Thank you for sharing this tweak Bud!
Would you list the order of greatest improvement vs placement please? Where exactly should these be placed for the most effect?
Such as (1) tube socket (2) speaker ground lug etc.
Also, have you used this with a turntable cartridge? I was wondering if the further down the chain the greater the improvement as is the case with many tweaks.
Thanks again!
Would you list the order of greatest improvement vs placement please? Where exactly should these be placed for the most effect?
Such as (1) tube socket (2) speaker ground lug etc.
Also, have you used this with a turntable cartridge? I was wondering if the further down the chain the greater the improvement as is the case with many tweaks.
Thanks again!
greenvalve.
I have pools in every piece of equipment I have running. There is no "scale of benefit added" here. You are only preserving information that would otherwise be stripped from the signal and turned into noise. So, you will end up doing it to every stage of your signal chain.
1. Phono cartridges require a very small amount of dielectric, three pieces of heat shrink (HS) tubing, other than PVC, each about 0.3" long per channel. I mounted them at the interconnect to arm wire junction on the cartridge return side, not chassis ground. Affects dynamic color, opens up bass information. One pool per channel only and even this much may swamp your cartridge, after hinting how good it could be. Just remove dielectric in 0.1" amounts.
2 Tape Deck. Ditto the preamp comments to follow, with the addition of one wire per playback head return, at the PCB connection, with likely even less dielectric than used on the phono cartridge. Affects dynamic color and low level signal coherence.
For the rest, the HS tubing should be 0.6" per piece unless you have Lowther DX 4 drivers. Then those pieces should be 0.8" per piece.
3. Cd / Sacd On the ground legs of the RCA jacks as they poke through the PCB and into whatever miserable ground plane the designers were allowed to use. Returns high frequency hash to it's original information content in both. Improves dynamic color in CD. Will need as many as four pieces of the pools applied to the common L&R channel ground buss.
4. Preamp's of all kinds, DAC's included. Applied to input and out put ground buss, usually at the RCA jacks, Also can be applied to the cathode of your driver tube, on the ground side of the resistor and away from tube socket and all other HV wiring. Can and will pick up EMF from the heater wires so careful routing is needed. Affects dynamic color and low level wide band signal coherence.
5. Power amp. Ditto the preamp.
6. Speakers, you can use differing amounts for each driver with a scale of around 3 wires per bass driver, 2 for mids and 1 for tweeters. Or, you can just use one at the input ground terminal. Affects all low level information content, sometimes alarmingly.
After you have experimented with all of this I suggest you learn how to EnABL a set of drivers, so you can hear all of the benefit available. The Electron Pools are beneficial, until you get too much dielectric material, but without the basically infinite resolution provided by EnABL'd drivers, you will only get part of the story.
Don't bother with applying these things to the signal side of the electronics. Our beloved professional EE's have done a superlative job here, as you will begin to find out, as you journey through pools, to EnABL'd drivers to cables that preserve tiny information content, as content, rather than noise or phase shifted colorations, and finally to transformers that remove all trace of zero crossing distortion and phase anomalous behavior. PM me about the output transformers and cables to suit, if they interest you.
Hurry along a bit everyone, I retire in 5 years and embark upon my new life, out of a shopping cart.
Bud
I have pools in every piece of equipment I have running. There is no "scale of benefit added" here. You are only preserving information that would otherwise be stripped from the signal and turned into noise. So, you will end up doing it to every stage of your signal chain.
1. Phono cartridges require a very small amount of dielectric, three pieces of heat shrink (HS) tubing, other than PVC, each about 0.3" long per channel. I mounted them at the interconnect to arm wire junction on the cartridge return side, not chassis ground. Affects dynamic color, opens up bass information. One pool per channel only and even this much may swamp your cartridge, after hinting how good it could be. Just remove dielectric in 0.1" amounts.
2 Tape Deck. Ditto the preamp comments to follow, with the addition of one wire per playback head return, at the PCB connection, with likely even less dielectric than used on the phono cartridge. Affects dynamic color and low level signal coherence.
For the rest, the HS tubing should be 0.6" per piece unless you have Lowther DX 4 drivers. Then those pieces should be 0.8" per piece.
3. Cd / Sacd On the ground legs of the RCA jacks as they poke through the PCB and into whatever miserable ground plane the designers were allowed to use. Returns high frequency hash to it's original information content in both. Improves dynamic color in CD. Will need as many as four pieces of the pools applied to the common L&R channel ground buss.
