Hello everyone,
Recently I have gotten myself a Pioneer sx-209 rds and have no speakers to connect to it. I am diy person on things on whatever I can find how-to's for, -speakers being one of them. I am planning to build a bookshelf speakers and at the moment, I have pair of salvaged low frequency loudspeakers from Panasonic system that was broken. (I know this is not the best start but I recall those sounding really nice) - Now here is the first problem, there is no power rating on them. By the looks and total speaker power, I can assume, they are at least 50 W.
I would like to buy a high - mid range speakers to pair up with those but am clueless what to look for. So I have few questions for you guys, that maybe have been already asked, but I did not find any (to be honest, I did not look, since I really don't know what to look for)
1. Should I buy one speaker (pair) for the high and mid range, or separate tweeters and mid-range speakers? I assume one that is good for everything, isn't really good for anything? or is this not the case?
2. I know from diagrams, that I can wire two 8 ohm speakers to have 4 ohms as total impedance and other way around. But maybe someone could suggest, how to implement high-pass and low-pass filters in this schematic? would it affect the total impedance?
3. Lets assume I am right and that speaker I already have is 50 watts. If I would to buy a 20 watt 8 ohm mid-range speaker and put it in parallel, total wattage would be 70 W? What would theoretically happen if my amp, (Rated at 40 watts per channel into 8 ohm) would to deliver those 40 watts? (a bit higher, since speakers are in parallel - 4 ohms now) The bigger speaker would be fine, but I'm curious about the 20 watt one. - Would the power output from amp damage the speaker, or the watts of all the speakers add up and it would be fine?
I know these most likely are ridiculous questions to some, but would help me a lot if someone could help.
Best of luck,
Kristaps
Recently I have gotten myself a Pioneer sx-209 rds and have no speakers to connect to it. I am diy person on things on whatever I can find how-to's for, -speakers being one of them. I am planning to build a bookshelf speakers and at the moment, I have pair of salvaged low frequency loudspeakers from Panasonic system that was broken. (I know this is not the best start but I recall those sounding really nice) - Now here is the first problem, there is no power rating on them. By the looks and total speaker power, I can assume, they are at least 50 W.
I would like to buy a high - mid range speakers to pair up with those but am clueless what to look for. So I have few questions for you guys, that maybe have been already asked, but I did not find any (to be honest, I did not look, since I really don't know what to look for)
1. Should I buy one speaker (pair) for the high and mid range, or separate tweeters and mid-range speakers? I assume one that is good for everything, isn't really good for anything? or is this not the case?
2. I know from diagrams, that I can wire two 8 ohm speakers to have 4 ohms as total impedance and other way around. But maybe someone could suggest, how to implement high-pass and low-pass filters in this schematic? would it affect the total impedance?
3. Lets assume I am right and that speaker I already have is 50 watts. If I would to buy a 20 watt 8 ohm mid-range speaker and put it in parallel, total wattage would be 70 W? What would theoretically happen if my amp, (Rated at 40 watts per channel into 8 ohm) would to deliver those 40 watts? (a bit higher, since speakers are in parallel - 4 ohms now) The bigger speaker would be fine, but I'm curious about the 20 watt one. - Would the power output from amp damage the speaker, or the watts of all the speakers add up and it would be fine?
I know these most likely are ridiculous questions to some, but would help me a lot if someone could help.
Best of luck,
Kristaps
Gagashagy, It might be better to invest in a kit from a local supplier. There is no indication as to where you are. You are more likely to get better results than just randomly sticking things together with the little knowledge you may have at the moment.
So for instance ............
Madisound Speaker Components
C.M
So for instance ............
Madisound Speaker Components
C.M
Hi, Thank you very much for this link. Now I have somewhat idea where to start. Immediately I realized, that I don't have datasheet for my driver. From stereo that it came out of, I know the code for the driver, but I failed to locate any manufacturer data sheets or specifications, so maybe someone know where to look?
Stereo was Panasonic sa-ak44 and code written on driver is t17pl07c6.
