HI
I just logged in here, and i see the last time i logged in was 18th June, 2004
It's been a decade!
I always liked my Adire Audio Tempest. a 15" subwoofer for home audio.
I have a Dayton Audio SA1000 subwoofer amplifier.
For a 3 cu ft ported box, what would be a nice subwoofer, currently availabe, that would be similar to the Tempest ?
I'm looking for a woofer that likes 500w at 8ohms.
I really appreciate the help and insight
I just logged in here, and i see the last time i logged in was 18th June, 2004
It's been a decade!
I always liked my Adire Audio Tempest. a 15" subwoofer for home audio.
I have a Dayton Audio SA1000 subwoofer amplifier.
For a 3 cu ft ported box, what would be a nice subwoofer, currently availabe, that would be similar to the Tempest ?
I'm looking for a woofer that likes 500w at 8ohms.
I really appreciate the help and insight
Dayton Audio DVC385-88 15" DVC Series Subwoofer
GM
edit: Oops! it's the 'standard' replacement, but doesn't meet your 8 ohm requirement.
GM
edit: Oops! it's the 'standard' replacement, but doesn't meet your 8 ohm requirement.
Last edited:
as GM said the dayton DVC is about as direct a replacement as you can get for the tempest. your amp is 4ohm stable so that's not a problem, but if you have your heart set on 8 ohm configuration, the dayton series II is a viable option.
for a little more money the dayton reference HO and HF's could mate to your amplifier as well, and if memory serves, operate well in fairly small enclosures
for a little more money the dayton reference HO and HF's could mate to your amplifier as well, and if memory serves, operate well in fairly small enclosures
HI. appreciate all this.
I think i may get that Dayton Audio DVC385-88 subwoofer.
the specs say 8ohm and 350watts RMS
But like GM pointed out, it can't even be wired to see a 8ohm Load !
My point, why do manufactuers give specs like that ?
So......... what will the RMS power rating be at 4ohms ? ( what the acutal ohm load will be )
And to say another way...... will the dayton audio SA1000 subwoofer amplifier work ?
Last night got things all connected, the woofer installed..
Tonight will be the first time actually turning on the SA1000
I go slow. Read all the instructions again this morning. The SA1000 instructions and the Alpine SWS-15D4 instructions.
i'm using a Marantz CD player and the coaxial digital out, to a Scott Nixon TubeDac (with its little seperate power supply ) to then a simple Sony 2-channel 100W receiver. Then some JBL speakers i've always liked. LX44s ? or something like that.....
Then the audio signal out to the SA1000 connected to a single SWS-15D4 (in a 3 cu ft ported enclosure
The SWS-15D4 was only $130 shipped from Sonic Electronix
Got the SA1000 from Parts Express for $338
Wired the subwoofer in series, per the sws-15D4 owners manual, so the sub amp sees an 8ohm speaker. so the sub amp will put out 500w then. And the sws-15D4 is rated at 500w RMS.
........If i got the Dayton Audio DVC385-88 then the sub amp would see a 4ohm speaker. so the sub amp would put out 1000w. I may get the DVC385
I wander what kind of difference i'll see. comments ?
I think i may get that Dayton Audio DVC385-88 subwoofer.
the specs say 8ohm and 350watts RMS
But like GM pointed out, it can't even be wired to see a 8ohm Load !
My point, why do manufactuers give specs like that ?
So......... what will the RMS power rating be at 4ohms ? ( what the acutal ohm load will be )
And to say another way...... will the dayton audio SA1000 subwoofer amplifier work ?
Last night got things all connected, the woofer installed..
Tonight will be the first time actually turning on the SA1000
I go slow. Read all the instructions again this morning. The SA1000 instructions and the Alpine SWS-15D4 instructions.
i'm using a Marantz CD player and the coaxial digital out, to a Scott Nixon TubeDac (with its little seperate power supply ) to then a simple Sony 2-channel 100W receiver. Then some JBL speakers i've always liked. LX44s ? or something like that.....