4. Preamp's of all kinds, DAC's included. Applied to input and out put ground buss, usually at the RCA jacks, Also can be applied to the cathode of your driver tube, on the ground side of the resistor and away from tube socket and all other HV wiring. Can and will pick up EMF from the heater wires so careful routing is needed. Affects dynamic color and low level wide band signal coherence.
5. Power amp. Ditto the preamp.
6. Speakers, you can use differing amounts for each driver with a scale of around 3 wires per bass driver, 2 for mids and 1 for tweeters. Or, you can just use one at the input ground terminal. Affects all low level information content, sometimes alarmingly.
After you have experimented with all of this I suggest you learn how to EnABL a set of drivers, so you can hear all of the benefit available. The Electron Pools are beneficial, until you get too much dielectric material, but without the basically infinite resolution provided by EnABL'd drivers, you will only get part of the story.
Don't bother with applying these things to the signal side of the electronics. Our beloved professional EE's have done a superlative job here, as you will begin to find out, as you journey through pools, to EnABL'd drivers to cables that preserve tiny information content, as content, rather than noise or phase shifted colorations, and finally to transformers that remove all trace of zero crossing distortion and phase anomalous behavior. PM me about the output transformers and cables to suit, if they interest you.
Hurry along a bit everyone, I retire in 5 years and embark upon my new life, out of a shopping cart.
Bud
It's amazing how people go through such extends in try and improve sound. I must admit the ground plane is the most mysterious part of electronics. Most analysis method treat it as fixed voltage level. I think if there is a way to do analysis and treat the ground plane as floating, there are many things we can observe.
groundside electrons and the EnABL process
I have been reading this thread for a little while, and have seen some of Bud's devices at the Vancouver Island DIYfest recently. I hadn't really thought much about them, but I have a little inside information from someone I trust that the effect sare real (nobody at the 'fest, but an aquaintance). So wanted or not, here are my thoughts.
first, regarding the "electron pool" or whatever term one might wish to call it: I've been thinking regarding the back EMF produced by the voice coil in the speaker drivers. As most know (even if they haven't done any physics or math or whatever), move a coil through a magnetic field (B field), a voltage is induced, and therefore an electromotive force that impedes the flow of electrons (current, and voltage) is created. I suspect that by creating an "electron pool", there exists an oportunity to reduce the back EMF.
regarding the EnABL process and the effects heard:
Obviously the boundaries are very important, otherwise why would all the time and energy be wasted on reducing diffraction at loudspeaker enclosure boundaries? Again, I am only putting this out there for a reasonable discussion and no mud slinging (hopefully Chris and others can attest to my sense of reason and a reasonable approach to many things audio).
Consider the $1.20 "trick" Sam Tellig stated in Stereophile several years ago. Take two quarters and place them on the front corners of a loudspeaker (just rest them there, no need for adhesive). Now put a dime inbetween the two quarters (even American coins will work!). Repeat for the other side. Listen. Remove the coins. Listen some more.Replace the coins. Listen. Come to your own conclusions.
Now ask a friend (audio buddy type) and do the same thing, but don't tell him what you're doing (ask him to close his eyes, or have the coins in place before he enters the room). Put on some tunes and listen.
Thinking back to quantum mechanics and boundary conditions and solutions of a wave function, it is obvious what the EnABL process is doing. Basically you are "perturbing" the wave as it hits a boundary and either scattering the diffracted waves in a uniform matter or dampening them out at the boundary. Either way it seems to me that the "time smear" reduction is really the control of unwanted diffraction. Period.
Maybe I'm wrong, but to me this seems like common sense.
Else how would Shun Mook and Mpingo and other well documented tuning devices "work" ? Just a thought.
I have been reading this thread for a little while, and have seen some of Bud's devices at the Vancouver Island DIYfest recently. I hadn't really thought much about them, but I have a little inside information from someone I trust that the effect sare real (nobody at the 'fest, but an aquaintance). So wanted or not, here are my thoughts.
first, regarding the "electron pool" or whatever term one might wish to call it: I've been thinking regarding the back EMF produced by the voice coil in the speaker drivers. As most know (even if they haven't done any physics or math or whatever), move a coil through a magnetic field (B field), a voltage is induced, and therefore an electromotive force that impedes the flow of electrons (current, and voltage) is created. I suspect that by creating an "electron pool", there exists an oportunity to reduce the back EMF.
regarding the EnABL process and the effects heard:
Obviously the boundaries are very important, otherwise why would all the time and energy be wasted on reducing diffraction at loudspeaker enclosure boundaries? Again, I am only putting this out there for a reasonable discussion and no mud slinging (hopefully Chris and others can attest to my sense of reason and a reasonable approach to many things audio).
