).Thanks for the reply, I missed it!
I do all kinds of jobs, saturday it's spray off in sydhavn, what jobs are you doing? Would love to hear those subs some day!
Did anyone notice this post below?
It would be nice with a V2 design, like the ss15 V2 that has som cone correction and longer horn path...
It would be nice with a V2 design, like the ss15 V2 that has som cone correction and longer horn path...
Hi Sabbelbacke,
Since the Movic is a 4 Ohm driver and not an 8 Ohm driver, the motor is perhaps not so weak than it looks. A BL value of 22 of an 8 Ohm driver is more or less equal to a BL value of 18 of a 4 Ohm driver.
The Mms of 203 gram of the Mivoc AWX-184 is more than Mms of 182,65 grams of the Oberton 18XB700
The output of a TH18 is limited by the Xmax and in that sense 5mm Xmax can be an argument. On the other hand you will also need more power from the amp to drive an higher Xmax. Up to 400 to 500 watts the Mivoc will have a similar output to 'stronger' drivers.
Pressure is also displacement related! So a 5mm Xmax driver does not run into pressure values of the 'stronger' drivers you are comparing with.
So if it worth the money in reflex-boxes or bandpass designs, I don’t see why it would not be worth the money for a Tapped Horn.
Cheers,
Djim
Interesting festival :0)
I am new in the sound business, so not much work yet. I am looking for amateur bands and non profit jobs where there is room to invest the extra time spend when you have a sound engineer who is new in the business. Not an easy task.
Are you also doing live bands?
Cheers, Andy
@DJM
Thanx for your input.
As I said before - the MIVOC definitely is not a bad driver for the money. I am comparing it to the 15SW155 or the NLW drivers from 18Sound. These have much higher motor-forces. Of course, the MIVOC will "work" in a TH, but where do you draw the line if something works or not. My argument is the following:
having not as much motorpower and a relative soft cone is not that much of an issue in a reflex box as IN THIS TH.
As said before.. we used the MIVOC and the 18S and the B&C in many boxes - my argument about the cone quality and the overall quality of the mivoc is not derived from the datasheet, but from experience with these drivers. That´s where the Oberton jumps in: Yes, it´s MMS is less than the Mivocs, but of course there are many factors not present in a datasheet. The composition of the paper of the cone, the precission the coil is centered, the treatment of the surrounding, the "flappines" when driven with high power levels, etc... all these factors are of higher build-quality in the oberton. (Besides, try to get a recone for the MIVOC - no chance..).
When looking at the complexity of this build, I´d rather go for a more "pro" driver than the MIVOC. It is acutrally a "home" driver. But of course thats my personal opinion.
Also said before: Mivoc states the real geometrical Xmax of the drivers (=(voice coil height - air gap height) / 2), so if using one of the common formulas to derive Xmax (+ 1/4 Hg), the Mivoc could also be seen as a 7 or 8mm xmax driver..
But: If you look at klippel diagrams of drivers, it quickly gets clear that real world berformance of drivers at high levels offen differ from what you could expect when looking at tha datasheet. And that´s where all the arguments are found which are not visible by looking at a datasheet.
For example: If a company is taking extensive care to mount the voice coil exactly inside the center of the gap, optimices the suspension to be symmetrical in both directions, etc... a driver built this carefully will perform better than the "cheap bargain device simply thrown together" with more xmax in the datasheet.
It´s not uncommon to have Coil-offsets of 1 to 2mm in some "cheaper" drivers - reducing actual xmax in reality.
I am not on a mission against the MIVOC driver - we sold many of these and MIVOC has a lot of drivers with a very good performance/price ratio - as the AWX184... BUT there is much better out there and if using this cab for Pro-Sound, I´d spend more money... (if using at home - i´d build another cab - why bother with a TH this size when at home something smaller would work, too)... Just my five cents ..
Thanx for your input.
As I said before - the MIVOC definitely is not a bad driver for the money. I am comparing it to the 15SW155 or the NLW drivers from 18Sound. These have much higher motor-forces. Of course, the MIVOC will "work" in a TH, but where do you draw the line if something works or not. My argument is the following:
having not as much motorpower and a relative soft cone is not that much of an issue in a reflex box as IN THIS TH.
As said before.. we used the MIVOC and the 18S and the B&C in many boxes - my argument about the cone quality and the overall quality of the mivoc is not derived from the datasheet, but from experience with these drivers. That´s where the Oberton jumps in: Yes, it´s MMS is less than the Mivocs, but of course there are many factors not present in a datasheet. The composition of the paper of the cone, the precission the coil is centered, the treatment of the surrounding, the "flappines" when driven with high power levels, etc... all these factors are of higher build-quality in the oberton. (Besides, try to get a recone for the MIVOC - no chance..).
