I might need a couple of hints on room acoustics / diffusers

Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.
Greetings to all!

Since I have some spare time, I decided to finally work on the room acoustics. Currently I have just a carpet to deal with the acoustics. I also decided the cross the axis of the speakers about 1m (3ft) in front of the listening position to compensate for the lack of treatment, which worked to a degree.

The room is situated in an apartment building (6th floor, concrete slab, wooden parquet flooring).

Ceiling height is 2.5m (8.2ft)

Current positioning is in the attachments, but I might change it in the future.

I tried the clap test, and I get some fast razory echoes, which I hope to fix.

Was leaning towards putting diffusers inside, since I prefer the sound of a live room. Now, are there any diffusers that would help with the wall being directly behind the listening position?

Also any idea how to fix the early reflections which would hit the window? Was thinking of making movable diffusers on stands, but any recommendations are more than welcome.
 

Attachments

  • living room.png
    living room.png
    13.8 KB · Views: 182
diyAudio Moderator
Joined 2008
Paid Member
are there any diffusers that would help with the wall being directly behind the listening position?
It's close so I'd be leaning toward absorption. Maybe a thick tapestry or drapes.

Although you mention wanting a live room, if this absorber reduces the treble for you then you can equalise it back to where you like it. The thing that will change in the end is more the distribution of higher frequency sound in the room, than the amount.
 
Actually reducing the treble probably wont bother me too much. I am using EV interface 2, and I ended up with the M75, to roll off the high frequencies.

I guess another possible position would be the following. Just a rough idea.
 

Attachments

  • ev inteface 2.png
    ev inteface 2.png
    421.1 KB · Views: 173
  • living room 2.png
    living room 2.png
    12.1 KB · Views: 174
Looking at your second arrangement, with the seat facing the window I would suggest you go that way.

But there are a couple of downfalls to a room that small (I assume it was intended to be a bedroom?)

First you are likely to get a repeat bouncing echo from the front and back walls. If you take a dog trainer (clicker) and snap it at your listening position you might here it going back and forth repeatedly in a gradually decreasing ring. Generally the answer to this is to put down carpet and use heavy drapes wall to wall on the window wall and maybe some Canvas Art on the back wall. As long as one of two parallel walls doesn't echo, the other usually tames down pretty nicely.

For your side reflections, I would look into some well placed canvas art (i.e. without glass on top) or tapestries to break up the reflection a bit. Like you I enjoy a lively room, but in a room that small reflections can be overwhelming.

Finally, on the two back corners... Be careful that you don't end up with one or both speakers aimed directly into those corners. Things can get really weird when that happens... a sound from (for example) the left speaker suddenly comes from behind and right... You might also look into a couple of corner traps back there as well... Nothing ugly, even plants or narrow vertical tapestries will do.

I'm no fan of those stupid egg crate panels or the ones with wood sticking out at all angles. It's always best to solve the problem in an attractive manner so that you have a comfortable, inviting room.
 
Will also try that then. Have plenty of blank art canvases to use.

Nah, that is the "living room", believe it or not. The bedroom is behind the right wall, measures 2,6m x 3,6m....

Was thinking for a while if it would be plausible to tear down the hollow wall in between the living room and bedroom, but could not come with a good enough plan to justify it.

Good thing I live alone.
 
Good thing I live alone.

:) Maybe so...

Here's a computer mockup of my listening area, also in a livingroom. I used this when redecorating last year. Worked out pretty well, with only a few minor differences in the furniture.

Also, fwiw, one of my favorite canvas art pieces, hanging above the love seat, looks a whole lot better than those silly egg crate sponges.
 

Attachments

  • Plan 1 - Balcony.jpg
    Plan 1 - Balcony.jpg
    122.5 KB · Views: 160
  • Sunset.jpg
    Sunset.jpg
    96.2 KB · Views: 166
Last edited:
Oh, another point ... (missed the edit window)

For canvas art you don't want hard artist's pasteboards.
You want fabric canvas stretched over a frame...

The effect is that sound moves the fabric microscopically on the way in, then again on the way out, causing a damping effect. There might be other more effective treatments, but none of them look that good on a wall.
 
Yeah I have a bunch of those canvases, and I usually make them, so no problem there.

I did a model of the room. Just a rough idea, I will change things when I will progress with the positioning.
 

Attachments

  • idejna3.png
    idejna3.png
    879.6 KB · Views: 87
  • idejna4.png
    idejna4.png
    780.3 KB · Views: 79
I like the second layout as well, mostly because it allows one to pull the speakers farther out into the room and off the front wall.

If you can, have your audio rack on a side wall near where you sit but not at a first and or second reflection point if you can help; it.

Reason being is less stuff in between the main speakers the better the soundstage.

About the only thing I allow between my speakers now is mono amps on floor platforms and a subwoofer dead center but sticking out about 8 inches past the line formed by the main speakers.

Never miss the first few notes of a song again and have to rush back to adjust the loudness. Controls at arms reach or one step are a blessing the older you get.
 
I like the second layout as well, mostly because it allows one to pull the speakers farther out into the room and off the front wall.

That and taking advantage of the window curtains as sound treatment.

As I recently pointed out in another thread, I am no fan of those sponge rubber eggcrates or big panels with wood sticking out at all angles. I try whenever possible to get the result with decor... book cases at reflection points, canvas art, curtains, carpets... I can see no reason that a listening room should not be a comfortable, inviting place to bring a friend.

Never miss the first few notes of a song again and have to rush back to adjust the loudness. Controls at arms reach or one step are a blessing the older you get.

LOL... been there, done that... These days I control my system with an HTPC and wireless keyboards are a really big help.
 
I like the second layout as well, mostly because it allows one to pull the speakers farther out into the room and off the front wall.

If you can, have your audio rack on a side wall near where you sit but not at a first and or second reflection point if you can help; it.

Reason being is less stuff in between the main speakers the better the soundstage.

About the only thing I allow between my speakers now is mono amps on floor platforms and a subwoofer dead center but sticking out about 8 inches past the line formed by the main speakers.

Never miss the first few notes of a song again and have to rush back to adjust the loudness. Controls at arms reach or one step are a blessing the older you get.

I will try positioning the rack on the side, after I find out where the first reflections will hit. I hope there is gonna be enough space. Other than that a lower rack.

I was planning to use the space where the listening chair is placed, to be used as a small work space for a canvas stand and drawing board, when I wont listen to music. And the last thing I want is to find out is, that some of the paint ended on the audio rack :cuss:
 
Ok, so I managed to rearrange the furniture, and do some basic treatment. I also filled some of the voids in the bookshelves with clothes. For first reflections I used canvases, same for corners. I put a bigger canvas behind the listening position, so that it covers most of the wall. I still did not manage to get the curtains, since the country is in lockdown..

Sound is good, had to put the speakers closer the the back wall than first thought, to get the low frequencies right. Imaging is good, center image quite solid, given the fact that there is no treatment on the back wall. But the glass on the windows has some play, which might help a bit in this case..

The rack is in the middle because the cords are too short to put it on the sides, but is much lower that in the rendering, which does not seem to affect the imaging that much.

Until the stores reopen I can live with it. Will try using diffusers on the first reflection to open the room a bit more. Same for the ceiling.

Although I will need to put some isolation on the ceiling, thus lowering even more... I get both airborne and structural transmission from the upstairs neighbors.
 
Last edited:
Status
This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.