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Multiple stacked dipole bass
Multiple stacked dipole bass
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Old 24th August 2019, 01:14 AM   #11
GBOGH is offline GBOGH
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Join Date: Mar 2019
Ok thanks,
so just a few questions if for example i have 5 12" woffers stacked as close as possible so that at max xmas they dont hit dustcap to magnet, on woofer #3 in the stack i place an extra 6" of space between it and woofer #4 i would be giving it a passive time delay?
Would i then go back to minimum spacing #4,#5 ?
Would it be best to put each woofer on a movable stand to be able to adjust their distances on the fly?
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Old 24th August 2019, 08:20 AM   #12
SoundRight is offline SoundRight  United Kingdom
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I'm a little confused how you are trying to configure these. Sounds a little over complicated!

Firstly, I would use 6 drivers in 3 pairs, in "cabinets" with angled baffles (horizontal)..or one large baffle for all 6. Problem with that is making the baffle non resonant...but baffle size will determine how much eq you need at low frequency. The vertical spacing should be kept to the minimum the drivers and cabinets will allow. For 12" drivers each "cabinet" need only be 14/15" in height which of course will also be the centre to centre driver spacing. Baffle area can be increased by increasing the horizontal dimension but around 28" for 2 x 12 would make sense. Your effective baffle area then will be something in excess of 45" x 28" for a triple stack of angled pairs. The stack will start to roll at 6dB/octave from roughly 125/150 Hz. Of course room loading will effect this as well but you could still be looking at around a maximum of 12dB of boost (at 6dB/octave) at around 30Hz which is why power handling and driver Xmax are so relevant...

At least with an open back/front cabinet you can both angle the two baffles (30deg works well) and offset the baffles on the middle cab a distance behind the top/bottom cabs to provide the small "run time" delay.

With the flat baffle you would have to apply a delay. This would also be the case with 3 identical cabs.

I'm going to use the word..Behringer!! There...I've said it. The Ultracurve has a delay function on one audio output. You could use 2 x Ultracurves, one per channel which would provide both simple to apply eq and accurate adjustable delay. An alternative is any 2 x 3/4 channel dsp lms but the Ultracurve has a simple gui and could be used in an otherwise analogue system just dedicated to the dipole bass stacks as an equaliser and delay.

I have 3 Ultracurves and they have worked faultlessly, in racks, for years. Some may ascribe a slightly thin and untidy hf performance from them on their analogue outputs but this really is not an issue at bass frequencies ...

Hope this helps.
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Old 25th August 2019, 12:05 AM   #13
GBOGH is offline GBOGH
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I would like the 10s or 12s stacked horizontal at ground level, like the first photo of the thread.
But no baffle just some kind of rings or something to hold them.
So i plan to put one behind the next until I get my desired result.
Will this work?
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Old 25th August 2019, 01:30 AM   #14
Davey is online now Davey  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBOGH View Post
I would like the 10s or 12s stacked horizontal at ground level, like the first photo of the thread.
But no baffle just some kind of rings or something to hold them.
So i plan to put one behind the next until I get my desired result.
Will this work?
You won't get any bass out of that configuration no matter how many woofers you have.
You have to create a decent acoustical distance between driver front and back radiation so you don't get complete cancellation.

Dave.
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Old 25th August 2019, 04:39 AM   #15
GBOGH is offline GBOGH
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Ok so now im really confused what enables bass in a vertical stack like the picture you put up davey?
Is the alternating side slots?
If so could i simply do the same in the horizontal stack?
Some help on what will work would be awesome.
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Old 25th August 2019, 06:32 AM   #16
SoundRight is offline SoundRight  United Kingdom
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Good luck with that....!
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Old 25th August 2019, 01:41 PM   #17
Davey is online now Davey  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBOGH View Post
Ok so now im really confused what enables bass in a vertical stack like the picture you put up davey?
Is the alternating side slots?
If so could i simply do the same in the horizontal stack?
Some help on what will work would be awesome.
Horizontal or vertical makes no difference. The vertical stack in the photo I posted could just as easily be flipped onto its side.

I suggest to start with the basics for understanding this. The simplest form of a force-cancelling dipole woofer is the Linkwitz Phoenix scheme. (Note the 19" distance that separates front and back radiation.)

Dipole Woofer

Dave.
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Old 25th August 2019, 06:43 PM   #18
digicol is offline digicol  United States
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Default No Bass

Quote:
Originally Posted by Davey View Post
You won't get any bass out of that configuration no matter how many woofers you have.
You have to create a decent acoustical distance between driver front and back radiation so you don't get complete cancellation.

Dave.
Actually, you might! Check out this guys evolution in naked dipole woofers.
Trans-Fi Audio - OB Speakers
Others have had similar results, though I think large speakers, i.e. 15-18" are the norm.
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Old 25th August 2019, 11:42 PM   #19
GBOGH is offline GBOGH
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Digicol thanks, i have had discussed that exact system with vic, and have been planning my system for a while now
.
I was hoping to stand on the shoulders of gaints and not have to start from the beginning.

I wanted maximum lower mid bass and was wanting expert help to stack maximum woffers in minimum space as adison suggested.

Anyway i guess i will just grab 4 12" and 4 10" woffers build something that I can move around and stack at diffrent lengths, combinations and try shading and time alignment and rear firing clamshelling, ext, could be fun .


Thanks to trans fi inspiration i have already purchased 4 goldwood 18s for 20 to 80hrtz they will be clamshell out of phase and be separate to main towers.


Targeted frequency for woofers yet to be purchased is 80 to 1000hrtz. Give or take a little.

Had a look at golomb ruler yesterday, and think that could be interesting to incorporate infinite baffle fullrange sparse array to a stack of dipole woofers backed up by 4 18s..

Anyone know how it could work not why they think it wont?
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Old 26th August 2019, 01:17 AM   #20
Davey is online now Davey  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digicol View Post
Actually, you might! Check out this guys evolution in naked dipole woofers.
Trans-Fi Audio - OB Speakers
Others have had similar results, though I think large speakers, i.e. 15-18" are the norm.
"Evolution"????

Dave.
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