Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Solid State Talk all about solid state amplification.

Slewmaster - CFA vs. VFA "Rumble"
Slewmaster - CFA vs. VFA "Rumble"
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 13th March 2019, 07:30 PM   #10251
stuartmp is offline stuartmp  Australia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Gold Coast
Quote:
Originally Posted by vargasmongo3435 View Post
hello ST yes the creepage to be honest I didn't I should but not this time, by the way that HB build looks amazing Mr. ST okay about the changes they were a few details that I have to redone on the PCB this are fixed and yes definitely the leds I need to change them "since this is a prototype" I only can tested with audio if all goes well and working correctly I will order the final PCB version, that is PCB V1.1 and to be honest here in diy I have learn so much from you guys that I do not mind at all to share the files can be Sprint file and gerbers as longer you don't profit the design this is not my intention either this no no me learning more yes yes





Vargas
Hi Juan.

I hope you are well. There is no doubt that you have done a amazing job on this board. You have done everything you can to make this board one of the best here on DIY. It a real credit to you and I'm sure that everyone here appreciates what you have done.

If you like I don't mind looking at the clearance and creepage for you. Once I am done I can send the Sprint layout file back to you. You could then review it.
If you want to use the file thats great. If you decide that you don't want to use it that's fine to.
But I think that if you or I review the clearance and creepage on this board it will only improve it.

Thank you for your kind words about the HB. I posted some other pictures on the HB thread.

Keep up the good work and yes learning is the best thing about DIY Audio.
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th March 2019, 07:40 PM   #10252
vargasmongo3435 is offline vargasmongo3435  Puerto Rico
diyAudio Member
 
vargasmongo3435's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Quebradillas, Puerto Rico
Send a message via Yahoo to vargasmongo3435
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartmp View Post
Hi Juan.

I hope you are well. There is no doubt that you have done a amazing job on this board. You have done everything you can to make this board one of the best here on DIY. It a real credit to you and I'm sure that everyone here appreciates what you have done.

If you like I don't mind looking at the clearance and creepage for you. Once I am done I can send the Sprint layout file back to you. You could then review it.
If you want to use the file thats great. If you decide that you don't want to use it that's fine to.
But I think that if you or I review the clearance and creepage on this board it will only improve it.

Thank you for your kind words about the HB. I posted some other pictures on the HB thread.

Keep up the good work and yes learning is the best thing about DIY Audio.

no no Mr. ST not the best "You have done everything you can to make this board one of the best"

I can say is an ok design maybe? I'm just trying the best I can

"If you like I don't mind looking at the clearance and creepage for you"



sure no problem Mr. ST that be great indeed





Best Regards
Juan
__________________
audio fanatic only
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th March 2019, 08:11 PM   #10253
stuartmp is offline stuartmp  Australia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Gold Coast
Quote:
Originally Posted by vargasmongo3435 View Post
no no Mr. ST not the best "You have done everything you can to make this board one of the best"

I can say is an ok design maybe? I'm just trying the best I can

"If you like I don't mind looking at the clearance and creepage for you"



sure no problem Mr. ST that be great indeed





Best Regards
Juan
Well I think that most people on DIY would truly appreciate what you have done here and it would be difficult to improve on what you have done as the layout looks amazing. Every time I see it you have tweaked the tracks so nicely and put a lot of thought into how the final board looks and performs.

Just amazing. Slewmaster - CFA vs. VFA "Rumble"
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th March 2019, 08:51 PM   #10254
stuartmp is offline stuartmp  Australia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Gold Coast
Quote:
Originally Posted by vargasmongo3435 View Post

"If you like I don't mind looking at the clearance and creepage for you"

sure no problem Mr. ST that be great indeed

Best Regards
Juan
If you can send me the Sprint layout file and the multisim file I will get started and I will be glad to give this awesome board of yours a creapage and clearance check for you.
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th March 2019, 09:10 PM   #10255
vargasmongo3435 is offline vargasmongo3435  Puerto Rico
diyAudio Member
 
vargasmongo3435's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Quebradillas, Puerto Rico
Send a message via Yahoo to vargasmongo3435
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartmp View Post
If you can send me the Sprint layout file and the multisim file I will get started and I will be glad to give this awesome board of yours a creapage and clearance check for you.

