What would your ultimate desktop loudspeaker be? How large would you be willing to go and what frequency response would you desire. If price is not an object what would you want in quality and SPL level? Would you want it self powered and if so would you want the power amplifier internal or external?
I shall watch this thread with interest having just started a project for high sound quality speakers for desk use. It is unlikely they will sit on the desktop for both practical and sound quality reasons.
Cones bigger than 5"-6" above the desk are likely to be a problem. Sub/s on the floor would be expected for a high sound quality setup.
Not too bothered about 20-30 Hz but flat from 30-20kHz would be the target using subs on the floor. Probably opt for a higher crossover frequency than ideal in the region of 80-100Hz or so due to the size constraints on the main speakers.
SPL at 1-1.5 metres is unlikely to be major issue but the close proximity of a lot of surfaces is likely to be for the sound quality.
It would be active. The electronics would be separate during the development phase. In the longer term possibly stored behind the monitor or in the speaker cabinets.
FF85 has been replaced with FF85wk, Sespite our initial trepidation when we saw the 1st pictures of the new driver is all round better and about the same price. Only minor changes needed for the original uFonken to fit the new driver.
We have also come up with a slightly larger trapezoid box for the new driver that has stunned a lot of people. Here my personal pair in solid yew with complementary coloured drivers (they start out gray). For seious bass helper woofers needed.
We also have a small box, that with no other changes, will fit either the paper or metal Alpair 6.2. The large bezel on the MAs dictate the more traditional proportions.
A comparison http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/196061-3-driver-audition-fostex-mark-audio.html
dave
We have also come up with a slightly larger trapezoid box for the new driver that has stunned a lot of people. Here my personal pair in solid yew with complementary coloured drivers (they start out gray). For seious bass helper woofers needed.
We also have a small box, that with no other changes, will fit either the paper or metal Alpair 6.2. The large bezel on the MAs dictate the more traditional proportions.
A comparison http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/196061-3-driver-audition-fostex-mark-audio.html
dave
A desktop speaker has a very special acoustic environment:
a) it is a very close nearfield, so the speakers must have very wide dispersion, and no destructive interference
b) the desk is an acoustic mirror, producing very early reflections. I'm not sure about the preception these, because they are very early, but I think that it is a good idea to avoid them
c) There is huge monitor between the speakers. This is a reflective surface, too, and should be considered
This leads to the following conclusions (not exhaustive):
a) use small drivers; if multi-way, reduce distance between the drivers to a minimum and use steep filters
b1) read "avoid" as "use", and place the drivers as low as possible above the desk or
b2)use high vertical directivity. This is contrary to a), but if this directivity is achieved by a sufficiently high line array, this might be worth a try.
c1) if b1) is used, place the speakery below the monitor; this is something like the ambiophonics approach of "Melo theory"
c2) if b2) is used, place the speakers directly next to the monitor, with no space between each speaker and the monitor.
In both cases c1) and c2) the monitor is used as an additional baffle.
Baseballbat
a) it is a very close nearfield, so the speakers must have very wide dispersion, and no destructive interference
b) the desk is an acoustic mirror, producing very early reflections. I'm not sure about the preception these, because they are very early, but I think that it is a good idea to avoid them
c) There is huge monitor between the speakers. This is a reflective surface, too, and should be considered
This leads to the following conclusions (not exhaustive):
a) use small drivers; if multi-way, reduce distance between the drivers to a minimum and use steep filters
b1) read "avoid" as "use", and place the drivers as low as possible above the desk or
b2)use high vertical directivity. This is contrary to a), but if this directivity is achieved by a sufficiently high line array, this might be worth a try.
c1) if b1) is used, place the speakery below the monitor; this is something like the ambiophonics approach of "Melo theory"
c2) if b2) is used, place the speakers directly next to the monitor, with no space between each speaker and the monitor.
In both cases c1) and c2) the monitor is used as an additional baffle.
Baseballbat
Face it. On a desktop, you can get pretty good sound. Not fantastic. It is a hostile place. I have a small set of Fountek 85's that do OK for listening to lectures. If I want high fidelity, it will not be on my desk.
