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Electrostatic Speaker and Amplifier Clipping
Electrostatic Speaker and Amplifier Clipping
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Old 5th August 2020, 10:04 AM   #11
jan.didden is offline jan.didden  Europe
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This is a good summary. It doesn't help the OP diddly of course.

Jan
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Old 5th August 2020, 11:01 AM   #12
jan.didden is offline jan.didden  Europe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Correa View Post
Hello, I have a pair of Martin Logan SL3 with an Advance Acoustic Map-407 amplifier. The problem begins with my old Technics SU-V9 amplifier when at reasonably high volumes when a high frecuency was played the amplifier instantly made clipping and shut itself down being an extremely dissatisfying problem. So I thought that it was power handling problems so I bought a monstrous Advance Acosutic Map-407 (400 watts per channel in 4 ohm) (ML SL3 have 4 ohm) so I was happy then Iíve put a song that i always use for testing speakers (Private Investigations from Dire Straits) and when the best part of the song begins with the cymbals and drums are punches AGAIN! the amplifier get clipped and shuted down the sound at the same volume that the Technics made.

Itís extremely frustrating and I canít find the problem so Iím begging for help to solve this problems.

My question is.. Where the hell is the problem??
Reading this again, are you saying that BOTH amplifiers are equipped with a shut down system and BOTH shut down the same way? Again, is it not logical to assume that the CLS shuts down?

Jan
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Old 5th August 2020, 05:12 PM   #13
Andersonix is offline Andersonix  Sweden
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Electrostatic Speaker and Amplifier Clipping
Is it an early version SL3? Those had electrolytic caps in the ESL xo and eq which I would be suspicious of and replace with film caps, like later SL3 (see progression in pic).
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File Type: jpg ML SL3 progress.jpg (170.5 KB, 106 views)
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Old 5th August 2020, 07:31 PM   #14
jan.didden is offline jan.didden  Europe
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The SL3 xover has a 'music sense' and 'high voltage detect' circuit which could cause issues, especially since it happens with different amps all the same.

The 'music sense' appears to switch the HV supply on and off, could mean normal and lower volume.
Does the LED change intensity when it shuts down?

Any other ideas?

Jan
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File Type: jpg ML SL3 HV PS.jpg (608.9 KB, 90 views)
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File Type: pdf sl3 crossover schematic.pdf (13.1 KB, 6 views)
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Old 6th August 2020, 12:36 AM   #15
Max Correa is offline Max Correa  Chile
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jan.didden View Post
Reading this again, are you saying that BOTH amplifiers are equipped with a shut down system and BOTH shut down the same way? Again, is it not logical to assume that the CLS shuts down?
Exactly, that is the weridest thing, considering that both amps are completely different, one from 2008 and the other from the 80s, and the same problem

I find very weard that a speaker have a protection system
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Old 6th August 2020, 12:52 AM   #16
Max Correa is offline Max Correa  Chile
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andersonix View Post
Is it an early version SL3? Those had electrolytic caps in the ESL xo and eq which I would be suspicious of and replace with film caps, like later SL3 (see progression in pic).
My crossover is exactly the same as the one in the last photo (right one). So is the new one. That transformer that you have in that crossover is for 220 volts? because I have the same one in my crossover and my outlets are 220 volts

Thanks for your answer!
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Old 6th August 2020, 01:03 AM   #17
Max Correa is offline Max Correa  Chile
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jan.didden View Post
The SL3 xover has a 'music sense' and 'high voltage detect' circuit which could cause issues, especially since it happens with different amps all the same.

The 'music sense' appears to switch the HV supply on and off, could mean normal and lower volume.
Does the LED change intensity when it shuts down?

Any other ideas?

Jan
I'm going to check the red led light, thanks for you help! and if the speaker have that system, how can i solve this problem?

thanks for your help
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Old 6th August 2020, 02:39 AM   #18
mattstat is offline mattstat  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Correa View Post
that is the weridest thing, considering that both amps are completely different, one from 2008 and the other from the 80s, and the same problem
I had two low-current receivers from different manufacturers I previously used for testing. Both of them exhibited the behavior you describe when driving difficult electrostatic speaker loads. They behaved normally at low to moderate levels, but playing too loud tripped their protection circuits.

Of course I can't say for certain it's your problem, but what you describe isn't that abnormal.
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Old 6th August 2020, 06:38 AM   #19
jan.didden is offline jan.didden  Europe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Correa View Post
I'm going to check the red led light, thanks for you help! and if the speaker have that system, how can i solve this problem?

thanks for your help
What I was wondering, do both channels do exactly the same at the same time? Or is it a single channel that shuts down?
If both channels do the same at the same time, that would point to the amps.
I looked for some info about your amps regarding protection circuits, whether they are actually included, but there's no mention of it I could find.

Jan

Last edited by jan.didden; 6th August 2020 at 06:41 AM.
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Old 6th August 2020, 08:37 PM   #20
Andersonix is offline Andersonix  Sweden
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Electrostatic Speaker and Amplifier Clipping
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Correa View Post
My crossover is exactly the same as the one in the last photo (right one). So is the new one. That transformer that you have in that crossover is for 220 volts? because I have the same one in my crossover and my outlets are 220 volts

Thanks for your answer!
USA models of SL3 (and other MLs) have a gray-market discouraging (private exporting) mains frequency-sensing circuit which wants to see the actual 60Hz, or it acts up....(and I think you have 50Hz in Chile?)
Bolserst discussed it in one of our threads and how to defeat it. Here:
Martin Logan Montis Power Supply Board Help

Last edited by Andersonix; 6th August 2020 at 08:44 PM.
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