ok I send the files to your e-mail let me know if you got them



Vargas
__________________
audio fanatic only
  Reply With Quote
Old 13th March 2019, 11:15 PM   #10256
stuartmp is offline stuartmp  Australia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Gold Coast
Quote:
Originally Posted by vargasmongo3435 View Post
ok I send the files to your e-mail let me know if you got them



Vargas
Got them
  Reply With Quote
Old 15th March 2019, 12:34 PM   #10257
vargasmongo3435 is offline vargasmongo3435  Puerto Rico
diyAudio Member
 
vargasmongo3435's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Quebradillas, Puerto Rico
Send a message via Yahoo to vargasmongo3435
Default do this transistors need to share temperature?

hey, guys, I have a question here is Q9 and Q10 the medium power transistor do they need to share the same heat sink or they can have separates small heat sinks? or like always a small aluminum sheet with both transistor attached to the sheet? I always have that in mind
Attached Images
File Type: jpg heat sink.jpg (681.4 KB, 280 views)
__________________
audio fanatic only
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th March 2019, 11:26 PM   #10258
stuartmp is offline stuartmp  Australia
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Gold Coast
Quote:
Originally Posted by vargasmongo3435 View Post
hey, guys, I have a question here is Q9 and Q10 the medium power transistor do they need to share the same heat sink or they can have separates small heat sinks? or like always a small aluminum sheet with both transistor attached to the sheet? I always have that in mind

Hi Juan.
I have run some numbers for you.
I measured the Power dissipation wattage of each transistor Q9 and Q10 in Multisim at full load and saw they are about 220mw each.

If we assume a Ambient Air Temperature of 30C
From the datasheet you will see, the maximum junction temperature is 150 C
and the Thermal Resistance from Junction to Ambient in Free Air is 100 C/W

So, if each transistor dissipates 220mw then that is a thermal resistance to Ambient of 22C
Then we need to add the thermal resistance of the Junction of the Transistor to its case. In this case the Transistor to case thermal resistance is 6.25C/W which equals 6,25C/W x 0.220 watts => 1.375 C


So if we add this all up we will get our total thermal resistance without a heat sink.
Ambient Air Temp + Transistor Case to Ambient Air + Transistor Junction to Case = Total thermal resistance.

30C + 22C + 1.375C = 53.375 C which is a little over 1/3 of maximum.
---------------------------------------


If we now run the numbers using a strip of Aluminum which is 30mm long x 25mm wide x 1.2mm thick (This is half of your available space as we are doing the calculations for one transistor)

The thermal resistance Heatsink to Ambient is 0.0078C/W which equals 0.0078C/W x 0.220 watts => 0.001716 C

I assume that you would use thermal grease so that needs to be added.
The thermal resistance Case to Heatsink of thermal grease is about 0.2C/W which equals 0.2C/W x 0.220 watts => 0.044 C

Then we need to add the thermal resistance of the Junction of the Transistor to its case. In this case the Transistor to case thermal resistance is 6.25C/W which equals 6,25C/W x 0.220 watts => 1.375 C

So if we add this all up we will get our total thermal resistance
Ambient Air Temp + Heatsink to Ambient + Transistor Case to Heatsink + Transistor Junction to Case = total thermal resistance.

30C + 0.001716 C + 0.044 C + 1.375C = 31.42 C which is only a increase of 1.42 C above ambient.

So in summary. I would use a heatsink . A strip of Aluminum will be fine 60mm long x 25mm wide x 1.2mm thick or simlar, but if you don't use one the transistors will be ok. They may just have a shorter life.


I would use them on the same strip to keep both the transistors at the same temp.



This video may also help
YouTube

Hope that helps you.
Regards
Mr ST.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Half the lenght of Alumimun Strip.jpg (69.1 KB, 220 views)
File Type: jpg MJE350 Thermal properties.jpg (114.4 KB, 218 views)
Attached Files
File Type: pdf MJE350 data sheet 1.pdf (317.5 KB, 7 views)
File Type: pdf MJE350 data sheet 2.pdf (317.5 KB, 5 views)

Last edited by stuartmp; 16th March 2019 at 11:42 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 17th March 2019, 04:56 PM   #10259
vargasmongo3435 is offline vargasmongo3435  Puerto Rico
diyAudio Member
 
vargasmongo3435's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Quebradillas, Puerto Rico
Send a message via Yahoo to vargasmongo3435
Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartmp View Post
Hi Juan.
I have run some numbers for you.
I measured the Power dissipation wattage of each transistor Q9 and Q10 in Multisim at full load and saw they are about 220mw each.