If however I would not find datasheet, I could make these in 2.1 system and designate these drivers as separate woofer. Then as I understand, I would need separate amp to drive the sub, but cannot I use the other terminals for speakers? On my amp, I have this set of connections (attached). Or piggy back?
Regards
Attachments
When you connect speakers to those output terminals they are running off the same amp. It is the same as connecting them directly together except that you can typically switch them in and out. You would need to concern yourself with the amp powering them in parallel except that crossing them normally avoids them actually being in parallel over the same range, but this is the bass region and funny things can happen when you need to account for rooms. You would need to use a passive crossover as they will both see full range output Voltage. You will need to deal passively with their differences in level.
Thank you but I think this won't be needed, if I can trust Panasonic saying, that second amp (there were two sets of cables coming from each speaker and the sub I am referring to, had it's own) outputs frequency range from 70 - 120 Hz. So this narrow frequency range means, that for two way crossover, I would need something that covers 120 Hz up to 20kHz? Would this make sense to do, or no?
So if understand you correct, then makes no sense to do what I had in mind. Thank you.
I think I owe an explanation to all of you, - I love somewhat good quality audio and with finances that I have, I use whatever I have to make best of it. In this case, two perfectly fine drivers (imo - fine, but I could be very wrong). So even though, I am not entirely familiar with audio electronics, I have some basic knowledge about electronics in general, thus - am willing to try making these speakers myself.
If my current ignorance annoys anyone, I sincerely apologize and kindly ask you to ignore this topic. So I am grateful to everyone who points me to right direction.
Regards
I didn't mean that, most of us have probably done it that way before, and might again because neither way is wrong. I guess that it would seem more ordered with separate amps because it makes level matching easier. It also gives you the option to put your crossover after the amp, before it, or both. It also allows you to choose an amp that suits the bass and one that suits the treble, but that is at nitpicking level. Whatever you decide there should be experience here to help.
I suggest the links posted, learn.
A great starting point is to just go ahead and build - get yourself some tweeters, buy a 2kHz crossover off the shelf, put everything in a 25 litre vented box (a port of 5 cm diameter by about 10 cm length should be fine). You may need a 10 ohm resistor (10W) in series with the tweeter, so try to get a crossover that has a resistor in. Bang it all together and see how it sounds. Then start refining it. Doing something helps you to understand the literature, and your only loss would most likely be (at the most) the wood and crossover.
A great starting point is to just go ahead and build - get yourself some tweeters, buy a 2kHz crossover off the shelf, put everything in a 25 litre vented box (a port of 5 cm diameter by about 10 cm length should be fine). You may need a 10 ohm resistor (10W) in series with the tweeter, so try to get a crossover that has a resistor in. Bang it all together and see how it sounds. Then start refining it. Doing something helps you to understand the literature, and your only loss would most likely be (at the most) the wood and crossover.
:Well, there you go. 10L does look good for these. A tool I use says a 14L box with a 41Hz vent will be quite good.
My 25L wasn't so bad after all. And the 10cm port would have tuned to about 40Hz. And I pulled these values from my thumb. There are great tools available to help you design decent enclosures and crossovers. I still say build now and refine later.
BTW, some pics of your stuff might be nice for everyone to see...
My 25L wasn't so bad after all. And the 10cm port would have tuned to about 40Hz. And I pulled these values from my thumb. There are great tools available to help you design decent enclosures and crossovers. I still say build now and refine later.
BTW, some pics of your stuff might be nice for everyone to see...
Hi, thank you very much! I am in looking these parameters up in spare time, but maybe someone could put these in more simple words?
Fs 60 - Frequency bellow which the driver should not be used (Otherwise it will selfdestruct)
Re 6.5 - DC resistance. I got 10.6 ohms on my multi-meter and somewhere saw that rule of thumb is to round the number to closest value, 8 ohm in this case?