Consider the $1.20 "trick" Sam Tellig stated in Stereophile several years ago. Take two quarters and place them on the front corners of a loudspeaker (just rest them there, no need for adhesive). Now put a dime inbetween the two quarters (even American coins will work!). Repeat for the other side. Listen. Remove the coins. Listen some more.Replace the coins. Listen. Come to your own conclusions.
Now ask a friend (audio buddy type) and do the same thing, but don't tell him what you're doing (ask him to close his eyes, or have the coins in place before he enters the room). Put on some tunes and listen.
Thinking back to quantum mechanics and boundary conditions and solutions of a wave function, it is obvious what the EnABL process is doing. Basically you are "perturbing" the wave as it hits a boundary and either scattering the diffracted waves in a uniform matter or dampening them out at the boundary. Either way it seems to me that the "time smear" reduction is really the control of unwanted diffraction. Period.
Maybe I'm wrong, but to me this seems like common sense.
Else how would Shun Mook and Mpingo and other well documented tuning devices "work" ? Just a thought.
Nanook,
Your surmise on electron pools stands up for speakers but only, I think, for the E Field portion of wave propagation. However, take the same approach and move back through the amplification chain. The very same "sort" of effects are found in all of the pieces in the puzzle.
I am looking for a way to explore what is going on quite frankly. Not just because of "improvements" in sound quality, but because I am using some pretty similar concepts in my audio transformer designs.
To wit, using wire and dielectrics with differing constants, to apparently super populate the dielectric coupling barrier between primary and secondary coils. I would like to find a way to look at these super population events, if indeed that is what they are, outside of the coil. This is an E Field "circuit" I am discussing here, though between every electrostatic moment those same electron "positions" flow as current, until the next electrostatic moment, that allows for a vector change in the field event.
For the EnABL patterns, I agree. I am using controlled perturbation and a "shock wave" approach to loft the area of energy transform from transverse wave to compression, up off of the usual boundary layer constraints, with a controlled turbulence that disallows reflection, diffraction and their attendant standing waves, including Raleigh waves.
Definitely not damping them out however. More like flinging the energy out of the boundary layer, in an area above the portion of the boundary layer where the typical transform process occurs. A layer, perhaps, where there is much less reason for that energy to transform in a less than coherent fashion.
Bud
Your surmise on electron pools stands up for speakers but only, I think, for the E Field portion of wave propagation. However, take the same approach and move back through the amplification chain. The very same "sort" of effects are found in all of the pieces in the puzzle.
I am looking for a way to explore what is going on quite frankly. Not just because of "improvements" in sound quality, but because I am using some pretty similar concepts in my audio transformer designs.
To wit, using wire and dielectrics with differing constants, to apparently super populate the dielectric coupling barrier between primary and secondary coils. I would like to find a way to look at these super population events, if indeed that is what they are, outside of the coil. This is an E Field "circuit" I am discussing here, though between every electrostatic moment those same electron "positions" flow as current, until the next electrostatic moment, that allows for a vector change in the field event.
For the EnABL patterns, I agree. I am using controlled perturbation and a "shock wave" approach to loft the area of energy transform from transverse wave to compression, up off of the usual boundary layer constraints, with a controlled turbulence that disallows reflection, diffraction and their attendant standing waves, including Raleigh waves.
Definitely not damping them out however. More like flinging the energy out of the boundary layer, in an area above the portion of the boundary layer where the typical transform process occurs. A layer, perhaps, where there is much less reason for that energy to transform in a less than coherent fashion.
Bud
Non loudspeaker thoughts...
Bud:
I hadn't considered the non loudspeaker connetions yet, I am trying to understand one thing at a time
I do however recall the idea of connecting all componnents in a system together with wire so that a common "ground " could be utilised. I am talking about chassis grounds in relation to one another, so that floating grounds and the potential differences were reduced or removed.
so I think I need a little time to digest the non loudspeaker connections, and a possible explaination.
