Where do I start?

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Hi, I'm interested in building myself a nice amp, but I really have no idea where to start. First, I'm not sure what all I'll need to make. I really have never seen a high-end audio system, other than expensive receivers in the stores. I guess with an amp like an Aleph you need a preamp as well? I've built plenty of other electronics before, so making stuff is no problem.

Basically what I need to know is:
1) Do I need a preamp, and if so, which one should I build? Or should I buy one?

2) What amp should I build? I have $200-300 to spend on it, and already have the stuff for a case, and I can get heatsinks cheaply.
 
Welcome damonpip

to answer you question, yes you'll need a preamp for an Aleph or
a Zen amp.

The amp you should build is one you have the best chance of
finishing, and learning basics along the way.

I would say at the least you should go over to PassDiy.com and
read all the stuff on the Zen amps and preamps. Then decide from
there what you'd like to try. I'd say go with a Zen project, since
they are well documented and a ton of info can be had by doing
searches on this forum.

that's just my 2 cents... one thing for sure, doing the reading is
free and a good place to start! :nod: And the Gallery on PassDiy
site is inspirational too.


moe29
 
Preamp - Bride of Zen or Bride of Son of Zen (balanced BOZ)
I made the BOZ, and it is very easy to make, can't smoke it for its protection diodes, has a very nice sound. Cheap (everything cost me about €40, without trafo).
Amp - Zen v5 would be a bit expensive, so go with Zen v4. Think twice about makeing an class a amp, since they burn a lot of power - maybe you could go with some solid state amps, but that is just blasphemy on thease pages ;).
I calculated everything for this combo, and the outcome is 300$, so i'd go with that.
Happy DIY-ing!!
 
George

BZLS (not BZSL) means Balaced Zen Line Stage, i.e. a cirquit suitable to build up a preamp.
It is the same as BOSOZ (Bride of son of Zen) :D
Look at http://www.passdiy.com/pdf/balzenpre.pdf

There are also people who built this design with a ccs, they x-ed the circuit, and so on. Perform a search in this pass labs forum, and you will have enough information to build tons of preamps :D :D

Greetings, Tino
 
More Questions:

Thanks for the information Zinsula ... that makes more Zense to me now.

More questions please, since I have started typing away:

1. Which are the best threads to follow for information on making say: an Aleph-3, a Zen V4, an A75? (The Zen V4 looks pretty much self explanatory in the .pdf files, there is not a lot happening with the A75, and the Aleph-3 looks a most elusive of all. (It was easy to find a thread on the Aleph-X! :) )

2. Would I be correct if I thought that the Zen V4 still sounds and performs best with a pre-amp stage ... Bride of Zen or Bride of Son of Zen. Any preferences as regards these?

3. Even by Mr. Nelson Pass's comments, it would appear that the bass on the Zen V4 may be a bit light on or not well defined.

What is the best solution:

a. pre-amp?,
b. Zen V5 (twould appear that this is a solution, but we are no longer single ended if we go down that path), or
c. perhaps extra parallel devices in the output of the power supply to get its output impedance down.

4. I have been poking around a bit on this site looking for a feeling about comparative sound quality of the three amps mentioned above and the Aleph-X and haven't found all that much so far.

My initial impression is that knocking up a V4 with the parts from Pass DIY would be easiest to do, and probably cheapest.

With thanks and regards,
George Boles
 
Re: More Questions:

Hi,

Don't know which treads are the best, but check these out:
Penultimate Zen Hybrid (do a search on this forum)
Till's homepage: http://home.tu-clausthal.de/~tpa/

2. You would. I made the BOZ, BZLS is better, and you can make zen hybrid with the balanced input - nice option

3. That's where the preamp comes in, and lot's of uF :)

4. Some say Aleph 2 sounds the best, according to some, Aleph 5 is next, and Aleph X is crossed version of A5.

5. Go for it!
 
The one and only
Joined 2001
Paid Member
My advice is that you not be concerned about hitting
the bullseye out of the gate (I love to mix my metaphors).

Pick Anything and go ahead and do it. Don't imagine that
any project will be your final effort. Have fun with it, and don't
be afraid of anything, espeshally miskates.

Join the Fearless Do-It-Yourselfers and have a nice life.

:cool:
 
Thx to Nelson and Anorgan (!)

Thanks for the advice, Nelson and Anorgan.

This whole intellectual exercise started when I was looking for affordable high quality amplification for the tweeter or tweeter/midrange for an (as yet non-existent) active 3-way system. I was thinking about covering the bass driver with my current amp or making a 100 - 200 watt kit from Electronics Australia magazine or Silicon Chip magazine (lots of muscle, not much finesse.) The crossover was to be a Silicon Chip TL074-based Linkwitz-Riley (?) jobbie.

I am vacillating because:

1. I am a vacillator at heart: paralysis by analysis.

2. The cost of heatsinks and transformers. (As far as I can tell there is no such thing as an electrical/electronics "disposal" shop over here.)

3. If I wish to change track or improve on any current effort, the transformers are likely to be unusable (i.e. wrong voltage/inadequate wattage) and, if I re-use the heatsinks too many times, they will be so full of holes that a transistor would not sit flat or efficiently thereon. (Nelson, I had even thought about building a selection of your project "series" of Zen's perhaps proceeding onto an Aleph something-or-other, recycling the expensive parts, but the transformer problem was likely to prevent that.)