Qm 6.59 and Qe .65 - From these I got Qts 0.592 and in multiple sources I see, that qts between .4 and .7 is suitable for sealed enclosure. I mean, a lot of you suggested vented enclosure, or sealed enclosure can be tuned as well?
Could someone please explain in somewhat simple terms, how is enclosure tuning done?
Regards
No. The output will fall below Fs. Many woofers are run full range so they receive low bass, they just don't respond to it.
10.6 is rounded to the first decimal place. This is a useful level of rounding. Have you subtracted the meter lead resistance?
You can put anything in a sealed box, but a low Q might give a less useful rolled off response.
If you divide the resonant frequency by the Q, you can assess motor strength and higher numbers can show suitability to vented or horn loaded enclosures.
I've cut out plywood pieces and now before putting all together, - am trying to figure out, what kind of tweeters to order. (Most likely this is not the best order of steps, but I had materials laying around and I was bored) My preferred design is to have small towers with ~10 L for woofer but it can be adjusted by moving the inner wall, to increase volume, therefore make the setup vented if sealed fails. (I've decided to go 'test and trial'). Then cut out the back where tweeters would be, thus having two separate compartments for each driver woofer and open back in same enclosure.
Now what I cannot quite figure out is - where to cut off the woofer. Would it make sense to make a mock-up box, put the woofer in it and see at which frequency it starts to sound bad?
Since I don't have the driver's graph and don't know where the woofer cuts off, I'm thinking about getting a pair of broadband's which goes down all the way to 80 hZ, so I'd have headroom. Then again, this idea does not work with the open back enclosure, since broadband would require sealed/vented box.
Regards
Additional thing that I encountered - if I would like to create 2-way crossover with frequency 100 Hz (assumption based on previous amp output for the woofer that I have) then I have to find fairly big inductor. Around 24 mH or higher. So this once again, raises question if I could reliably tell where the woofer falls in frequency without special equipment. (Fingers crossed it was just set up bellow 120 Hz and it can actually work up to 400 Hz. - this would make things easier)
A 170mm woofer would reasonably be expected to work up to 2Kc/s, so you could make your crossover that high which would generally work in with most tweeters with a low resonance of around 600 - 700 c/s. Use a LR2 crossover at 2Kc/s and pad down the tweeter to match the woofer.
Get some 'free' basic software tools to put yourself in the game of crossover design. The crossover will make or break your efforts in getting a satisfactory result.
This bit of free software will allow you to measure the impedance of your speakers and by deduction through impedance measurement ....capacitance and inductance. You will need to make up a simple jig to do so, and through the use of a sound card in your computer. It allows you to export zma files to X-Sim.
See below.....
AcustikA signal analysis software tools
There is X-Sim too, a very useful tool for fine tuning.
http://libinst.com/Xsim/XSimSetup.exe
Some chat on it..........
XSim free schematic-based crossover designer program - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video Discussion Forum.
There are many 'free' box design software out there too. Also on-line Passive Crossover Designers which will give you target values for filters rather than guessing at values.
2-Way Crossover Calculator / Designer
Hope this might help somewhat, but beware, loudspeaker design can be habit forming.
C.M
Get some 'free' basic software tools to put yourself in the game of crossover design. The crossover will make or break your efforts in getting a satisfactory result.
This bit of free software will allow you to measure the impedance of your speakers and by deduction through impedance measurement ....capacitance and inductance. You will need to make up a simple jig to do so, and through the use of a sound card in your computer. It allows you to export zma files to X-Sim.
See below.....
AcustikA signal analysis software tools
There is X-Sim too, a very useful tool for fine tuning.
http://libinst.com/Xsim/XSimSetup.exe
Some chat on it..........
XSim free schematic-based crossover designer program - Techtalk Speaker Building, Audio, Video Discussion Forum.
There are many 'free' box design software out there too. Also on-line Passive Crossover Designers which will give you target values for filters rather than guessing at values.
2-Way Crossover Calculator / Designer
Hope this might help somewhat, but beware, loudspeaker design can be habit forming.
C.M
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