Take a hint from the studio folks. They most all sit at desktops now. Move the speakers up and out a couple feet. Most of them also have space behind the desk too, but you can do things with acoustic absorbers.
Take a hint from the studio folks. They most all sit at desktops now. Move the speakers up and out a couple feet. Most of them also have space behind the desk too, but you can do things with acoustic absorbers.
If the desk is used as a desk with stuff being moved around on it then placing drivers close to the surface does not seem like a good option.
There are arguments for and against wide dispersion depending on what one wants from the speakers: close monitoring of recordings or enjoying recordings in a "normal" reflective environment which is something of a challenge when one sits close to the speakers.
If you're afraid of damaging your speakers, you can easily protect them with grilles.
And if you sit on your desk you sit in close nearfield to the speakers. In this situation, there is no alternative in using wide dispersion speakers. Otherwise, the smallest change in listening position will change the sound dramatically.
And if you sit on your desk you sit in close nearfield to the speakers. In this situation, there is no alternative in using wide dispersion speakers. Otherwise, the smallest change in listening position will change the sound dramatically.
My desk currently has piles of papers and books, a box, various electrical gadgets, mouse, keyboard, laptop,... which will block sound from drivers at desktop level. Speakers without grilles would get damaged pretty quickly.
Easy answer : Sennheiser Canada Inc. - MX 980
Seriously decent sound reproduction. IMO 'easily' better than a wee box.
Tangible bonus of no Audiophilia paraphenailia cluttering up ones' valuable workspace area.
Seriously decent sound reproduction. IMO 'easily' better than a wee box.
Tangible bonus of no Audiophilia paraphenailia cluttering up ones' valuable workspace area.
Bare,
that is another way to look at the problem at the desk, I just couldn't ever get use to in ear headphones. If I am going to use headphones they are over the ear and not in it. But I do appreciate all of the feedback. Some is generic and some is very specific as to what you think the problems or opportunities are for nearfield loudspeakers. I am paying very close attention to what is being said here.
Steven
that is another way to look at the problem at the desk, I just couldn't ever get use to in ear headphones. If I am going to use headphones they are over the ear and not in it. But I do appreciate all of the feedback. Some is generic and some is very specific as to what you think the problems or opportunities are for nearfield loudspeakers. I am paying very close attention to what is being said here.
Steven
The problem with headphones for stereo recordings is the sound quality. The in-head sources and complete absence of reflections is quite unnatural and a source of irritation leading to fatigue. If a person perseveres with headphones they will adapt and overcome the irritation but the sound will remain unnatural.
What can work is converting the stereo signal to binaural, adding the room reflections and using a head-tracker to stabilize the sources. Still leaves issues with bass but was a system I could have lived with when it was demonstrated to me a few years ago. Would make a nice DIY project.
I've been answering this question for myself and have examined almost all of the Cons listed above. My thoughts
Mid/high driver(s) at ear level....so given a standard desk height, that should put the drivers roughly 16" above the top and reduce destructive early reflections...
Want directivity?.....dipole for the mid-highs...my choice would be B&G neo3 above Neo8 or if the budget allows, Neo10 on a narrow open baffle.
4-5" woofer with a sealed f3 around 80hz for the base/bottom.
Cross the mid as low as you can, considering reality where power handling is concerned.....how loud will you really be using these at a desk?
8-10" sealed sub below the desk with an F3 somewhere in the low 30's......boundary and cavity gains under the desk will do the rest.
In a nutshell....mini Martin Logans so to speak.
Mid/high driver(s) at ear level....so given a standard desk height, that should put the drivers roughly 16" above the top and reduce destructive early reflections...
Want directivity?.....dipole for the mid-highs...my choice would be B&G neo3 above Neo8 or if the budget allows, Neo10 on a narrow open baffle.
4-5" woofer with a sealed f3 around 80hz for the base/bottom.
Cross the mid as low as you can, considering reality where power handling is concerned.....how loud will you really be using these at a desk?
8-10" sealed sub below the desk with an F3 somewhere in the low 30's......boundary and cavity gains under the desk will do the rest.
In a nutshell....mini Martin Logans so to speak.
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