If we assume a Ambient Air Temperature of 30C
From the datasheet you will see, the maximum junction temperature is 150 C
and the Thermal Resistance from Junction to Ambient in Free Air is 100 C/W

So, if each transistor dissipates 220mw then that is a thermal resistance to Ambient of 22C
Then we need to add the thermal resistance of the Junction of the Transistor to its case. In this case the Transistor to case thermal resistance is 6.25C/W which equals 6,25C/W x 0.220 watts => 1.375 C


So if we add this all up we will get our total thermal resistance without a heat sink.
Ambient Air Temp + Transistor Case to Ambient Air + Transistor Junction to Case = Total thermal resistance.

30C + 22C + 1.375C = 53.375 C which is a little over 1/3 of maximum.
---------------------------------------


If we now run the numbers using a strip of Aluminum which is 30mm long x 25mm wide x 1.2mm thick (This is half of your available space as we are doing the calculations for one transistor)

The thermal resistance Heatsink to Ambient is 0.0078C/W which equals 0.0078C/W x 0.220 watts => 0.001716 C

I assume that you would use thermal grease so that needs to be added.
The thermal resistance Case to Heatsink of thermal grease is about 0.2C/W which equals 0.2C/W x 0.220 watts => 0.044 C

Then we need to add the thermal resistance of the Junction of the Transistor to its case. In this case the Transistor to case thermal resistance is 6.25C/W which equals 6,25C/W x 0.220 watts => 1.375 C

So if we add this all up we will get our total thermal resistance
Ambient Air Temp + Heatsink to Ambient + Transistor Case to Heatsink + Transistor Junction to Case = total thermal resistance.

30C + 0.001716 C + 0.044 C + 1.375C = 31.42 C which is only a increase of 1.42 C above ambient.

So in summary. I would use a heatsink . A strip of Aluminum will be fine 60mm long x 25mm wide x 1.2mm thick or simlar, but if you don't use one the transistors will be ok. They may just have a shorter life.


I would use them on the same strip to keep both the transistors at the same temp.


thank ST wow man that is a really deep anwear ok so a 60 mm x 25 mm and 1.2mm thick I got some left over aluminum still yes let me check the video



This video may also help
YouTube

Hope that helps you.
Regards
Mr ST.
__________________
audio fanatic only
  Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 01:56 PM   #10260
vargasmongo3435 is offline vargasmongo3435  Puerto Rico
diyAudio Member
 
vargasmongo3435's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Quebradillas, Puerto Rico
Send a message via Yahoo to vargasmongo3435
Unhappy fail first try low audio

hello guys I think I fail my buid I tested with 25V DC supply voltage and it has sound but really low also none of the LED turn on at all I guess I made a mistake on the layout some how I belive I fail cause I remove the Greenamp and place the The Wolverine IPS boards and I have good sound, if the Wolverine work fine means the yes I fail this design like I said before I'll inform good or bad this time is bad news



Vargas
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_0594.jpg (285.7 KB, 77 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_0596.jpg (248.3 KB, 77 views)
__________________
audio fanatic only
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Slewmaster - CFA vs. VFA "Rumble"Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
SlewMaster Project Boards jkuetemann Group Buys 831 16th March 2018 10:03 PM
Meistersinger VFA-200, A beginners first try in LTSpice nattawa Solid State 34 29th January 2016 01:58 PM
What about this amp-CFA or VFA? dadod Solid State 22 31st March 2015 12:08 AM
Changing my old VFA designs into ONE-BEND CFA plus Current Drives mtlin12 Solid State 1 26th March 2014 01:09 PM
VFA Topology Amplifiers for Audio Bonsai Solid State 10 14th August 2013 04:12 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:46 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 66.67% / PHP 61.87%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2019 diyAudio
Wiki