diyAudio

diyAudio (https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/index.php)
-   Multi-Way (https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/)
-   -   Humble Statement (https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/113631-humble-statement.html)

wigginjs 14th December 2007 01:28 PM

Humble Statement
 
Wow, what a project! I really love the look of the Martin Coltrane and this is almost a spot on replica as far as looks go. I also think this may be the first project Tony has published that uses a parallel crossover. I'd love to build one of these, but I feel like the woodworking would be over my head and the cost of the drivers alone would push my budget to uncomfortable levels. Who knows though! I'd love to hear others comments on this. Any experience with the Accuton T6-90 midrange Tony uses?

An externally hosted image should be here but it no longer works. Please upload images instead of linking to them to prevent this.


Humble Statement

sdclc126 14th December 2007 10:35 PM

Tony continues to outdo himself.

I haven't seen a lot of DIY projects with the Accuton drivers - I think people are balking at the cost; only one driver tested by Zaph so far:

"Accuton C23-6 ($225) - Very expensive ceramic dome tweeter. Slightly ragged response and related energy storage issue at 4kHz. Mild top octave droop. Excellent 2nd order HD. Exceptional tall order HD above 3Khz, but high 3rd order HD below. If you can fix the response curve in the crossover, this is generally a good tweeter. There are better in this group however, and for less money."

Pan 15th December 2007 11:13 AM

Zaph writes: high 3rd order below..

but still the C23 measures as good as or better than all the other drivers. C23 seems like the best performer of the bunch so in some way one could say the price is justified in contrast to the other drivers that are more costly but has worse performance.


/Peter

sdclc126 15th December 2007 04:29 PM

Hmm...

At the end of the quote above he says "There are better in this group however, and for less money."

Anyway mOtion's question was about the T6-90 so I don't want to take the thread in another direction.

wigginjs 16th December 2007 04:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sdclc126
Hmm...

At the end of the quote above he says "There are better in this group however, and for less money."

Anyway mOtion's question was about the T6-90 so I don't want to take the thread in another direction.


I'm really just interested in hearing people's opinions on this speaker in general.

MJL21193 16th December 2007 04:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by m0tion

I'm really just interested in hearing people's opinions on this speaker in general.


My personal opinion is that they are not very nice looking. I have the utmost respect for Tony's work, but these do not appeal to me at all.
Well built, certainly.

He references the Andromeda, with the idea that these will be a worthy heir as a no compromise design. I've never been a big fan of the Wilson Audio "Cylon Centurion" style speaker but I think, given the driver choices, the Andromeda has this one beat. His own measurements (for the Andromeda) show a fuller bottom end.

kceenav 16th December 2007 10:14 AM

Hello,

regarding the looks of the "C 173N-T6-90": the front is not quite to my taste either, but the back certainly has some seriously "sexy" high-tech-appeal ... :cool: : nice photo of side and backside

I am considering to buy this driver for its (relatively) high efficiency and the very stiff yet well-dampened cone.

Somewhat irritating though are the measurements on the "Statement" website and the curve presented with the distortion-diagrams in this PDF.
There seems to be some resonance-phenomenon around 1 kHz that can not be "detected" in the normal frequency-plot (due to excessive smoothing I'd suppose..).

Of course, if my assumptions are correct so far, this must not necessarily mean a significant degradation in sound-quality. But at the price in question - and in the context of those ceramic domes - even such a "minor" imperfection seems difficult to accept to me ...


Regards,

Bernd

crazyhub 16th December 2007 11:59 AM

Quote:

I'm really just interested in hearing people's opinions on this speaker in general.
I often exchange mails with Tony and listened to a few of its designs and I feel convenient to say that he favours the homogeneity of the different fr ranges (what he names "oneness") and also the most natural midrange presentation; The underhung VC and others specs ( notably its large SD) of the T6-90 helps in this matter but didn't mate perfectly the Utopia Be which is mostly a top octave than a low octave tweeter.
IMHO, an interesting thing to notice is the use of these accuton ceramic drivers which give at the same time a very uncolored but very balanced sound if correctly used in the speaker design. This caracter is also present in the Soup (all accuton drivers) when I compare it to my Modulus speakers (paper bass and mid). I would be currious to hear if the Statement is as homogeneous than his previous designs using 2.5-way series/parallel filters.;)

crazyhub 16th December 2007 12:12 PM

Quote:

There seems to be some resonance-phenomenon around 1 kHz that can not be "detected" in the normal frequency-plot (due to excessive smoothing I'd suppose..).
Quote:

Of course, if my assumptions are correct so far, this must not necessarily mean a significant degradation in sound-quality.
Firstly: Be sure Tony perfectly knows his matter and could suppress this emphasis with a noch or whatever other technic if it gaves a sound degradation.
Secondly: +/- 2db around 1Khz and more of a dip than a peak and no related distortion at these fr on the graph...;)

Pan 18th December 2007 04:48 PM

Unrfortunately you can not surpress non linear distortion with a notch filter or any other linear compensation.

I suspect there are some resonant behaviour in the spider that casues a slight increase in output and distortion. Still 0.3% THD at 100-105dB is respectable.

Second: +/-2dB in such a small range is more than necessary and not acceptable in a top grade speaker IMHO.

He mentions something about the shape of the internals of the midrange enclosure and that most of the rear energy is killed. Well the irregularities are of such small dimension that they hardly have an effect at all for the midrange. Mineral/glas wool would be a better material do treat this energy.

Of course I don't know the origin of these midrange ripples but it come from the inside or the outside of the box for sure. Hmm, the baffles looks like they are very thick.. wonder if the inside is chamfered..? Otherwise problems may show up from mounting the driver in a "tunnel" which can casue distortiond and possibly also deviation from a flat frequency response.


Very nice work though and I'm sure it performs very well.



/Peter


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:14 PM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 17.65%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2020 diyAudio

Wiki