Then the audio signal out to the SA1000 connected to a single SWS-15D4 (in a 3 cu ft ported enclosure
The SWS-15D4 was only $130 shipped from Sonic Electronix
Got the SA1000 from Parts Express for $338
Wired the subwoofer in series, per the sws-15D4 owners manual, so the sub amp sees an 8ohm speaker. so the sub amp will put out 500w then. And the sws-15D4 is rated at 500w RMS.
........If i got the Dayton Audio DVC385-88 then the sub amp would see a 4ohm speaker. so the sub amp would put out 1000w. I may get the DVC385
I wander what kind of difference i'll see. comments ?
Greets!
The 8 ohms/350 W rating is per voice coil [VC], so in theory rated for 700 W in parallel, but 600 w is probably a more realistic rating. All the rest of the specs are with the VC's in parallel.
According to the specs and impedance plot, it's nominally 4 ohms dipping to 3 ohms in its pass-band and your amp is rated 950 W/4 ohms, so there's plenty of peak transient power available if true.
Don't have any experience with any of your equipment, but between 4-8 ohm output, the 4 ohms will heat up the VCs quicker/maintain it longer due to drawing more current, so all else equal, thermal power compression could be more obvious more often, assuming you've ever noticed it [many don't until it gets really excessive] and of course there's the potential for one or more VCs to fail quicker than at 8 ohms.
GM
The 8 ohms/350 W rating is per voice coil [VC], so in theory rated for 700 W in parallel, but 600 w is probably a more realistic rating. All the rest of the specs are with the VC's in parallel.
According to the specs and impedance plot, it's nominally 4 ohms dipping to 3 ohms in its pass-band and your amp is rated 950 W/4 ohms, so there's plenty of peak transient power available if true.
Don't have any experience with any of your equipment, but between 4-8 ohm output, the 4 ohms will heat up the VCs quicker/maintain it longer due to drawing more current, so all else equal, thermal power compression could be more obvious more often, assuming you've ever noticed it [many don't until it gets really excessive] and of course there's the potential for one or more VCs to fail quicker than at 8 ohms.
GM
I like the sub we're talking about, Parts Express part no 295 190
But i just found out about Parts Express part no 295 469
It's the Dayton Audio RSS 390 HO-4
I think this may be the one i get.....
And reading about it in the REVIEWS section below, at the Parts Express website, is just highly impressive.
It's 800w RMS ....4ohms
Is this just a SVC subwoofer ? ...or am i getting confused again?
So the DVC385-88 is 700w RMS ( 4ohms )
And the RSS 390 HO-4 is 800w RMS ( 4ohms )
the DVC385-88 is $145
the RSS390HO-4 is $173
the DVC385-88 requires a 4.74 cu ft ....for vented
the RSS390HO-4 requires only around 2.8 cu ft ....for vented
I currently have a 3.0 cu ft vented enclosure. with a 14" cut out.
The vented box size thing is a big deal, for me.
Therefore, the RSS 390 HO-4 will be the one i get ( in addition to my SWS-15D4
But i just found out about Parts Express part no 295 469
It's the Dayton Audio RSS 390 HO-4
I think this may be the one i get.....
And reading about it in the REVIEWS section below, at the Parts Express website, is just highly impressive.
It's 800w RMS ....4ohms
Is this just a SVC subwoofer ? ...or am i getting confused again?
So the DVC385-88 is 700w RMS ( 4ohms )
And the RSS 390 HO-4 is 800w RMS ( 4ohms )
the DVC385-88 is $145
the RSS390HO-4 is $173
the DVC385-88 requires a 4.74 cu ft ....for vented
the RSS390HO-4 requires only around 2.8 cu ft ....for vented
I currently have a 3.0 cu ft vented enclosure. with a 14" cut out.
The vented box size thing is a big deal, for me.
Therefore, the RSS 390 HO-4 will be the one i get ( in addition to my SWS-15D4
Appreciate the time and help GM and snappyturtle.