Bud:
I hadn't considered the non loudspeaker connetions yet, I am trying to understand one thing at a time
I do however recall the idea of connecting all componnents in a system together with wire so that a common "ground " could be utilised. I am talking about chassis grounds in relation to one another, so that floating grounds and the potential differences were reduced or removed.
so I think I need a little time to digest the non loudspeaker connections, and a possible explaination.
Nordic,
Check out post #40 of this thread. The picture shows two Electron Pools. One finished and all dressed up in cotton tube. The soldered wire you see protruding to the left of the yellow shrink tube is both ends of a piece of wire that is exactly like the bare wire coil below it. Same length etc. However, the enclosed loop has three small 15mm long pieces of shrink tubing, spaced fairly evenly along the loop of wire and fully shrunk down tight. These pieces of shrink tubing are not shown in this picture.
For a circuit drawing for placement, take almost any circuit diagram and right where they are showing the outer ground portion of an RCA connector, draw a loop with a pencil. Make it looks sort of like a sack and put both ends on the trace that hooks up to the outer RCA symbol in the circuit diagram. This would also be be a correct drawing convention for the type of placement for speaker output connections, speaker ground return connections at the box and attached directly to the minus lug of an individual driver.
It is not necessary to have the cotton braided tube for the loop to work.
Now, everyone here that is experimenting with these loops is using some piece of wire different from mine. Some are longer and have more plastic dielectric, with a higher dielectric constant than shrink tubing, and they sound horrible.
All that have experienced this have been surprised, not by how bad their system suddenly sounded, but that there was any change at all!
Then, these folks have shortened the length of wire and removed more dielectric plastic coating to increase the bare wire to coated wire ratio. After some experiments with this, they discover the amount of wire length and bare to covered wire ratio, that works in their system and makes the system sound better, rather than worse.
Some other folks in your hemisphere, but out by OZ, have just taken some magnet wire and folded it up to a bundle with a specific length, cut open all of the loops, or not, and solder'd them together on the ends. Then they placed various plastic dielectrics on the cable they made, until they fond a combination that not only made a difference but sounded either better or worse, by a definite amount.
That's really all there is too it. No other secret sauce or incantations needed, though cursing is always a useful tool, when electrons are involved.
Bud
Check out post #40 of this thread. The picture shows two Electron Pools. One finished and all dressed up in cotton tube. The soldered wire you see protruding to the left of the yellow shrink tube is both ends of a piece of wire that is exactly like the bare wire coil below it. Same length etc. However, the enclosed loop has three small 15mm long pieces of shrink tubing, spaced fairly evenly along the loop of wire and fully shrunk down tight. These pieces of shrink tubing are not shown in this picture.
For a circuit drawing for placement, take almost any circuit diagram and right where they are showing the outer ground portion of an RCA connector, draw a loop with a pencil. Make it looks sort of like a sack and put both ends on the trace that hooks up to the outer RCA symbol in the circuit diagram. This would also be be a correct drawing convention for the type of placement for speaker output connections, speaker ground return connections at the box and attached directly to the minus lug of an individual driver.
It is not necessary to have the cotton braided tube for the loop to work.
Now, everyone here that is experimenting with these loops is using some piece of wire different from mine. Some are longer and have more plastic dielectric, with a higher dielectric constant than shrink tubing, and they sound horrible.
All that have experienced this have been surprised, not by how bad their system suddenly sounded, but that there was any change at all!
Then, these folks have shortened the length of wire and removed more dielectric plastic coating to increase the bare wire to coated wire ratio. After some experiments with this, they discover the amount of wire length and bare to covered wire ratio, that works in their system and makes the system sound better, rather than worse.
Some other folks in your hemisphere, but out by OZ, have just taken some magnet wire and folded it up to a bundle with a specific length, cut open all of the loops, or not, and solder'd them together on the ends. Then they placed various plastic dielectrics on the cable they made, until they fond a combination that not only made a difference but sounded either better or worse, by a definite amount.
That's really all there is too it. No other secret sauce or incantations needed, though cursing is always a useful tool, when electrons are involved.
Bud
"quantum mechanics" in audio, etc...
beau2317:
I was only relating my exposure to the solutions of wave equations, and boundary conditions that exist (and solutions that take the boundary conditions into consideration). That is where most of my experience has been , so sorry for the reference to quantum mechanics.
To me it is common sense. To you it could be "spaceballs" or far-fetched or whatever, if you have never considered the solutions of wave equations at boundaries.
I agree that the word "quantum" is way over used (really it only means to quantify in whole numbers..eg: energy levels in an atomic system).