When looking at the complexity of this build, I´d rather go for a more "pro" driver than the MIVOC. It is acutrally a "home" driver. But of course thats my personal opinion.
Also said before: Mivoc states the real geometrical Xmax of the drivers (=(voice coil height - air gap height) / 2), so if using one of the common formulas to derive Xmax (+ 1/4 Hg), the Mivoc could also be seen as a 7 or 8mm xmax driver..
But: If you look at klippel diagrams of drivers, it quickly gets clear that real world berformance of drivers at high levels offen differ from what you could expect when looking at tha datasheet. And that´s where all the arguments are found which are not visible by looking at a datasheet.
For example: If a company is taking extensive care to mount the voice coil exactly inside the center of the gap, optimices the suspension to be symmetrical in both directions, etc... a driver built this carefully will perform better than the "cheap bargain device simply thrown together" with more xmax in the datasheet.
It´s not uncommon to have Coil-offsets of 1 to 2mm in some "cheaper" drivers - reducing actual xmax in reality.
I am not on a mission against the MIVOC driver - we sold many of these and MIVOC has a lot of drivers with a very good performance/price ratio - as the AWX184... BUT there is much better out there and if using this cab for Pro-Sound, I´d spend more money... (if using at home - i´d build another cab - why bother with a TH this size when at home something smaller would work, too)... Just my five cents ..
No comments whatsoever on whats the best version? I see good mods, appart from cone corrction, consider this:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/276742-cone-compensation-test-case-12.html#post4385573
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/subwoofers/276742-cone-compensation-test-case-12.html#post4385573
I am currently testing an Oberton 18XB800 in a TH18 (mdf prototype). First hearing impressions are good.
Setup used is 48/bw hp at 40Hz and 24/bw lp at 90hz. Was not a good day to do outside mic testing lots of wind in my region the last couple of week.
dB meter was around 110dB @ 1 meter A weighted. Input power was around 25 volts max.
We compared it to a EAW SB850 with the same crossover settings. Interestingly the SB needed a lot more power to get to the same dB level. Probably duo to the two driver configuration. We used on Community t-class tfr64s top to get a feel for the overall range.
Setup used is 48/bw hp at 40Hz and 24/bw lp at 90hz. Was not a good day to do outside mic testing lots of wind in my region the last couple of week.
dB meter was around 110dB @ 1 meter A weighted. Input power was around 25 volts max.
We compared it to a EAW SB850 with the same crossover settings. Interestingly the SB needed a lot more power to get to the same dB level. Probably duo to the two driver configuration. We used on Community t-class tfr64s top to get a feel for the overall range.
"A" weighting rolls off response below 1000 Hz, at 100 Hz it is about -20 dB, at 40 Hz about -35 dB.
"Flat" or "C" (which is about -2 dB at 40 Hz) are more appropriate for sub measurement.
weighting
Hi there W: Thanks, I suspected that my chepo SPL meter did not give accurate results at low frequency...checked the package...it's A weighted...thanks again. ...regards, Michael
Hi there W: Thanks, I suspected that my chepo SPL meter did not give accurate results at low frequency...checked the package...it's A weighted...thanks again. ...regards, Michael
Hello everyone!
I'm new here but very interested in this topic... I don't know much about this design. What I've read has me really interested in building 12 of them. I'm in Miami, Fl where street dj'ing is very competitive! There are many guys using Vega FH diet as well as Yorkvillle LS 1208 diet designs.
I'm hoping these will be all I've heard about.
Quick question... Is the 18 sound woofer the ideal sub for this design? I've seen other places RCF or B&C woofers are the right choice.
Thanks for any assistance in advance!
I'm new here but very interested in this topic... I don't know much about this design. What I've read has me really interested in building 12 of them. I'm in Miami, Fl where street dj'ing is very competitive! There are many guys using Vega FH diet as well as Yorkvillle LS 1208 diet designs.
I'm hoping these will be all I've heard about.
Quick question... Is the 18 sound woofer the ideal sub for this design? I've seen other places RCF or B&C woofers are the right choice.
Thanks for any assistance in advance!
TH18 Measurements
Did some measurements today and wanted to share. Comments are welcome.
I was hoping to get to use my new SPL meter as input to REW but the results were so inconsistent that I went back to DBX M2.
Using REW
Setup was 28.5v measured with voltmeter at 50hz
Distance 10 meters and approx. 70cm from the ground
Highpass 30hz/48db
Lowpass 110hz/48db
Did some measurements today and wanted to share. Comments are welcome.
I was hoping to get to use my new SPL meter as input to REW but the results were so inconsistent that I went back to DBX M2.
Using REW
Setup was 28.5v measured with voltmeter at 50hz
Distance 10 meters and approx. 70cm from the ground
Highpass 30hz/48db
Lowpass 110hz/48db