I played the sws-15D4 for the first time last night. I used the analog outputs of my Sony stereo receiver to the SA1000. This evidently just gave the SA1000 a constant audio signal of 250mV ( the master volume knob on the Sony does not control these analog outputs i learned ) Then i used the gain knob on the SA1000 to control the volume a bit. Worked Fine. ......but this is ridiculous.
I unboxed my Dodd Audio $450 tube preamp last night too.
Will be using that now....... so from the (source ) cd player (coaxial digital out) to the Scott Nixon TubeDac to the Dodd preamp to then the SA1000 !
..........then i'll use the highpass analog outputs of the SA1000 to send an audio signal to the sony stereo receiver. So the SA1000 will only be 'seeing' decent quality audio equipment. no cheap/crappy Sony receiver.
This is only just a little pet project. I'm just wanting to play a sub.
For a long time had an Adire Audio Tempest in a huge *** vented enclosure created by Mr. Marv..... i don't know if anyone knows who he is. he was popular back in 2003 as a speaker box maker. I drove up to Monterey in person to get it. was 22 years old then. Fun trip.
A few years ago i had to move, and i had to give this tempest and custom box to someone. I've contacted him, btw, to see if i can get it back.
I tried the sws-15D4 and it was fine. But when the low Frequencies were played, it did not HIT like the TEmpest did.....
https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/wan/5237489422.html
I hope that Internet Link Works. ..that's the box i got. drove down to Santa Ana 2 weeks ago.
I have the CD entitled KRONIC BASS. I've basically practically memorized it.
The tracks, like track 6, where i know what Low Frequencies should be making everything shake, just aren't quite as impressive (with the sws=15D4 in this 3 cu ft vented box ) as they were with the Tempest in the old big ported box i had.
I know it would help tremendously if i knew what the size of my old Tempest box was.
I've been doing some research here, and i'm seriously suspecting that it was the big vented box that Adire had at their Website, at the time. ( also known as their 320 Liter vented EBS enclosure )
How many cubic feet is 320L ?
How many cubic feet is 214L ? .....Is 214L about 7.8 cu ft ?
I'm trying to find these diagrams.....
What was the vented box size for the Adire audio Tempest ?
Does the Dayton audio DVC385-88 15" subwoofer have the exact same vented box size specifications ?
I've ordered the Dayton Audio RSS390HO-4 15" subwoofer. It's on its way. I want to see how this will do in this enclosure. The sws-15D4 is 8ohm, the RSS390 is 4ohm.
That might be all i do.
Ideally....... I'd love to order the Dayton Audio DVC385-88 and have a big box to put it in. But i have to find a speaker box maker, and before that, the scematics/ diagram of the box i want
If the RSS390HO-4 is better, ....i'll sell the sws-15D4
I played the sws-15D4 for the first time last night. I used the analog outputs of my Sony stereo receiver to the SA1000. This evidently just gave the SA1000 a constant audio signal of 250mV ( the master volume knob on the Sony does not control these analog outputs i learned ) Then i used the gain knob on the SA1000 to control the volume a bit. Worked Fine. ......but this is ridiculous.
I unboxed my Dodd Audio $450 tube preamp last night too.
Will be using that now....... so from the (source ) cd player (coaxial digital out) to the Scott Nixon TubeDac to the Dodd preamp to then the SA1000 !
..........then i'll use the highpass analog outputs of the SA1000 to send an audio signal to the sony stereo receiver. So the SA1000 will only be 'seeing' decent quality audio equipment. no cheap/crappy Sony receiver.
This is only just a little pet project. I'm just wanting to play a sub.
For a long time had an Adire Audio Tempest in a huge *** vented enclosure created by Mr. Marv..... i don't know if anyone knows who he is. he was popular back in 2003 as a speaker box maker. I drove up to Monterey in person to get it. was 22 years old then. Fun trip.
A few years ago i had to move, and i had to give this tempest and custom box to someone. I've contacted him, btw, to see if i can get it back.