As far as quantum mechanics in audio, I agree too. Generally people try to explain "unexplainable" things in terms of quantum mechanics, when they may not have the basic understanding of what it really is. And snake oil sales seem to continue...and religion.
I can however tell you that the boundary conditions and macro events are easy to observe and hear. Nice thing is that Bud isn't "selling" anything (ok, a few inches of wire to those that have asked ...).
If this were not the case regarding boundary conditions (EnABL procedure), then pretty much all boundary dampening or perturbing accessories would not have any effect , as no one could hear the difference. The $1.20 "trick" via Sam Tellig will cost you $0.00 net to try (you get to keep the coins, because they were already yours). If that were the case I cannot believe that Mpingo, and Shun Mook would not have been found out and raked across the coals in the audio press.
Attention to all details can make a good system better and a great system bad. You be the judge. And remember that almost all great discoveries in science (ok, well ALOT) have been serendipidous.
So please don't take any of this too seriously. If you or your sensibilities are offended by anything I have stated, I'll gladly offer up a sincere apology. But really, why not relax, try some of this yourself, and come to your own conclusions in your system? It's pretty much free to try.
stew
beau2317:
I was only relating my exposure to the solutions of wave equations, and boundary conditions that exist (and solutions that take the boundary conditions into consideration). That is where most of my experience has been , so sorry for the reference to quantum mechanics.
To me it is common sense. To you it could be "spaceballs" or far-fetched or whatever, if you have never considered the solutions of wave equations at boundaries.
I agree that the word "quantum" is way over used (really it only means to quantify in whole numbers..eg: energy levels in an atomic system).
As far as quantum mechanics in audio, I agree too. Generally people try to explain "unexplainable" things in terms of quantum mechanics, when they may not have the basic understanding of what it really is. And snake oil sales seem to continue...and religion.
I can however tell you that the boundary conditions and macro events are easy to observe and hear. Nice thing is that Bud isn't "selling" anything (ok, a few inches of wire to those that have asked ...).
If this were not the case regarding boundary conditions (EnABL procedure), then pretty much all boundary dampening or perturbing accessories would not have any effect , as no one could hear the difference. The $1.20 "trick" via Sam Tellig will cost you $0.00 net to try (you get to keep the coins, because they were already yours). If that were the case I cannot believe that Mpingo, and Shun Mook would not have been found out and raked across the coals in the audio press.
Attention to all details can make a good system better and a great system bad. You be the judge. And remember that almost all great discoveries in science (ok, well ALOT) have been serendipidous.
So please don't take any of this too seriously. If you or your sensibilities are offended by anything I have stated, I'll gladly offer up a sincere apology. But really, why not relax, try some of this yourself, and come to your own conclusions in your system? It's pretty much free to try.
stew
Neat thing about QM is that everything is made of these interactions, even your home audio and your humble opinion. You cannot actually overstate it's importance, since there would be no reality to make statements about or with, without it.
The real discussion needs to take place about what level of influence, acts we foolishly perpetrate, have upon those QM events. And, just which portions of which effects are attributable to our influence on the QM events of our local reality.
Make no mistake, just because the events we are fooling with look big or are hidden in boxes, we are having a profound QM influence, at the QM effective level, in our listening rooms, IMHO. We are just not able to directly cause an event, that is not already available within the QM event range, allowed around here.
Bud
Well yes I realize that, but it's also true that not many quantum mechanical effects show themselves in macroscopic things. QM essentially relates to sub-microspcopic things.
I admit I don't understand QM fully, as much as someone with say a physics degree would, but I do have an electronics engineering degree so I am not clueless either.
But I also think that most if not all effects in home audio electronics can be understood using conventional theory and not resorting to QM.
As for my own system, I did try this but could not hear any difference, positive or negative.
Ah, why then you need a few ounces o me magical polishing compound to get your system all QM smooth n shiny... just sign here and here and here, we will deliver your QM polishing compound and support cloth tomorrow....
Truly, I am quite suspicious about the effects of these loops of wire. Makes no sense at all to me, and I really only tried it out because of some other things I have been running R&D programs on, for both audio transformers and ultra high speed switch mode power transformers. I actually tried the loop, while tying to isolate the cause of the lack of some expected energy storage effects I was not seeing in coils and cables. This after getting deeply into some explorations into the dielectric circuit, that is always treated as a lump sum parameter, in transformer design.