4. WAF, time involved, bringing up children, Real Life, etc.

QUESTION: Is there a solution to the apparent requirement for a myriad of various transformer voltages for this vast array of projects? I guess I could just start building, and after about three projects I would have a "full set" of transformers if I purchased 500 VA ones from the start.

Oh, one more thing which I must say, although said before: your generosity, Nelson, in putting up your ideas of all sorts for us to study and play with is, I think, stunning. And then to put up for public perusal details of recently commercial products is ... bigger than stunning! :) It certainly helps this little home-body with his plans for better stereo, which may one day come to fruition.

Forever cogitating,
George Boles.

PS... I tell a mistruth. It all started when I walked into a hifi shop after some "affordable stereo shopping", and asked if I could listen to their B&W802's. (They powered them with Macintosh solid state amps). I was flabbergasted - and nearly wept with frustration - at how GOOD they sounded, especially how rock solid and precise the stereo image was. However, knowing my wife's thoughts about even a vastly reduced price on the 802's, have decided I must try to get something like it through DIY. (My current system is 20 - 25 years old, so I have a level of wifely approval to upgrade to something "smaller" .... might have to ignore that last little bit. Sorry dear. :angel: )
 
Build the Balanced Zen Linestage (also known as BOSOZ: The Bride of Son of Zen). You will not be dissapointed. You also don't particularly need heatsinks... at least not the big aluminum extrusions, nor do you need a really large transformer.

I built one point to point over a weekend and have been pleased as can be with the results.

The good news is that you can drive just about any amplifier you may already have. Mine has seen time with a B&K ST140 and a pair of Exposure XVIII monoblocks. Next it will be drive... well, whatever I end up building. Maybe a bridged Zen-Lite?
 
"QUESTION: Is there a solution to the apparent requirement for a myriad of various transformer voltages for this vast array of projects? I guess I could just start building, and after about three projects I would have a "full set" of transformers if I purchased 500 VA ones from the start."

Order a specialy made toroid with a spectrum of voltages like: 9,15, 25, 38, 60, 150, 250. Make it 1000VA. I'm ordering that one in a few weeks. With it you can try out various amplifier projects, even those using tubes. It'll cost me about 150€. So it's not that expensive for an trafo for everything :). Do a research of what projects you want to try out (include Leech amp!), and see what voltages you need.
 
GeorgeBoles

Hello again Anorgan.

Actually, the thought of a multivoltage transformer had crossed my mind, but I did not know that such a beast existed. Good idea.

eLarson,

Thanks for advice. I downloaded the Balanced Zen Linestage and given other similar advice, I think it will be my planned pre-amp. The big heatsinks still will be necessary for a main amp though!

Regards,
George.
 
Aleph 30/ Conrad

Dear Dennis,

1. What are the advantages/disadvantages of Aleph 30. It is not written about that much.

2. Conrad heatsinks look simple, elegant and thoughtfully constructed. I imagine though that I would have to get them to make specials, though, which they would do for a fee, of course.

Their most efficient is quite small (350mm long * 150mm high) and dissipates only about 0.2degreesC/Watt, (i.e. enough for a Zen 4 in the tropics!)

Regards,
Mark W.
 
Member
Joined 2002
Paid Member
Re: Aleph 30/ Conrad

GeorgeBoles said:

1. What are the advantages/disadvantages of Aleph 30. It is not written about that much.


The A30 is a slightly modified A3 and takes advantage of the Bosoz's
XLR output. Since its power level is roughly that of a ZV4, I thought
I'd mention it.


2. Conrad heatsinks look simple, elegant and thoughtfully constructed. I imagine though that I would have to get them to make specials, though, which they would do for a fee, of course.

Their most efficient is quite small (350mm long * 150mm high) and dissipates only about 0.2degreesC/Watt, (i.e. enough for a Zen 4 in the tropics!)

Regards,
Mark W.
Do you have some special heatsink requirements?

The Conrad heatsinks look very nice and I've seen nothing but
positive comments on them. Too bad it's probably too expensive
to ship them to Canada...

Cheers,
Dennis
 
Heatsinks

Hello Dennis,

1. My heatsink requirements are the same as anyone elses except that my ambient temperature is not 20 degrees Celsius but 35 degrees Celsius in summer in my lounge room. So if I want to keep the Mosfets lasting that bit longer I need bigger heat sinks.

The largest of the standard heatsinks they sell would only just keep the mosfets of a Zen 4 at the temperatures that Nelson P. recommends.

2. I presume that the A 3 you are talking about is the Aleph 3. (Still not fully conversant with all the abbreviations you use here.)

A BOSOZ/BZLS pre-amp is actually on my hit list and a balanced Aleph 3 would, I imagine keep me contented for quite a long time.

Regards,
GB
 
George check out passdiy.com gallery.

I use Conrad heatsinks exclusively on multiples of 2 of the largest per amp...they keep the listening room cosy.

Good value transformers are available from Harbuch Electronics.

The Zen series are the least efficient except for the latter versions.

The Aleph 30 or 60 would be my recommendation for sound/practicality or for diy the Zen Enlightenment.

Ian
 
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