I tried the sws-15D4 and it was fine. But when the low Frequencies were played, it did not HIT like the TEmpest did.....
https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/wan/5237489422.html
I hope that Internet Link Works. ..that's the box i got. drove down to Santa Ana 2 weeks ago.
I have the CD entitled KRONIC BASS. I've basically practically memorized it.
The tracks, like track 6, where i know what Low Frequencies should be making everything shake, just aren't quite as impressive (with the sws=15D4 in this 3 cu ft vented box ) as they were with the Tempest in the old big ported box i had.
I know it would help tremendously if i knew what the size of my old Tempest box was.
I've been doing some research here, and i'm seriously suspecting that it was the big vented box that Adire had at their Website, at the time. ( also known as their 320 Liter vented EBS enclosure )
How many cubic feet is 320L ?
How many cubic feet is 214L ? .....Is 214L about 7.8 cu ft ?
I'm trying to find these diagrams.....
What was the vented box size for the Adire audio Tempest ?
Does the Dayton audio DVC385-88 15" subwoofer have the exact same vented box size specifications ?
I've ordered the Dayton Audio RSS390HO-4 15" subwoofer. It's on its way. I want to see how this will do in this enclosure. The sws-15D4 is 8ohm, the RSS390 is 4ohm.
That might be all i do.
Ideally....... I'd love to order the Dayton Audio DVC385-88 and have a big box to put it in. But i have to find a speaker box maker, and before that, the scematics/ diagram of the box i want
If the RSS390HO-4 is better, ....i'll sell the sws-15D4
You're welcome!
There's a bunch of on-line converters for just about any imaginable conversion, but I prefer this little freeware app for all the common ones: https://joshmadison.com/convert-for-windows/
Tempest EBS alignment was 340 L [12 ft^3] net: http://www.stiger.com/subtable/ventedtempest.pdf
I'm a big fan of EBS alignments and it's TL variants since they 'dig' low to blend with room/boundary gain while emphasizing the mid-bass ['hit'/'slam'/'punch'].
The DVC385 sims audibly the same as the Tempest in its EBS alignment @ 500W, while the RSS comes up at bit short [Tempest green, DVC385 red, Rss390 blue].
GM
There's a bunch of on-line converters for just about any imaginable conversion, but I prefer this little freeware app for all the common ones: https://joshmadison.com/convert-for-windows/
Tempest EBS alignment was 340 L [12 ft^3] net: http://www.stiger.com/subtable/ventedtempest.pdf
I'm a big fan of EBS alignments and it's TL variants since they 'dig' low to blend with room/boundary gain while emphasizing the mid-bass ['hit'/'slam'/'punch'].
The DVC385 sims audibly the same as the Tempest in its EBS alignment @ 500W, while the RSS comes up at bit short [Tempest green, DVC385 red, Rss390 blue].
GM
Attachments
Hi GM
That second HyperLink you did there, is the Exact PDF document that BrianGT, a moderator here, emailed to me this morning.
That's what i was lookin' for!
I recognize the designs immediately. I also did the EBS Design ( There are three basic vented designs for the Tempest - SBB4 EBS and Adire Alignment )
The EBS design is a net 340L cabinet, tuned to 15.8 Hz. It is stuffed with 64 ounces of polyfill. Its external dimensions are 48" x 24" x 24" .....that includes 4" for the legs (it's 48" tall ) ....so without legs, the 48" is really 44"
.....it's a downward firing design. Though i just had mine on its side. No legs.
It is vented with a pair of FP4 four inch flared vent kits with full length cneter tubes. ....Mr Marv actually designed a Slot Port for mine. AND IT SOUNDED BAD ***!
I got a hold of mr marv..... i found him at DIYMA.com - Car Audio Forum & 12 volt Community Board
He emailed me back and said he can build the same box again !
This is one of the happiest days of this Year !!!
