Why aren't ESLs dynamic?

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I don't think R&D is required. It's all very clear to the community. To get more excursion, you need more diaphragm spacing, which means you need (a lot!) more high voltage biasing and high voltage signal to get that excursion happen. You want to half the lower limit, you need to double the spacing etc etc.

There's no theoretical limit, it is all practical. Think Beveridge squared, with a power supply and amplifier system rivaling the CERN installation.
If you are willing to spend the effort and money there's no reason why you couldn't get any dynamic range you want.

Jan
I didn't imagine it was such a tall order. I don't want to build a rocket, double excursion would be just fine thank you very much:D
 
No comments on the Magnepan link I attached?
Well, here they have a much more complete one because it addresses different brands and the difference between technologies
Being young, when I wanted to find out something specific, I had to start a long pilgrimage, phone friends, go to some public library, etc., etc., And most of the time I couldn't find what I was looking for.
Now, we all have access to a lot of information immediately with the internet. But it seems that for many it is too much work to read. I mention it amicably, with the intention of warning, not to argue.;)

Electrostatic and Magnetostatic Speakers | HFA - The Independent Source for Audio Equipment Reviews
 
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No comments on the Magnepan link I attached?
Well, here they have a much more complete one because it addresses different brands and the difference between technologies
Being young, when I wanted to find out something specific, I had to start a long pilgrimage, phone friends, go to some public library, etc., etc., And most of the time I couldn't find what I was looking for.
Now, we all have access to a lot of information immediately with the internet. But it seems that for many it is too much work to read. I mention it amicably, with the intention of warning, not to argue.;)

Electrostatic and Magnetostatic Speakers | HFA - The Independent Source for Audio Equipment Reviews
I have been wanting to try a pair of Apogee Duetta. I did audition the Stages about 20 years ago and I remember them sounding very 'electronic'. I think it was because they were just so fast and crisp, too much leading edge.
 
Most people relate dynamic to loud. Your not going to hear 40db dynamics if the sound at -40db is too quit to hear, you need to turn the whole thing up.

Tried to compare max spl between ESLs and dynamics, could not find the spec for any of the electro stats. Do ESLs get as loud as dynamics, with out being huge?
 
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Most people relate dynamic to loud. Your not going to hear 40db dynamics if the sound at -40db is too quit to hear, you need to turn the whole thing up.

Tried to compare max spl between ESLs and dynamics, could not find the spec for any of the electro stats. Do ESLs get as loud as dynamics, with out being huge?
Subjective experience is not technically accurate. IME, they have to be massive to be LOUD. If you google Acoustat X, you will find the specs for the X and later 'Monitor 3', same speaker. Original Acoustat with the direct drive OTL mono amps. They will produce 115db at a listening position 20 ft. away. I sit 13ft. away from my Monitor 3s and easily get 112db peaks at my listening position measured with a Digitech QM1592, C weighted. It takes some pretty potent dynamic drivers to equal that.
 
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What is the definition of Dynamics in loudspeakers?

I usually hear the term Dynamic Slam. Described with hit you in the chest and or visceral impact.
Yea, tough to find some one who regularly has that experience and isn't deaf!


I would describe dynamics in a loudspeaker as mostly visceral in that you feel as well as hear the sound, being the difference from quietest to loudest passages. So clearly not as pertinent with compressed recordings.
 
I have DIY hybrid ESLs and I don't find them lacking in dynamics at all. In fact; everyone who's heard them cranked up can't believe they can play so loud with no hint of strain or distortion.

I can easily imagine full range ESLs lacking dynamics but a properly designed hybrid panel can crank out painful volume.

ESL.JPG
 
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What is the definition of Dynamics in loudspeakers?

I usually hear the term Dynamic Slam. Described with hit you in the chest and or visceral impact.

That's plain level. Make it loud enough and it moves your bowels. This has absolutely nothing to do with dynamic range.

Dynamic range is the space between the softest sound you can still hear, and the maximum undistorted output that you can have.

The softest sound is normally limited by the background noise in your listening room, and can be something like 20dB in an extremely quiet room. If the maximum undistorted output from your speaker is 120dB, you've got a dynamic range of 100dB.

Dynamic range in a good concert hall is usually around 80dB.

Jan
 
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Right but this description doesn't speak to the speaker's dynamic character whereas DMLBES' question hits exactly on the topic here. My Monitor 3's are capable of well over 100db on the bottom end but when I switch off the 2 powered subs, they leave something to be desired.
 
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Right but this description doesn't speak to the speaker's dynamic character whereas DMLBES' question hits exactly on the topic here. My Monitor 3's are capable of well over 100db on the bottom end but when I switch off the 2 powered subs, they leave something to be desired.

Well, what I wrote is not just a description, it's the definition.

So what then is 'dynamic character'??

Jan
 
"A dynamic character is a character who changes throughout the course of a story as a result of the conflicts they encounter on their journey. Some dynamic characters learn a lesson, like Harry Potter did in Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets. Some come to a new philosophical understanding of the world, such as Hamlet in the play Hamlet. Others gain maturity, like Prince Hal in the play Henry IV. Some discover flaws in their worldview, such as Sherlock Holmes in 'A Scandal in Bohemia.' Still others discover aspects of their own personality that they didn't know were there, like Neville Longbottom in Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone.

These changes that make a character dynamic are often implied rather than stated outright, so careful analysis is required to discover them."
 
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Definition of exactly what? I'm not taking you to task here, I clearly need understanding about the nature of dynamic behavior as it applies to speaker drivers. Could you please speak to the point about bottom end in my last post.

Well, I read: My Monitor 3's are capable of well over 100dB on the bottom end but when I switch off the 2 powered subs, they leave something to be desired.

... which I think means that when you switch off the subs the lows are less loud. Which explains why the subs are there in the first place - to provide more output in the low frequency range to counter the fall off of the main speakers?

Jan
 
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Well, I read: My Monitor 3's are capable of well over 100dB on the bottom end but when I switch off the 2 powered subs, they leave something to be desired.

... which I think means that when you switch off the subs the lows are less loud. Which explains why the subs are there in the first place - to provide more output in the low frequency range to counter the fall off of the main speakers?

Jan
Yes of course. But how does that relate to dynamic range?
 
"A dynamic character is a character who changes throughout the course of a story as a result of the conflicts they encounter on their journey. Some dynamic characters learn a lesson, like Harry Potter did in Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets. Some come to a new philosophical understanding of the world, such as Hamlet in the play Hamlet. Others gain maturity, like Prince Hal in the play Henry IV. Some discover flaws in their worldview, such as Sherlock Holmes in 'A Scandal in Bohemia.' Still others discover aspects of their own personality that they didn't know were there, like Neville Longbottom in Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone.

These changes that make a character dynamic are often implied rather than stated outright, so careful analysis is required to discover them."



Interesting philosophical definition applied to the vagaries of thinking in people.
Then, I just discovered that I am a dynamic human being, thank God!
And to prove it, I will not point to your thoughts as OT :D
 
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