz to the 2.8khz-ish range ........ Just imagine how this simplifies your crossover requirements :D

I wish the Beta-8 had response more similar to the others ....The 8 is alright, but if you are willing to step up to using 10" drivers then it would REALLY pay off because it is a substantial jump in performance for only an extra 2" of cabinet height :magnify:


:soapbox::2c:
 
More information

Here is the sketch that J R Vansickle came up with for the high frequency waveguide ....After reviewing and discussing various different options this is what he settled on and ended up building (a dual version of what we see here)....

HF_waveguide_sketch_-edit.jpg
.

and here is a similar design made by someone else

1322224982865_1322225111338_Jimy_Okey.jpg


and here is another (made by someone else)

high_frequency_waveguide_aluminum.jpg


Theory behind their operation

L-_A_HF-_Waveguides.png



GKH , i told you that i had more files for you , these (above) are some of them , i hope they help you in your development ........ I have some more data which pertains more to the cabinet itself , i will post that here in a few minutes ..
 
Wake up to wonderment

Good morning,

that's just great! Thanks :cheers:

GOOD MORNING GKH! :happy2:


and here is some more for you

....
The first is Mr Vansickle's penciled layout on the actual sheet of ply that he built the first line-array module upon



Super_Planar_Line_array_layout1.jpg



Here is just a rough sketch that i produced for him , it is probably not perfectly proportioned but you get the idea ....

Super_Planar_Symmetrical_LA-_MODULES_type_2.png


I used red to draw the path just for explanation purposes ..... Not pretty:warped: :Ohno: but once again you get the idea :tongue:

COMPOUND_LOADED_Symmetrical_LA-_MODULES_type_2_-.png



GKH , keep in mind that if you are using 10" drivers it means you can move the panels at each side of the baffle inward by almost 2" each (sorry for the antiquated imperial measurements :tongue:) .... Moving those panels over means that the last segment of the main path has it's cross sectional area opened up somewhat which shifts the tuning a bit higher and increases the "gain" of the cabinet (with the sacrifice of some extension) and this is PRECISELY what your 10" drivers call for to improve their performance so it all works out! :D
 
reduce the depth to 100mm to make it more ideal for a high-ish crossove point

If I'm not fully wrong, the final dimensions are just perfect for 10" mid-woofs: 272mm high by 132mm deep, width somewhere about 30mm.


GKH ,
Looks like you have the right idea to me! :) You have the depth at 132mm , and as it turns out the waveguide did not need to be so deep........ 4" or around 100mm depth is more appropriate for our goal of solid loading down to 2khz , which is what we were aiming for ....