His phone is 831 383 0308
His email is mrmarvsplace@yahoo.com
I asked if i could mention him here, and he said sure, and that i could put his number too.
........on a second note, i put the Dodd preamp into the system last night. Much nicer. The Sony stereo receiver is now at the end of the audio signal line, like it should be. The SA1000 and 15" sub now get a top quality signal from the Scott Nixon TubeDac and Dodd preamp with no cheap/crappy sony equipment in the middle.
That second HyperLink you did there, is the Exact PDF document that BrianGT, a moderator here, emailed to me this morning.
That's what i was lookin' for!
I recognize the designs immediately. I also did the EBS Design ( There are three basic vented designs for the Tempest - SBB4 EBS and Adire Alignment )
The EBS design is a net 340L cabinet, tuned to 15.8 Hz. It is stuffed with 64 ounces of polyfill. Its external dimensions are 48" x 24" x 24" .....that includes 4" for the legs (it's 48" tall ) ....so without legs, the 48" is really 44"
.....it's a downward firing design. Though i just had mine on its side. No legs.
It is vented with a pair of FP4 four inch flared vent kits with full length cneter tubes. ....Mr Marv actually designed a Slot Port for mine. AND IT SOUNDED BAD ***!
I got a hold of mr marv..... i found him at DIYMA.com - Car Audio Forum & 12 volt Community Board
He emailed me back and said he can build the same box again !
This is one of the happiest days of this Year !!!
His phone is 831 383 0308
His email is mrmarvsplace@yahoo.com
I asked if i could mention him here, and he said sure, and that i could put his number too.
........on a second note, i put the Dodd preamp into the system last night. Much nicer. The Sony stereo receiver is now at the end of the audio signal line, like it should be. The SA1000 and 15" sub now get a top quality signal from the Scott Nixon TubeDac and Dodd preamp with no cheap/crappy sony equipment in the middle.
What is the total net internal volume in terms of cubic feet.... of the 340L Adire Audio EBS Design vented enclosure (for Tempest ) ?
Brian Steele, it looks like Parts Express is almost out of them too.
Is Parts Express part no 268-352 the identical thing as the FP4 4 inch vent port kits (mentioned in the 2001 Adire Audio Tempest vented box Applications Paper ) ?
The tube length of partsexpress part no 268-352 is 12"
And the overall length is 17"
The EBS design called for ' full length ' center tubes..... ( of the FP4 vent port kit )
What was the overall length of the FP4 vent port kit with full length tubes ?
Brian Steele, it looks like Parts Express is almost out of them too.
Is Parts Express part no 268-352 the identical thing as the FP4 4 inch vent port kits (mentioned in the 2001 Adire Audio Tempest vented box Applications Paper ) ?
The tube length of partsexpress part no 268-352 is 12"
And the overall length is 17"
The EBS design called for ' full length ' center tubes..... ( of the FP4 vent port kit )
What was the overall length of the FP4 vent port kit with full length tubes ?
Hi GM
Very glad to hear the DVC385 sims the same as the Tempest.
I found a guy in my neighborhood, who works with wood, who said he can help construct the Adire Audio Tempest EBS vented enclosure.
He had a baltic burch shelf thing that he had just made right in his garage.
I have the DVC385 coming. the parts express website said there were only 3 left, before i ordered mine.
Ok, so 12 cubic feet is 340L ....or in other words, 44" x 24" x 24" .... 3/4" baltic burch wood
I'm glad you simmed the DVC385 and the RSS390HO-4 and the Adire audio Tempest.
How does the Dayton Audio RSS390HF-4 15" subwoofer sim compared to the DVC385 and Tempest ?
....Because obviously, the RSS390HF-4 is the appropriate sub to compare
.. .And not the RSS390HO-4 ( which is optimized for only a 3 cu ft vented enclosure ) ( unlike the RSS390HF-4 which is optimized for a 9 cu ft vented enclosure )
The plastic ports/vents mentioned in the 2001 Adire Audio Tempest Vented Box Applications Paper mention the FP4 four inch flared vent kits.
