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-   -   BIG LOUD 3 way? (https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/82173-loud-3-a.html)

xstephanx 26th June 2006 11:42 PM

BIG LOUD 3 way?
 
as ive gone the fullrange route, ive noticed that id like something big and loud, thogh not as hi fi as my fullrange system. A recent project inspired me to build a very 70s like 3 way deisgn, very loud, very large, lots of bas, big drivers, and most EFINATELY a 3 way. my friend also just set up a studio in his basement, but they want some REALLY loud speakers that can handle high playback volumes. dont worry, ill wear earplugs.

So i got my thinking cap on, and picked out these drivers!

woofer: pyle PPA15
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=292-218

this will be crossed to a mid at 500hz ish, cause this keeps high freq out of the woofer, and still allows alot of protection on the midrange for loud playback.

midrange driver: im stuck between two, but leaning more toward the 6" cause i dont think that a 5 1/4 mid can keep up with a 15" woofer
so i chose either the 5" dayton
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=295-010
or the 6"
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=295-015

since high powerhandling is a priority(200 wattsish thermally id hope) ill cross one of these to a tweeter at about 5khz

the tweeters arent THAT important, theyre only doing the top 2 octaves, so i chose some cheapish bullet tweeters as used in the podzuma, which should have plenty powrhandling if i cross them that high with maybe just a first order.

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=270-102

so will these sound good do you think? what am i doing right what am i doing wrong? if youre wondering what sound im aiming for...think one of those old 3 way JBLs with the 12" accordian surround woofer. i trid to do some crossover work myself, and managed to work out a 2nd order linkwitz between the woofer and mid at 500hz.

tell me if this is right, ~2uF cap in paralell with woofer, and a .5mH inductor in series with the woofer, and the opposite this configuration for the mid.

these will also be used for partys here and there.

the crossover from mid to tweeter i am unsure about, if someone could link me to a calculator or whatnot, then that would help.

i am aware i will need to pad down the mid and the tweeter, but IIRC thats just a reisitor network before the crossover.

so what do you guys think? i know this is the billionth time ive aksed a similar question, but these i will listen to on a semiregular basis, so i want them to sound good.


ANY INPUT IS WELCOME!

xstephanx 27th June 2006 12:22 AM

after looking at some graphs, crossing at 4khz for the 6" mid would probably be a more reasonable option.

and i still dont feel like im being clear about what kind of SQ goals im setting here. these are not goign to be audiophile speakers, at all. the quality im looking for is like what you get with those 300$ floorstanders at bestbuy. This isnt meant to do a disspaearing act, its not meant to be flat even and neutral, its just meant to have alot of bas kick, and good extension on both ends. if the highs are a bit fizzy so be it, if the bass is boomy, thats ok. not to mention be effing loud.

facundonu 27th June 2006 02:10 AM

congratulations for the project!!

i don't think i can help a lot since i'm just a beginner, but my heart will forever be with your future speakers!

RJ 27th June 2006 02:10 AM

Sorry to bust your bubble but 90db isn't loud for a woofer. You'll quickly lose 3 to 6 db due to baffle step loss. Depending how far from a wall these speakers will be placed.
Also a Qts. of .67 means it's suited for an infinite baffle or a very large sealed box.
Look for woofers with a 99db rating and a Qts. of .55 or lower.

xstephanx 27th June 2006 02:14 AM

99db?! the onyl speaker i know hat are THAT efficient, are guitar speakers, which would not do for this application.

im padding the mid and tweeter down to 90db. theres another good woofer candidate with a sensitivity of 94db, would this do?
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=290-384

theyll usually be placed a foot or possibly two(at a party) from a wall.

also a 90db woofer can be loud if you throw lots of watts at it, its just not efficient(i sure you know this but im pointing it out. These dont have to be that efficient, but 89db is my lower limit)

do i have to move up to another woofer for this project to work out?

Cal Weldon 27th June 2006 02:53 AM

Stephan,

I've sent you an email.

RJ 27th June 2006 03:03 AM

2 Attachment(s)
That's a bit better, but it'll have that Classic 70-80 hz boom. A bigger box and some stuffing might tame it.
This is a sealed box that'll be about 18" wide, 42" tall and 14" deep.
Just about right for a 15" three way.

angsuman 27th June 2006 03:26 AM

Hmm people beat me to it. Yea you're woofer doesn't have nearly as much sensitivity, look for a woofer atleast in the 96-99 db. range.

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=290-175

This looks cool but you'll probably need a huge cabinet.

Or maybe 2 of these:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showd...number=290-105

What's your budget? I'm figuring its pretty low since these are supposed to imitate classic 3-ways.

The 6in dayton midranges seem nice. Maybe for higher sensitivity you can use two per speaker in an MTM arrangement and then use whatever compression driver and horn of your choice. Should handle lots of power and play loud.

mike.e 27th June 2006 05:56 AM

For reliable high SPL with low enough distortion,a high sensitivity is required.

how loud your 'loud' is,depends on you. Also room size,and approximate amplifier power rating.

What you require is probably a 2 or 3way system
1" compression driver
~6" cone driver on conical/tractix horn
12" or 15" bass reflex

eg
http://www.speakerplans.com/index.php?id=x15

http://www.geocities.com/adrian_mack/homepage.html
Behringer make low end - moderate versions of these.

On second thoughts,a large format COAX might do the job also,if you have seperate sub.

xstephanx 27th June 2006 11:09 PM

would the goldwood suffice in sensitivity? i guess i could go for the pioneer too, but it doesnt look like it can take very much abuse. The max power these will ever see will probably be in the realm of 150 watts, MAYBE 200 watts depending on how things pan out. But i doubti would run them flat out at 200 watts.

a sensitivity of 90db is fine.

also i plan to give these a bit of a low end hump. I plan to do a ported design as well.

i think thelargest baffle i could go for would be 18"x36", a foot(maybe a couple inches more) of depth. so i have alot of space to work with.

id rather not go out of the low 230s(USD) area(for drivers and crossover).

any input on the crossovers?


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