It is difficult to ask for help with this sort of device, due to the lingering trauma from the "Cable Performance Wars" that apparently raged in past times.
If you want to look at it in any other locations other than a speaker box, definitely start at the ground buss of your CD players preamplifier, likely at the RCA female jacks into the PCB.
For me this was quite a profound change, but I have one of the dirt cheap Sony CD/SACD comparison units, from a few years back.
Bud
Well my DAC is home built, and the PCBs are mounted on a huge copper PCB ground plane covering the whole of the bottom of the case, so I am not sure adding some small wire will help as it already has a very large ground plane. (And it sounds awesome already
But I will be trying some more experiments in future.
But I will be trying some more experiments in future.
beau2317
I suspect you are correct about that ground plane not needing anything. I was and am convinced that this all started up, and was effective, only because most commercial equipment has such a miserable ground plane. Certainly true of the Sony and also true of my home brewed point to point wired preamp and the semi commercial Wright Sound SE power amps in my system.
I don't have hum and noise issues, but whatever portion of a good ground plane acts to keep low threshold capable electrons local, appears to be provided by the loops. I did yack about this earlier in this thread and c2cthomas provided some papers written on ground plane explorations at that time. Unfortunately no one with real EE chops was willing to comment at that point. I am a magnetician, so my parochial knowledge of electrical circuit intricacies wont allow me to pursue a serious investigation into the possible, multi use, of grounds above earthy.
Offer spoken of early in the thread still stands too.
Bud
I suspect you are correct about that ground plane not needing anything. I was and am convinced that this all started up, and was effective, only because most commercial equipment has such a miserable ground plane. Certainly true of the Sony and also true of my home brewed point to point wired preamp and the semi commercial Wright Sound SE power amps in my system.
I don't have hum and noise issues, but whatever portion of a good ground plane acts to keep low threshold capable electrons local, appears to be provided by the loops. I did yack about this earlier in this thread and c2cthomas provided some papers written on ground plane explorations at that time. Unfortunately no one with real EE chops was willing to comment at that point. I am a magnetician, so my parochial knowledge of electrical circuit intricacies wont allow me to pursue a serious investigation into the possible, multi use, of grounds above earthy.
Offer spoken of early in the thread still stands too.
Bud
beau, try this...
the "$1.20 trick". we have quarter dollar coins here in good old canuck land... and dimes. Not sure what the closest coins in Oz would be.
but you need 4 larger coins and 2 smaller ones. Do you have box loudspeakers? If so place 2 of the larger coins on the top front edge of your loudspeakers. place one of the smaller coins between them. Do the same for the other loudspeaker. Listen. remove the coins. Listen some more. add the coins... and come to your own conclusions. You could also try this on equipment enclosures (I haven't).
use a stethescope and "listen" to the enclosures as well. Again , come to your own conclusions. (don't go buy a stethescope for this, see if you can beg, borrow or steal one for temporary use).
Obviously if more technical tools were available to us, we could do analysis of the enclosures using waterfall plots, and inferometry to have a "look" at the enclosures, particularly at the box bouindaries in relation to specific frequencies prior to treatment and after.
Hm.. I wonder if a piezo attached to a loudspeaker could be used to "measure" the effects (Vance Dickenson suggested they could be used to do "relative' measurements"),
I was in no way trying to be offensive to you, so please accept my apology.
the "$1.20 trick". we have quarter dollar coins here in good old canuck land... and dimes. Not sure what the closest coins in Oz would be.
but you need 4 larger coins and 2 smaller ones. Do you have box loudspeakers? If so place 2 of the larger coins on the top front edge of your loudspeakers. place one of the smaller coins between them. Do the same for the other loudspeaker. Listen. remove the coins. Listen some more. add the coins... and come to your own conclusions. You could also try this on equipment enclosures (I haven't).
use a stethescope and "listen" to the enclosures as well. Again , come to your own conclusions. (don't go buy a stethescope for this, see if you can beg, borrow or steal one for temporary use).
Obviously if more technical tools were available to us, we could do analysis of the enclosures using waterfall plots, and inferometry to have a "look" at the enclosures, particularly at the box bouindaries in relation to specific frequencies prior to treatment and after.
Hm.. I wonder if a piezo attached to a loudspeaker could be used to "measure" the effects (Vance Dickenson suggested they could be used to do "relative' measurements"),
I was in no way trying to be offensive to you, so please accept my apology.
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