I've tried my damnest, and cannot locate these.
Is Parts Express part no 268 352 the same thing ?
The Adire Paper says to use the FP4 kit with ' full length center tubes '
.....What was the overall length of the FP4 kit ? ( i really seriously hope someone does have the answer to this question )
The overall length of the Parts Express Ports is 17"
I wish i the software. ....Basically a 12 cu ft vented enclosure tuned to 15.8 Hz
...with two 4 inch vent ports ....what is the required overall length needed ?
Very glad to hear the DVC385 sims the same as the Tempest.
I found a guy in my neighborhood, who works with wood, who said he can help construct the Adire Audio Tempest EBS vented enclosure.
He had a baltic burch shelf thing that he had just made right in his garage.
I have the DVC385 coming. the parts express website said there were only 3 left, before i ordered mine.
Ok, so 12 cubic feet is 340L ....or in other words, 44" x 24" x 24" .... 3/4" baltic burch wood
I'm glad you simmed the DVC385 and the RSS390HO-4 and the Adire audio Tempest.
How does the Dayton Audio RSS390HF-4 15" subwoofer sim compared to the DVC385 and Tempest ?
....Because obviously, the RSS390HF-4 is the appropriate sub to compare
.. .And not the RSS390HO-4 ( which is optimized for only a 3 cu ft vented enclosure ) ( unlike the RSS390HF-4 which is optimized for a 9 cu ft vented enclosure )
The plastic ports/vents mentioned in the 2001 Adire Audio Tempest Vented Box Applications Paper mention the FP4 four inch flared vent kits.
I've tried my damnest, and cannot locate these.
Is Parts Express part no 268 352 the same thing ?
The Adire Paper says to use the FP4 kit with ' full length center tubes '
.....What was the overall length of the FP4 kit ? ( i really seriously hope someone does have the answer to this question )
The overall length of the Parts Express Ports is 17"
I wish i the software. ....Basically a 12 cu ft vented enclosure tuned to 15.8 Hz
...with two 4 inch vent ports ....what is the required overall length needed ?
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Interesting! I didn't know he was a moderator and haven't noticed him posting since his college days at least a decade ago with his Thor project.
GM
Morning,
Well, it's 12 ft^3 net, i.e. after subtracting out the driver, vents, bracing, which takes up ~0.4512 ft^3, ergo ~352.579 L gross based on internal dims of 22.5" x 22.5" x 42.5".
You're welcome!
Identical except for its lower inductance, which makes for a flatter frequency and phase response. Not many 'free lunches' in audio system design.
No clue, I've never used a vent kit as there was no such option available except for the few kits that included a pre-cut cardboard mailing tube.
Dual 4" i.d. tubes need to be around 17.5" long, but to get a low vent mach requires [4] 4" and the flares of the plastic tube vents I've seen aren't large enough to make up this difference [acoustic diameter = ~4.9" IIRC], so Dan apparently did a bit of fudging by ear and/or an impulse response with stuffing density to under-size them this much.
The way I typically design cabs is to use some form of vented TL alignment [aka MLTL, ML-TQWT, ML-horn in today's parlance depending on its flare factor] that damps the vent enough to reduce its length and negate the need to 'critically' damp the vent in many cases.
IOW, if the cab was divided in half to create an inverse tapered 1/4 WL resonator [ML-TQWT] with the driver at the extreme 'closed' end [bottom] and the vents at the extreme open end [bottom], then the vents could theoretically be a bit larger and maybe even shorter, to offset the lack of flares [5" dia.].
Since a divider brace is already accounted for, the cab's outside dims would theoretically remain the same.
GM
Hmm, this should read:
Identical except for its lower inductance, which makes for a flatter frequency and phase response with the trade-off being ~3-5 dB less peak SPL in its pass-band, so for purely 'sub' woofer duty [<~120 Hz] the Tempest would be my choice of the two. Not many 'free lunches' in audio system design.
GM
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